Parker/Eurotherm 514C/507 4Q SSD DC Retrofit into 1961 10EE Modular

[texasgeartrain]

But there's a HUGE HOLE in your electronic education.

Because it doesn't TELL you what you think it does.

What you want is a Wattmeter. And a 'scope.

Yes the utility company is charging per watt. But the amount of watts are directly tied to how many amps. So if I have one system pulling 10 amps, and one pulling 20 amps . . . well I don't need a degree to know which will be more watts do I ?

And utility cost is only part of the question.

We buy wire, breakers, and fuses based on amps. If our home shop is limited on supply voltage/amps. . . well knowing the amps will answer some other questions.

 

[everettengr]

all of these readings include 514C, 507, fan blower motor, digital tach and DRO measured at main 240VAC supply in.

1.87A - power on but motor off, idle condition
6.1 A - 1150 RPM free turning spindle, not cutting
13.5A - 3000 RPM free turning spindle, not cutting

 

[thermite]

Yes the utility company is charging per watt. But the amount of watts are directly tied to how many amps. So if I have one system pulling 10 amps, and one pulling 20 amps . . . well I don't need a degree to know which will be more watts do I ?

Yes, actually, one does. I say again "Power Factor exists!"

And utility cost is only part of the question.

We buy wire, breakers, and fuses based on amps. If our home shop is limited on supply voltage/amps. . . well knowing the amps will answer some other questions.

"RTFM".

The Drive makers not only SPECIFY the wire and fuse or breaker sizes, and even the tightening TORQUE on the fastener terminals, they specify the TYPE of fuse or breaker and list one or several acceptable makers OF what their product requires to keep its certifications sweet.

Some of those "semiconductor" (protection) fuses are right expensive, too. But "ordinary" fuses are not a lot of USE.

Good "QO" breakers actually act faster.

Walk backwards up the line towards the utility mains (or gen set..), from a(ny) well-specified load, DC Drive or any other, each preceding link in the chain must be in keeping with the load, plus any known waste or conversion loss. And even failure modes.

No need to invent physics from a blank sheet.

We only want to use it safely and not violate "the code". Nor even common sense as to safety vs convenience.

"RTFM".

Or at least the label right on the goods.
It covers worst-case.

You want your meter to cover worst case?

Intentionally blowing s**t up only ONCE isn't GOOD enough.
R&D budgets are not trivial. Third-party testing is a MAJOR industry in its own right.

You've PAID for it, even at used-goods rates and free downloaded .pdf for the manuals.

Put it to work.

"RTFM".

You wanna tell a multi-trillion dollah electronics industry they are full of s**t?

THIS.. is how you end up in selfie You Tube vids.. hunting truant chipmunks along the banks of the Boulder River at the mercy of the skills of a She-wah-wah pup.. and an obese over-age-in-grade dachl dog.



I like dogs. Rivers, even. But I'd rather "RTFM". Even though it takes at least five goes at it!

Seriously. It does.

"We" have a simple need.

"They" had to cover all possible such "simple needs" for a very flexible product. For many diverse buyers.

It can get tedious.

 

[texasgeartrain]

all of these readings include 514C, 507, fan blower motor, digital tach and DRO measured at main 240VAC supply in.

1.87A - power on but motor off, idle condition
6.1 A - 1150 RPM free turning spindle, not cutting
13.5A - 3000 RPM free turning spindle, not cutting

Awesome, thank you. It may be nothing, just curious if we see variances in different systems, or large variances anyway.

Might prove useful, as a base line of sorts in doing some checks in other's start ups too. You never know. Appreciate it anyway.

 

[thermite]

Awesome, thank you. It may be nothing, just curious if we see variances in different systems, or large variances anyway.

Might prove useful, as a base line of sorts in doing some checks in other's start ups too. You never know. Appreciate it anyway.

The DRIVE calls for 110 to 480 VAC @ 24 A, full-gallop. 30A "QO", #10 wire is good.

Previously covered that even "destructive" testing (of the 3HP large-frame motor itself..) never tripped a 15 A SQ D QO breaker on 246 VAC split phase.

