New Doosan DEM 4000

[prime_mover]

Awesome.

Let us know how the DEM 4000 performs with 3d surfacing.

 

[LockNut]

I have my DEM 4000 in a residential garage and find the air compressor automatic drain and unloader noises way more annoying than the mill noises. I think I will change the drain to manual operation and try to muffle the unloader outlet. It would be nice if the DEM spindle air curtain timed out after a certain period of idle, as it is an energy suck by forcing the compressor to cycle. By way of contrast, my old Deckel FP2NC with worn gears in the transmission required earmuffs for speeds above 2000 RPM.

Please contact your dealer. We have a fix for this and I hope it can be done on the DEM. So far, the DNM's have been getting the brunt of this question.

 

[Djstorm100]

Please contact your dealer. We have a fix for this and I hope it can be done on the DEM. So far, the DNM's have been getting the brunt of this question.

Paul do you have the answer for the DNM's I asked my AE during training.

 

[Miller846]

Hope all went well with testing. Did you manage to take any pictures of test parts? Also, how do you find the noise level of the machine in the garage space you have while operating?

Appreciate any feedback. There isn't much out there regrading videos of the machine operating.

Thanks

Here are some more part photos off the DEM. Ran our first stainless part today as well on it and it’s got loads of rigidity!

 

[LockNut]

Paul do you have the answer for the DNM's I asked my AE during training.

I know for sure this involves a ladder change. And I did hear that a solenoid being added might be included in this also. Any dealer should be able to get exact answers from the factory. The ladder change involves including a timer to the spindle air to only run it when the spindle is running and for a certain amount of time after the spindle stops. Me personally, I am not aware of the exact details since this would be a service issue. I am not service. I don't mean to minimize my involvement but this is a "new" issue and is just now getting ironed out. There was some push back since this involves an expensive spindle and we want to make sure of the longevity. Have your dealer speak with Michael An.

 

[hawkprecision]

Here are some more part photos off the DEM. Ran our first stainless part today as well on it and it’s got loads of rigidity!

Looks a decent performing machine judging by those photos. The parts are tidy. Have you tried doing some 3d surfacing?

 

[Djstorm100]

I know for sure this involves a ladder change. And I did hear that a solenoid being added might be included in this also. Any dealer should be able to get exact answers from the factory. The ladder change involves including a timer to the spindle air to only run it when the spindle is running and for a certain amount of time after the spindle stops. Me personally, I am not aware of the exact details since this would be a service issue. I am not service. I don't mean to minimize my involvement but this is a "new" issue and is just now getting ironed out. There was some push back since this involves an expensive spindle and we want to make sure of the longevity. Have your dealer speak with Michael An.

Thanks, I didn't know if you knew it was just a simple setting change or what.

I asked my AE because I noticed it too. I've been hitting the E stop to shut the air off if I have to step away.

 

[prime_mover]

Sounds like a pretty major fundamental design issue on multiple machines. Did DN-S sub contract to Haas engineering for this one?

 

[Djstorm100]

Sounds like a pretty major fundamental design issue on multiple machines. Did DN-S sub contract to Haas engineering for this one?

Can't even compare the two machine brands. I had both.

Not hard to hit the E-stop button. Take it out of E stop - Machine ready - keep cutting.

 

[LockNut]

Sounds like a pretty major fundamental design issue on multiple machines. Did DN-S sub contract to Haas engineering for this one?

Not a design issue. Nothing wrong with this if it is designed to protect your spindle. Many MTB's do this. As many machines as we have out in the field, this is about the 3rd or 4th customer that has taken issue with this. In the vast majority of shops, air is not an issue. For the people with machines in garages or much smaller shops, I totally understand the concerns. That is why we have a fix for this for those that want it.

 

[Miller846]

Looks a decent performing machine judging by those photos. The parts are tidy. Have you tried doing some 3d surfacing?

Yes I surfaced the countersinks on the aluminum parts and surfaced this angle in stainless. Super simple surfacing but hopefully gives kind of an idea! No issues in regards to program look ahead or anything like that. Runs great!

 

[Djstorm100]

Not a design issue. Nothing wrong with this if it is designed to protect your spindle. Many MTB's do this. As many machines as we have out in the field, this is about the 3rd or 4th customer that has taken issue with this. In the vast majority of shops, air is not an issue. For the people with machines in garages or much smaller shops, I totally understand the concerns. That is why we have a fix for this for those that want it.

People don't realize how much air actually cost, it's more expensive than people think. You're right about small shops, I'm one of them lol.

 

[prime_mover]

Yes I surfaced the countersinks on the aluminum parts and surfaced this angle in stainless. Super simple surfacing but hopefully gives kind of an idea! No issues in regards to program look ahead or anything like that. Runs great!

To test the 3D surfacing capability you'll need to machine some organic geometry and use small tolerance values so that the code flies by. This will allow you to determine where the limits are. If the machine can't keep up it may vibrate in a noticeable way as it stutters on the code, or exhibit some other less than optimal behavior. Reducing the toolpath's cut tolerance in CAM will reduce the code size. Reducing the feed rate will also reduce the rate at which the code needs to be processed.

 

[rklopp]

Miller, Did you get an M-code list with your machine? - RKlopp

 

[LockNut]

Miller, Did you get an M-code list with your machine? - RKlopp

Rklopp,
I will get you an M-Code list for this machine. If you get it from Miller, great. It should be in the back of the Operations manual, if you have yours. Page 96 of the Ops Manual.

I have a PDF of the Ops Manual, if you want it. Email me at [email protected]. It is too big to insert here. I also have a complete spec sheet for that control if someone wants it.

 

[rklopp]

LockN
Thanks very much. I somehow missed the table on page 96 of the paper manual.
RKlopp

 

[Highfeed]

Yes I surfaced the countersinks on the aluminum parts and surfaced this angle in stainless. Super simple surfacing but hopefully gives kind of an idea! No issues in regards to program look ahead or anything like that. Runs great!

Cutting a flat surface with simple G1 moves isn't taxing the control at all.Please explore cutting something with a scallop toolpath with .0002" total deviation at most.

 

[Garwood]

Cutting a flat surface with simple G1 moves isn't taxing the control at all.Please explore cutting something with a scallop toolpath with .0002" total deviation at most.

Why do people care so much about advanced surfacing with Fanuc's bottom barrel control?

If you cared about performance you'd buy a better control.

 

[Vancbiker]

Why do people care so much about advanced surfacing with Fanuc's bottom barrel control?

If you cared about performance you'd buy a better control.

As well as using it on, what is at best, a commodity level machine. If that kind of work was the OP' primary focus, He probably would have been directed to look into higher grade machines. As it was he was looking at this or a Haas. Doesn't that tell folk where his interest and needs lie?

 

[prime_mover]

The 3D surfacing question is relevant for anyone considering this machine, who will on occasion need to do 3D surfacing. Anyone buying any machine cares about the performance capability.

"Commodity level machine?" If by commodity you mean "anything which may be bought or sold," then yes, as is any other machine. If you mean something else, then I don't know what you mean, and I can only infer that you mean "not very expensive," which is relevant but doesn't make the 3D surfacing capability question any less so.