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Okuma M660V real price?

ManualEd

Stainless
Joined
Oct 13, 2014
Location
Kelowna, Canada
Hi All,

Un(fortunately) we ran into some problems at work, and need to spend some money in the upcoming year.

Considering adding a VMC to the shop floor. (In Canada, so we get the "Eh" tax, as well as dinged on exchange rate)
I was quoted $155kUSD base price for an M560VB (Cat 50, 12krpm), $200kusd including 4th prep, probing, 1k psi TSC.

The M660VB would be a nice upgrade in capacity for $100k. There aren't many shops within 400 miles with 60" of travel, and those that do are booked up weeks-months in advance.

Okuma website says list on the M660V is $247k.

Is there any typical discount off list price with machines from Okuma?
 
Man, these VMCs are gettin expensive!

I know the Okuma M560 was priced just over 100k about 5 years ago. Seems crazy that another 10 inches of X travel nearly doubles the price.

When I was getting quotes on 60 inch VMCs a few years ago, I had one come in at 78,000 USD for a basic Fanuc VMC with 20hp spindle. optioned up, it was around 100.

250k for a VMC demands high value work that makes you like a thousand dollars every work day, otherwise you might regret spending that much.
 
It depends. The M560 is more popular and so they frequently cut a discount on it. The M660 less so, (obviously) but still, doesn't hurt to ask what they can do for you.
 
Man, these VMCs are gettin expensive!

I know the Okuma M560 was priced just over 100k about 5 years ago. Seems crazy that another 10 inches of X travel nearly doubles the price.

When I was getting quotes on 60 inch VMCs a few years ago, I had one come in at 78,000 USD for a basic Fanuc VMC with 20hp spindle. optioned up, it was around 100.

250k for a VMC demands high value work that makes you like a thousand dollars every work day, otherwise you might regret spending that much.
I don't think you guys are talking about the same machines. The Genos M560-V is a pretty much, get what you get, assembly line (other than some control options) machine. They are still available just over 100K. They don't come with 50 tapers. An MB56-V however, can be outfitted however you like. They are very much the same machine as far as the iron and the general build, but Japanese built and will cost more because the spindle options range from HSK63E to Cat 40 Cat 50, 8K RPM up to I believe in the 30K range. I think they are available with sub-micron controls as well.
 
I don't think you guys are talking about the same machines. The Genos M560-V is a pretty much, get what you get, assembly line (other than some control options) machine. They are still available just over 100K. They don't come with 50 tapers. An MB56-V however, can be outfitted however you like. They are very much the same machine as far as the iron and the general build, but Japanese built and will cost more because the spindle options range from HSK63E to Cat 40 Cat 50, 8K RPM up to I believe in the 30K range. I think they are available with sub-micron controls as well.

There is now a Genos M660-V. Same concept as the M560-V in that it is built to one spec (well, CAT-40 or CAT-50) and limited options, in volume, at a lower price than the parent MB series machines (which are basically build to order).
 
The Genos M560-V is a pretty much, get what you get, assembly line (other than some control options) machine. They are still available just over 100K.

Okuma USA's site was listing the M560-V starting around $144K. With high demand, I don't really see much discounting from Okuma and the dealers...?

One of the only equivalent bridge mills on the market in the price range is built by DN Solutions, and it's called the BVM 5700.

Depending on your area and the service quality, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase either brand.

ToolCat
 
I don't think you guys are talking about the same machines. The Genos M560-V is a pretty much, get what you get, assembly line (other than some control options) machine. They are still available just over 100K. They don't come with 50 tapers. An MB56-V however, can be outfitted however you like. They are very much the same machine as far as the iron and the general build, but Japanese built and will cost more because the spindle options range from HSK63E to Cat 40 Cat 50, 8K RPM up to I believe in the 30K range. I think they are available with sub-micron controls as well.
I was comparing his quotes on the M560VB (12k, CAT50) for 155,000 USD and the M660V for 250,000 USD with a previous quote I got on C-Frame VMCs.
I looked through my old quote PDF and saw that that I got several machines quoted;

Machine #1 was a C-Frame 40 taper with Fanuc 0i, 60" X travel, 25" Y travel, linear ball ways, 10k RPM, 20 horsepower
Machine #2 was a C-Frame 50 taper with Fanuc 0i, 55" X travel, 28" Y travel, boxways, 6k RPM, 20 horsepower

Both machines base priced at 78k USD

The Okuma is a bridge type and has better spindles, better acceleration and rapids, better controller, etc. But bang for the buck wise, I'm not sure that paying twice the price (or 3.5x the price) for more speed, power, and rigidity is actually worth it. I'm also skeptical of sub-micron controllers on any CNC machine that isn't grinding or diamond turning. IMO the trade off between price and performance still favors buying 2 or 3 of the cheaper machines that can still make the same parts at a longer cycle time due to the slower spindle.
 
I don't think you guys are talking about the same machines. The Genos M560-V is a pretty much, get what you get, assembly line (other than some control options) machine. They are still available just over 100K. They don't come with 50 tapers. An MB56-V however, can be outfitted however you like. They are very much the same machine as far as the iron and the general build, but Japanese built and will cost more because the spindle options range from HSK63E to Cat 40 Cat 50, 8K RPM up to I believe in the 30K range. I think they are available with sub-micron controls as well.
The M560 and M660 are both available in a -VB designation that comes with a 12k Cat 50 dual contact spindle.
Chip to chip and accel time is only 1-2 sec more than the 40 taper which is a bit surprising.
 
There is now a Genos M660-V. Same concept as the M560-V in that it is built to one spec (well, CAT-40 or CAT-50) and limited options, in volume, at a lower price than the parent MB series machines (which are basically build to order).
I was unaware of the option for the 50 taper on the Genos lines. I had to download the brochure from the website to see it. Other than that everything you said is what I was getting at.
Okuma USA's site was listing the M560-V starting around $144K. With high demand, I don't really see much discounting from Okuma and the dealers...?

One of the only equivalent bridge mills on the market in the price range is built by DN Solutions, and it's called the BVM 5700.

Depending on your area and the service quality, I wouldn't hesitate to purchase either brand.

ToolCat
I don't want to speak for all dealers but they are bringing those machines in constantly and I know you can get them for less than that based on quotes I've gotten in the last two weeks.
The M560 and M660 are both available in a -VB designation that comes with a 12k Cat 50 dual contact spindle.
Chip to chip and accel time is only 1-2 sec more than the 40 taper which is a bit surprising.
I was unaware of that. Between that and the pricing I just got the numbers didn't add up which is why I thought it was a different machine.
 








 
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