It tripped only once.

When I destroyed a 514C-16 and a 507 SSD, same go.

I don't THINK my Shackelton specified uber-costly Shawmut-Ferrand "semiconductor" uber-fast-blow fuses would have helped.

Saved those for the "production" install!

I had more SSDs and motors than I had fuses!

"Had".

Well.. what was the option? Die a Virgin with SSD's as "grave goods", maybe?

Too late by half...

 

[texasgeartrain]

i just added a vid showing the control setup on my lathe.

10EE Controls - YouTube

The speed controls you have toward TS end, are they rated for a certain hp, or are they just a potentiometers that connect to the eurotherm boxes ?

I was shopping and looking at some other stuff, older ones seem rated for hp.

 

[everettengr]

The speed controls you have toward TS end, are they rated for a certain hp, or are they just a potentiometers that connect to the eurotherm boxes ?

I was shopping and looking at some other stuff, older ones seem rated for hp.

they are low power 10k-ohm pots. probably 1/2-watt or less.

 

[thermite]

they are low power 10k-ohm pots. probably 1/2-watt or less.

I've been bench-testing with 2W units because they are common - and cheap - in ten-packs as Bournes or Alps Audio-recording studio control panel linear sliders, 40 mm, 60 mm, 100 mm travel and the like.

These DC Drives . as a class, spec 5 K Ohm or 10 K Ohm pots at 2 W or less, will "work OK" with anything from about 2K to 20 K Ohm.

OR - per their manuals - off a stable control Voltage input - typically 10 V referenced - as may be supplied by a third-party control source, such as the output of a Carotron, Melltronics, Control Techniques, Reliance, Siemens, or similar "Field Regulator" control unit.

Most of the 3-Phase-only DC Drives have those either built-in on main PCB or as a plug-in option card, upgradable from Field stabilized (constant current) to full-fledged Field Regulator "outer loop control" functionality that slaves the Armature control to itself.

On the "to do list" to trial one or more of those.
New thread if/as/when some other besucher doesn't beat me to it, first!
...Hint, hint..



The Field Regulators - a Nidec / Control-Techniques FXMP25 is typical - can cost as much as the DC Drive itself.

Given good tachogenerator (or resolver) input, the single-knob control and load regulation stability in the Field Weakened range is nothing sort of awesome, though.

Not that we seem to actually NEED that for the 10EE's superb reserve power.

A manual tweak of a separate Field Control already beats the ganged fixed-relationship-variables of the older goods.

QED

 

[Hobby Racer]

Upper bound, actually. Well. I run my "ordinary" @ 349, the test rig was higher -able to OUTPUT @ 370+ VDC. I have 2, 3, 4, or 5 transformers in an "array" on the TEST bench.

There are contrary needs in want of compromise:

- Too low the incoming AC Voltage on-tap, you cannot fully power the motor- most especially not under heavy load. 285 VAC is about as low as you want to go on the THREE HP motor. A 277 VAC transformer didn't cut it. I had to parallel/series others with it. The 5 HP would need no more IF yah had the Amperage at the transformer AND the 32- Amp 514C-32 SSD Drive. If not, then 300-320 is a better target, though not a "hard" target, even then. The SSD is for-damned-sure "adjustable"!



- "On the other hand".. At higher AC input, a much shorter ON time for each pulse is needed to put a given amount of energy under the curve after integration. Now it is rougher pulsing - most especially under light load and lower RPM demanded.

Part of why the motor benefits from the big fat choke/ripple-filter aiding the smoothing and adding to electromagnetic "inertia"?

Welll... the choke sort of serves as a flywheel... or even a torsional vibration damper, as on a Dodge Cummins diesel's crankshaft.

Sorry for quoting an old post but I am following this thread in preparation for performing my DC drive conversion and have a question about transformer selection and its practical impact on performance.

I can find 240/480 - 120/240 step down transformers all day long for cheap and run them in reverse to get 480VAC. Most even have high side taps to bring the voltage down 5% or 10%. Assuming I use a big fat choke/ripple-filter, will there be any real performance difference if I feed the Parker 514C drive with 432VAC - 480VAC as opposed to the more ideal 320VAC suggested earlier in this thread?

