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Request for 10ee carriage stop pictures

The ELSR systems switch off the spindle motor and leave everything mechanically engaged, whereas the feed-rod clutch and the MLSR system disconnect the feed-rod or threading clutch (respectively) and leave the spindle motor running.
That's correct, it's not a true "kick out". I've been home with the flu for a week. Maybe that's effecting my cognitive abilities...

Does anyone know when Monarch eliminated the feed rod clutch? And whether this style of "hard" carriage stop was offered after they stopped using the dovetail attachment on the apron? I will probably make something similar if one wasn't available.
 

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...

Does anyone know when Monarch eliminated the feed rod clutch? ...
I don't know if it was eliminated or simply optional.

The 1965 10EE manual shows the clutch mechanism on parts sheet 137. The 1978 10EE brochure, page 14, has a photo that shows the feed-rod clutch housing (EE-3632). But, it may be that they used an old photo there, since you can see that some of the photos show headstocks with three oil sight glasses; around 1965 the headstock was modified to have only one oil sight glass. I don't have very many photos of late model 10EEs in my archive, so I can't tell beyond that.
 
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Rkepler,

I'd like to make something like the solid stop block on the right side of this photo. How does it attach to the dovetail block? Is it a dovetail machined on the back side and a cone set screw on the front? Can you post a picture of the mounting end removed from the carriage?
Thanks.
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Go my post #2 and look at the first pic. Also post #8. Mating dovetails with setscrew. That is my fabricated dovetail as the original was missing, but the threaded holes were there.
 
Go my post #2 and look at the first pic. Also post #8. Mating dovetails with setscrew. That is my fabricated dovetail as the original was missing, but the threaded holes were there.
Thanks. I already have the dovetail mounted on the carriage. Mine is a little different as it only has one mounting screw in the middle instead of two. The picture on post 8 is helpful, I'm just not sure I understand what's under the set screw. Its there a movable dovetail driven by the set screw. If so, what holds it in place when the block is removed? My apologies for the amateur questions.
 
On mine, and I don't know if the originals had this, there is a small flat milled along the edge of the RH male dovetail. A regular flat bottom setscrew bears against that , no other parts needed. I guess a tapered end would work if you didn't have the flat.
 
Here's a little closer look at Daryl;s photo from post #2. As Daryl said you can see the small flat on the right side of the dovetail.
Its not very wide but its enough to push against to tighten it up.
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I don't know if it was eliminated or simply optional.

The 1965 10EE manual shows the clutch mechanism on parts sheet 137. The 1978 10EE brochure, page 14, has a photo that shows the feed-rod clutch housing (EE-3632). But, it may be that they used an old photo there, since you can see that some of the photos show headstocks with three oil sight glasses; around 1965 the headstock was modified to have only one oil sight glass. I don't have very many photos of late model 10EEs in my archive, so I can't tell beyond that.
Interesting thought. My guess would be a case of Monarch not updating brochure photos and parts drawings... for instance, the drawings Monarch sent for my lathe (1970 EE with no feed rod clutch) show the feed rod clutch on sheets 136 and 137, and doesn't show a non-clutched option. The drawings also don't show the appropriate carriage stop options for my machine (dovetail, rather than bolt mounted).

In the end I suspect every 10EE could be as custom as the ordering party was willing to pay for... like the one that show up at government auction with the weird extra gearbox on the headstock.

In going through brochures, I've seen the black non-micrometer end for the stop rod enough times to determine that mine is indeed original. Later machines seem to have done away with including the micrometer heads and made the dial indicator more standard, at least in the catalogs.

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Here's a little closer look at Daryl;s photo from post #2. As Daryl said you can see the small flat on the right side of the dovetail.
Its not very wide but its enough to push against to tighten it up.
View attachment 416977
I looked a little closer at my dovetail. It looks like there was a set screw riding on the point.
 

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It looks like they used a hardened screw and mushroomed the edge a little. It may not be enough to keep the stop from sitting flat. You could file it off and then use a brass slug under the set screw like what Cal described in post #28 or use a brass set screw.
I first looked at that dovetail as being too small but all. it needs to do is hold the stop in place.
All the force is in direct line with the carriage. Linear push
When you mill out your stop post it here if you would. It could be a pretty basic shape or a close match to original.
You may get lucky and find one for $10 on ebay.:rolleyes5:
 
It's on mine 1959 Wiad. I've never had the guts to see if it works while running, although I refurbed the bushes and static checked it and it does work. I understand it causes quite a racket when doing its thing. That might be part of the design.:). I have it set (like Russ) as an apron crash prevention, not as some precision stop
 
The feed-rod clutch was never intended for routine use. Somewhere in the literature it's referred to as an emergency stop.

My guess is that it was dropped when they redesigned the base, etc., for the Modular Drive. The change over happened in 1960.
 
The feed-rod clutch was never intended for routine use. Somewhere in the literature it's referred to as an emergency stop.

My guess is that it was dropped when they redesigned the base, etc., for the Modular Drive. The change over happened in 1960.

That seems right. I can't remember seeing it on a modular machine, though I wasn't always looking.

The way Monarch ran the carriage stop rod through the feed reverse selector housing, and then didn't set it up to trip the feed out, has always seemed like a missed opportunity to me. I wonder if they originally intended to do so, and then for some reason abandoned the idea partway through designing the machine.
 
I think that being able to shift the headstock threading clutch in/out of mesh with the spindle turning was part of the original design. Early Sundstrand-drive 10EEs had a lever in place of the later feed/thread direction knob that would encourage that:
EE6486 03.jpeg
That feature disappeared in mid 1940, about the time of the rollout of the inline-exciter motor/generator model. I think reason is that it caused too much damage to the dog clutch. We've seen a number of later 10EEs with badly worn dog clutches, showing evidence of shifting with the spindle turning.
 
My saddle dovetail mount was pretty chewed up where the retaining screw was tightened. It didn't look like there ever was a flat for the screw. When I was making indicator brackets I just tossed in a brass screw. It's not like you want/need a lot of tension on the screw (unless you've lost the stop in the top of the bracket).

Note that the dovetail angle from Monarch is pretty weird, I used 40 deg. Here's a pic of the bracket and some dovetail:

10ee_holder_and_dovetail.jpg
 
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I am fully confused on whether or not this lathe has a feed stop. There is no notches in the rod running through the thread direction selector. It looks like someone made a rod on mine just to fill the hole. The machine has the lever and the spring that would engage the notches. What actually disengages when the micrometer adjustment hits the stop rod with the notches in it? Thanks in advance all.
 
As I learned earlier in the Thread. That does not shut off the feed. It would be nice if it did.
 








 
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