BTW, great thread. So much good information here.

 

[thermite]

Sorry for quoting an old post but I am following this thread in preparation for performing my DC drive conversion and have a question about transformer selection and its practical impact on performance.

I can find 240/480 - 120/240 step down transformers all day long for cheap and run them in reverse to get 480VAC. Most even have high side taps to bring the voltage down 5% or 10%. Assuming I use a big fat choke/ripple-filter, will there be any real performance difference if I feed the Parker 514C drive with 432VAC - 480VAC as opposed to the more ideal 320VAC suggested earlier in this thread?

BTW, great thread. So much good information here.

Not entirely an accident.

We edited it extensively ahead of posting-time. Then Mark posted the modules rapidly before it could get much interjected ....so it would flow smoother at the opening days - commentary coming LATER!



The 320 +/- 20 is the "sweet spot" off single-phase because the peaks are enough higher to do a nice job when the ripple-filter (AND the motor, itself) shove them into the gaps, akin to bulldozing a ridgeline and filling in the ravines to either side.

Problem with going any higher is that the DC Drive's sensors and controls cut the "ON" time to even LESS ... as there is enough energy under the higher peak of the "curve".

NOT HARD to get the odd Voltage at all. We USUALLY do it with TWO transformers. I used MORE, as many as FOUR, with a fifth handy, plus a multi-tap, and a great heavy Variac.

But that was because I was trialing a LOT more voltages to find that "sweet spot".

Also doing "destructive testing" to see how high one dared go.

You do NOT want anything over 380 VAC into the drive for this application. Even if the DC DRIVE can stand it, it is hard on all-else and rough.

My 350 VAC is pushing it, but I have a whole spare DC motor for each of my two 10EE.

If you parallel the primaries @ nominal 240 VAC of:

1 X 2XX:2XX 1:1 isolation transformer

1 X 2XX:1XX 2:1 step-down transformer

You can series connect their secondaries to, for example:

240 + 120 = 360.

My "Big Boy" is a 120/240 to 277 lighting transformer. Literally "lighting" as it was sourced from a firm that used it to "pushbutton" test the fluorescent lamp troffers they manufactured!



My series-up ones include 120/240 to: 12/24 through 24/48 and in-between.

This whole tribe sell for low-voltage pool and grounds lighting, near as any Big Box.. cheaper yet, eBay, but only when SHIPPING is "free" vs take-with by your own transport.

IF you go this route? That thread is still "alive" and several among us still email each other "now and then" and still help new joiners.

No matter what ELSE, make sure you use a "4Q" AKA "fully regenerative" DC drive!!!

It will need ZERO of contactors or braking resistors and has the simplest of controls for speed, braking, and reversing as well.

Also does a really nice job of load regulating, even without tacho feedback.

I HAVE a "2Q" Sprint/Bardac 3-Phase drive as well. No contactors needed for FWD/REV, ON/OFF, but... it DOES still need braking resistors and ONE contactor for those two missing "FWD braking" and "REV braking" quadrants. plus more complex control logic "off PCB" than the "4Q" drive already has inside its own case.

Feel free to email me if it helps. Got no "Day Job" lo these many years!

 

[everettengr]

^^^^ in additional to what Bill said...

The Parker manual lists AC input as a function of required armature DC output in Section 1-4. It is close to linear, but not exact. However close enough to interpolate and get ballpark numbers.
I believe my GE 5 HP Kinamatic requires about ~250 VDC at the armature (I do need to confirm this value).
Doing the interpolation get you a required 325-VAC input to achieve 250 VDC output. I have been using ~330-VAC input for the Parker 514C and results have been great.
As Bill mentioned, you may need to get creative with transformer sizing if you do not have the big original Monarch T5.
Bill knows better than I regarding any performance difference in going with a AC input voltage that is higher than needed...

 

[thermite]

^^^^ in additional to what Bill said...

The Parker manual lists AC input as a function of required armature DC output in Section 1-4. It is close to linear, but not exact. However close enough to interpolate and get ballpark numbers.
I believe my GE 5 HP Kinamatic requires about ~250 VDC at the armature (I do need to confirm this value).
Doing the math get you a required 325-VAC input. I have been using ~330-VAC input and results have been great.
As Bill mentioned, you may need to get creative with transformer sizing if you do not have the big original Monarch T5.
Bill knows better than I regarding any performance difference in going with a AC input voltage that is higher than needed...

"Better" is probably not the greatest choice of words?

"Worser" may be?



To be fair.. it WAS part of a suite of "destructive" tests. Bits flew off the rotor, but wot the hey.. any good mechanic always has parts left-over.

The commutator went into a blue-white-green "arc flash" fireball.. other dramatic stuff.

Motor ended up easily repairable though.

 

[Hobby Racer]

Let's talk about chokes and ripple filters

Next on my shopping list for the conversion is a suitable choke/ripple filter for the armature output of the 514C. I know nothing about these things so I'm just looking for an education. I have read some are using a 25mH choke. On the schematics posted (thank you Mark) it lists a 20mH choke.

Is there a formula to calculate the optimal size or is it an experimental thing?

Lastly, where does one source a suitable choke on the 2nd hand market? I read one post where someone is using one side of a buck/boost transformer, is that a thing?

 

[thermite]

Next on my shopping list for the conversion is a suitable choke/ripple filter for the armature output of the 514C. I know nothing about these things so I'm just looking for an education. I have read some are using a 25mH choke. On the schematics posted (thank you Mark) it lists a 20mH choke.

Is there a formula to calculate the optimal size or is it an experimental thing?

Lastly, where does one source a suitable choke on the 2nd hand market? I read one post where someone is using one side of a buck/boost transformer, is that a thing?

Yes, the math exists. We are dealing with variable Voltage and variable current in a non-critical application, so we don't get overly fussed as to "optimization".

The makers of the DC drives list recommended "ripple filters" (choke). Their distributors sell them. Check the UK ones and they are right on the line-cards published online. "Eastern Transformer" is a source. Might make sense if one is IN the UK, else not so much. They are HEAVY buggers to ship for their size.

The motor makers, Reliance for example, put the requirement right on their product listings that even the newer "Rectified Power Motor" (RPM) built specifically for inverter duty require a ripple-filter at all windings above 180 VDC. But.. they don't say what VALUE! That depends on the DC Drive and if single-phase or 3-phase, etc.

Two functions are addressed:

A) Knocking the fast-rise SCR switching spikes off, so they do not pierce insulation, give rise to corona discharge, flute the bearings.

- a 20 MICRO Henry choke can do that much.

B) Serving as a serious smoothing "low pass" filter to assist the motor in "integrating" the pulsed DC to more closely resemble "rotating power" as is delivered by the uber-smooth Motor Generator system... much as if it was a variable battery with no pulsing.

- 20 MILLI Henry was chosen because Hammond had stock 20 AMP choke for it. With shipping, the last two cost about $300, each, brand-new, ex Hammond..

Side note: We tried to make sure all parts WERE still available, brand-new. Nobody should be limited to ONLY salvaged antiques for electrical goods. IF THEN one can find a bargain or three? So much the better!


THIS.. 20 MH ..not only makes a single-phase DC Drive sweeter, it extends the useful low-range significantly. I can make turns at one revolution in 15 seconds, or "1/4 RPM" for example, but I am using a Lenze "swinging" or current-draw variable choke. Those are VERY hard to find.

Easier to find is a 17 mH, 16 Amp "Rex". ISTR I paid about $78 each for two of those.

Ex "NRI".

Ebay sellers often have suitable goods. Tedious PITA to scout them and vet the specifications, but "they are out there" and those who list them may have ten times as much "stuff" as they bother to list. One emails or phones them and asks.

While the inductance value is not all that critical, the current-carrying rating IS important. A "choke" is exactly what it says it is, so can LIMIT the available power if undersized.

DC motors can draw 6 to 9 times their nameplate current when moving a load at or near locked rotor. IF YOU PROVIDE IT.

We do not get that aggressive. No need.

- For the nominally 12 FLA 3 HP motor 24 A would be nice, 16 A is a skosh too lean but works OK. 150% of DC drive max for the 514C-16 is 24 Amps, only double a 3 HP large-frame's nameplate. No harm even if stalled to locked rotor as the DC drive only allows it for 60 to 90 seconds, then trips-out safely.


- For the nominally 18-20 FLA 5 HP motors 20 A IS too lean, but it works, too.
The 514C-16 is technically undersized @ 16A, but.. as it is 6 HP capable, "thermally", we made it work OK. A 514C-32 and a 40 Amp capable choke would have had more reserve. However.. a 10EE is not really meant to rip monster chip, so no pressing need.

20 Amp choke has worked for all 10EE motors.

16 Amp choke has worked for either of the 3 HP motors.

Use of transformers:

Use of one winding of a transformer - the high-current, lower voltage side, can work. It doesn't know it is not also a choke.. because it IS one.

CAVEAT is that the DEE CEE is pulsed, and WILL produce an AC Voltage on the OTHER winding.

Power conditioning Gurus do some clever things with that, but for THIS application, far better to avoid it and use a single-winding choke.

Worst-case, chokes are dead-easy to DIY. "E-I" laminations can be purchased. Bobbins, too.

You just don't SAVE much unless you have "free wire".

Used chokes can be a bargain because SALVAGING their valuable Copper is a labour-intensive PITA.

Can they FAIL? Yes, but only so rarely it is not much concern atall.

 

[Hobby Racer]

As always, thank you for the help and knowledge. I have some follow up questions for you.

...
While the inductance value is not all that critical, the current-carrying rating IS important. A "choke" is exactly what it says it is, so can LIMIT the available power if undersized.

1. While poking through eBay listings, I'm seeing mH ratings all over the map. So long as we hit the current rating do we care what the inductance ratings is? If we do what range should we be shooting for?
   
   
2. I'm seeing a lot of "line reactors" on eBay made for 3 phase. With three separate coils, could one coil be used for the Armature + and another used for the Field + to smooth them both with the same unit? If so and we use a choke rated for 20A does that way over-sized choke still work well on the Field side only drawing 1.5A? Or do we stick with DC Link Chokes?

 

[thermite]

As always, thank you for the help and knowledge. I have some follow up questions for you.

1. While poking through eBay listings, I'm seeing mH ratings all over the map. So long as we hit the current rating do we care what the inductance ratings is? If we do what range should we be shooting for?

As stated:

- 20 MICRO Henry will knock the spikes off, motor survives the remaining insult of pulses. It also "growls", especially on hard accel or decel.

- 20 MILLI Henry will significantly aid the motor- which OTHERWISE must "integrate" the pulses in the current realm, not Voltage - all by itself.

LATER technology "RPM" motors were re-designed to do that better. Our older motors are NOT good at it. And even the "RPM" family want ripple-filters.

Now the "growl" is distributed, more of it obvious at the choke than at the motor, but the overall system is VERY much smoother, and can run at lower RPM smoothly, too.

"In between is .. would you believe it? "In between!"

NB:

A) UNLIKE a Variable FREQUENCY Drive for AC, DC Drives of the "thyristor" class operate at the same "line derived" frequency all the time, and for all loads. They "control" by altering the 'ON-TIME" or "Duty Cycle" of each pulse, not the frequency. LIGHT loads have very short "ON" time, very loooong "OFF" time, and are noisier than HEAVY loading.

FWIW-not-much, "PWM" DC drives are closer cousins to VFD with the output rectified. Not well-suited, here.

SCR drives have:

- 120 Hz or "two pulse" for MOST 60 Hz incoming single-phase,

- 360 Hz or "six pulse" for MOST 60 Hz incoming 3-Phase.

Wherein SOME high-end SCR DC Drives apply a ration of (patented) "pseudo-phasing" kinky-f**kery to multiply that to 12 or even 24 pulses.

Take note as you eyeball the PCB that:

- a "1Q" drive such as the Beel/BICL D510 has but ONE trigger inductor. It is "contactor reversed", only has two controlled rectifiers in its packaged matrix. The other two freewheel. Rough as a cob. over 120 V "AC Component" measured.

- a "2Q" Sprint DC Drive on 3-Phase has SIX rectifiers under active control. Two per phase, one each direction.

- a "4Q" SSD 514C SINGLE phase drive doesn't have just two. It has EIGHT trigger inductors for a 12 Diode matrix!

Smoother drive than average. Even before the choke is added.

[*]I'm seeing a lot of "line reactors" on eBay made for 3 phase. With three separate coils, could one coil be used for the Armature + and another used for the Field + to smooth them both with the same unit? If so and we use a choke rated for 20A does that way over-sized choke still work well on the Field side only drawing 1.5A?
[/LIST]

Cheap as they are I have 3 or 4 of those around, various Amperage ratings, Emerson/TCI "Sine Guard" models.

I use them ON 3-Phase .. for "armouring" my overly-electronificated residence against nastiness off the Phase-Perfect .. and more.

They can "help", used as postulated.

They are FAR from optimal.

You want a "DC choke".

10EE Field is a skosh under 2 Amps, yes.

DO keep in mind it is now serving load-motor Field ONLY.

There is no longer any DC panel with contactor actuating coils, nor Braking/Acell, Braking, nor even Field Loss relay to power.

I use Lenze conventionals ELSE smaller Coilcraft ferrite core chokes for the SSD 50X Field supply.

I have..3 if not 4? "Field REGULATOR" boxes here to play with as well....when I get a round-tuit. Caratron, Siemens, etc....

"To Be Determined" whether I filter those or not, but "probably".

B) All this shite happens in the AUDIO frequency spectrum.

One can sidestep the cost of a four-trace Rigol 'scope and the far HIGHER cost of good US made high-voltage probes - also avoid risky exposure to high voltage outright..and still learn a LOT by....

Sticking some cheap "contact" microphones on motor, ripple-filter, toolpost..
and then .. monitoring the sound spectrum in any garden-variety audio spectrum analyzer software on a call phone or laptop.

Most already have it for free - because so many folk are "into" music..

I also own a Sound Pressure Level meter.

Given I'm kinda DEAF!

Not old age, either! Mum had phenomenal hearing past 90 years of age.

101st Airborne, "rear" Div Arty, 175 mm gun "fire mission".
Forgiven, lo more than half a century.

Valiant cannon-cockers HARD NAILED the NVA. One round of pee-bringer!
That makes it worth it!

 

[swatkins]

"The AC input to the 514C is from the 300VAC center tap of my big T-5 transformer as used in 10EE Modular drives, A second 2 KVA 32 VAC boost/buck transformer was added, wired as full-isolation. The transformer primaries are wired in parallel and the secondaries in series with polarity connected for boost. The combined transformers provide 332 VAC input to the 514C-16 DC Drive."

A question for you guys.... I have a sick 1990 modular that someone rigged with a Baldor BC203... It has 440 AC going to large transformers that are 440/240 input and 120/240 output. Currently it is hooked up 440 in and 120 out and then both outputs are combined to make 240 going into the BC203.

There is also a smaller control transformer making 120 also...

Question.... IS the 332VAC input needed if I were to use the The Parker/Eurotherm 514C -32 ? I am using the stock DC motor, Motor plate is attatch...

 

[thermite]

"The AC input to the 514C is from the 300VAC center tap of my big T-5 transformer as used in 10EE Modular drives, A second 2 KVA 32 VAC boost/buck transformer was added, wired as full-isolation. The transformer primaries are wired in parallel and the secondaries in series with polarity connected for boost. The combined transformers provide 332 VAC input to the 514C-16 DC Drive."

A question for you guys.... I have a sick 1990 modular that someone rigged with a Baldor BC203... It has 440 AC going to large transformers that are 440/240 input and 120/240 output. Currently it is hooked up 440 in and 120 out and then both outputs are combined to make 240 going into the BC203.

There is also a smaller control transformer making 120 also...

Question.... IS the 332VAC input needed if I were to use the The Parker/Eurotherm 514C -32 ? I am using the stock DC motor, Motor plate is attatch...View attachment 343053

That Baldor is just a re-badged (Nidec) KB-Penta KBRG-255. I have one. And several other KB 180 VDC Drives.

But I have 180 VDC-wound Reliance RPM III motors for them too!



Per KB staff, label sez 230 VAC in, but they will cover the Warranty up to 250 VAC input. Only.

That would be under 195-200 VDC out. Not enough for a 240 VDC wound DC motor.

So not "sick" in your case. Just "undernourished"!



The Eurotherm/Parker-SSD's - and most other European/Global market DC Drives - can stand 480-500 VAC input for 380 VDC or so max output.

There are others from European major and minor makers, plus a scant few US lower-volume/ speciality makers such as Caratron, Melltronics, Sabina, Fincor.. and a few others.

Parker-SSD is good, common, still in production, lower cost than most others.

The same manual covers the 514C-8, -6, -32. AFAIK they are physically and electrically identical except for:

- the Amperage & thermal rating of their SCR matrix & heat sink.

I'm not even certain the two smaller units don't also share the same size heat sink as the -32?

A 514C-16 doesn't get very warm at only 55 Watts waste heat at full-gallop.

So - shorter answer - the VOLTAGES would be the same.

300 VAC in is about the minimum - I tried 277-288 and found it weak.
I run nominal 349 VAC in.

You can feed an SSD 480 VAC, but when dialed-down to keep the DC out at 240 VDC the MAX "ON" time pulses are at only 50% duty-cycle.

When asking for lower yet DC out? The "ON" times get silly-narrow with mostly "OFF" time gaps.

Hence the big fat "ripple-filter" chokes.

With 460/480 VAC in? One might need the capacitors that make up the "rest of" the Yaskawa/Magnetek "Quiet Elevator" reference circuit.

It's just the classical low-pass L/C single-stage choke-input filter.

I'm happier to not have capacitors that are subject to age degradation meself.

2CW

 

[swatkins]

Bill
Finding a 507 is proving difficult... The only one I've stumbled across was 380.00. Since the two boards do not talk to each other would you think the BC203 could be used as the 507?

 

[thermite]

Bill
Finding a 507 is proving difficult... The only one I've stumbled across was 380.00. Since the two boards do not talk to each other would you think the BC203 could be used as the 507?

BC 203 would be a waste. Not just too big and powerful, it's a basic, if a skosh "BFBI" dumb, "4Q" regenerative drive but ...you do not WANT "4Q" in that Field Circuit application.

And they DO "talk to each other" if you do it right.

Otherwise you need to gin-up a Field Loss circuit and a Field Economy circuit instead of just interfacing the existing SSD family ENABLE and fault signals.

FWIW, "1Q" non-reversing, SSD 506, 507, or 508 all have enough "armature" power to work for field. Mine have cost anywhere from $25 to $80 each, used but good.

Even so, as there are NO contactors nor relays to power, ONLY the final-drive motor's Field, all you need for Field is a 90/180 VDC capable "baby" KB DC Drive set to 115 to 140 VDC max @ under 2A.

Better yet, but not as cheap... a proper outer-loop control Field REGULATOR.

I have a Caratron, two different Siemens, a P&H Harnisphegar, and ISTR one or two others... but haven't had the time to put them on the bench.

Melltronics makes another one, and the Schneider / Emerson/ Nidec .. owner of the year "Control-Techniques" Digital ones can work, too.

Use of a Field REGULATOR solves the single-knob control but more importantly, actually regulates in the Field-Weakened range for really, really good load response and stability under varying load.

You up for trying that?

Pretty well documented from "back in the day" when DC was more common.
And still is a common situation, larger HP applications.

Many THREE Phase DC Drives have Field Regulation, not just Field POWER, as an option card or even already on the PCB, ready to strap 'active' and adjust.