Rigging Machines with Cushion Tire Forklift on Dirt/Gravel

[goldenfab]

Working with the closest local rigger (90 miles away) to get three VMCs (7k, 11k, and 12k lb) moved into my new shop and I don't have any concrete outside yet. The problem we have is the cushion tire forklift they want to use they said is a no go without concrete. They have a pneumatic tire forklift but it isn't rated for the weight.

I'm in central AZ and we have a fair amount of clay and lots of rock. I cut the grade down around the shop removing a lot of the top soil to level everything and whats left is a bunch of rock mostly fractured/decomposed granite and clay. I have a thin layer of ABC road base down and its been driven on for a few years and as long as its dry its pretty dang hard.

I'm planing on pouring concrete outside but wasn't planing on it until later this year. I've suggested to the rigger we could unload from inside the door and if they can't get their trailer close enough to the door we can put the machine on my goosneck trailer as I know I can get it right in front of my door. The rigger said he's worried about driving the forklift in my driveway unloaded. I offered to sacrifice sheets of OSB and he said that could be problematic too. I have a cat416 backhoe I own on site and it has forks but can only lift about 5k. The only type of forklift avalible to rent around here that isn't 90 miles away I have found is a 12k telehandler and they want $1,750 for the day.

The rigger was confident they would come up with a solution. I think they may have a bigger pneumatic tire forklift but it may require a second semi truck at 180 miles round trip vs the cushion tire forklift which they could use for other work in the area saving costs for both parties.

Here is an areal view of my shop

Here is a planview of the shop

Here is an outside view of the front 12'x14' door of the shop.

Here is a picture of the gravel in front of the door

Besides pouring concrete and waiting 30 days for it to cure is there anything I can offer to make it easier for the riggers and not rent a telehandler for $1,750? The only thing I can think of is adding a layer of material like crusher fines and going over with a plate compactor.

 

[Rob F.]

Is there anyone nearby that rents trench plates? Maybe riggers have a source for them and can bring with them?

 

[sfriedberg]

Yes, rental road plates. 1" thick, usually. And yes, depending on their loadout, the riggers might even be able to bring them with them.
If there's any trouble with the grade, the OSB would simply crush and tear apart.

 

[Garwood]

The rigger should have steel plates and be familiar with using them for this.

I would rig these myself hiring a Landoll for the hauling and move all 3 at one time. That is unless your driveway is too tight for a semi, but looks OK from here. Back landoll right to the door and roll the machines in. No forklift needed.

I have not lifted a 12k vmc with a telehandler, but I would not be surprised if an 8k telehandler would do it no problem. I have used an 8k skytrak to move and load several 10k lb lathes and vmc's and it was rock solid. 8k skytrak weighs 25k lbs. I boomed out 10ft with 10k on the forks one time.

8k skytrak is $400/day in my area. They have short forks though so I have my own 72" extensions to fit their machines.

 

[dkmc]

. The only type of forklift avalible to rent around here that isn't 90 miles away I have found is a 12k telehandler and they want $1,750 for the day.

Wow there's some sticker shock. Had no idea they cost that much

 

[J Gilles]

I had to rent a 22k telehandler for my lathe and mill. It had to be trucked about 1.5 hrs each way and was $1900 for a day. Ended up only using it like 5 hours over a couple days but the rental outfit was more focused on hours. It sat at the shop for like 2.5 weeks after I was done.

 

[Garwood]

I'm figuring The rental rates are probably the same- About $400/day for a telehandler, but you guys are paying $500 each way for trucking? Got any friends with dumptrucks/heavy equipment trailers? Telehandler will drive up on anything.

How far are you guys from the rental outfits? Can you just drive it over? Rental co is 2 miles from my shop so I put earplugs in, put the Skyrack in high range and give it all it's got for about 15 minutes each way. They usually only charge me $200 for a 1/2 day.

 

[kb0thn]

What sort of forklift is your rigger planning on using? We rig most of our stuff ourselves, but I did have a rigger into my new shop last fall. Versalift 25/35 on solid gravel and absolutely no problems.

Versa-Lift - Model 25/35

Big forklifts for big jobs. Versa-lift.

www.versa-lift.com

I agree that OSB isn't going to do anything. It isn't stiff enough to spread the force out substantially. If the ground moves, the OSB will to and you'll just have shredded OSB.

 

[Overland]

Are there any construction companies near that might have a Payloader ?
Another option might be one of those tilting deck trailers that you could load machine onto near the road, then shuttle into your shop.
Bob

Edit:
I moved a couple of machines with a Roll-back, 6,000 lb lathe and 12,000 lb VMC.
Forklift from big rig onto roll-back, then straight into the shop. Had to winch it off back of roll-back onto skates. Went really well !
Roll-backs are so cheap for what they can do, in my experience !
Bob

 

[goldenfab]

Thank you for all the replies

Is there anyone nearby that rents trench plates? Maybe riggers have a source for them and can bring with them?

I'll call around on that.

I'm figuring The rental rates are probably the same- About $400/day for a telehandler, but you guys are paying $500 each way for trucking? Got any friends with dumptrucks/heavy equipment trailers? Telehandler will drive up on anything.

How far are you guys from the rental outfits? Can you just drive it over? Rental co is 2 miles from my shop so I put earplugs in, put the Skyrack in high range and give it all it's got for about 15 minutes each way. They usually only charge me $200 for a 1/2 day.

I'm about 12 miles away. I checked about renting a backhoe from them before and they said it had to be trucked at $300 something. Not sure why the price is so high.

What sort of forklift is your rigger planning on using? We rig most of our stuff ourselves, but I did have a rigger into my new shop last fall. Versalift 25/35 on solid gravel and absolutely no problems.

Versa-Lift - Model 25/35

Big forklifts for big jobs. Versa-lift.

www.versa-lift.com

I agree that OSB isn't going to do anything. It isn't stiff enough to spread the force out substantially. If the ground moves, the OSB will to and you'll just have shredded OSB.

I don't think the ground is going to move but what do I know, I've never driven one. I thought the issue might be traction on the gravel. But to your point with that much weight OSB is going to get torn to shreds probably even with good ground.

One VMC is at the riggers warehouse, the second is in town A, and the third is in town B. Seems like it would make the most sense to have the riggers take all the machines to my place. Maybe they can load a rollback where the pavement ends and truck them one at a time to my place and have the riggers slide them off. If I had my own roll back and nobody waiting on me I would be fine getting machines off but if I'm paying people to wait on me I'm going to get impatient and damage something.

 

[BT Fabrication]

Wow there's some sticker shock. Had no idea they cost that much

Locally here they are $750 a day plus trucking of $150 each time pick up and drop off.

 

[BT Fabrication]

Working with the closest local rigger (90 miles away) to get three VMCs (7k, 11k, and 12k lb) moved into my new shop and I don't have any concrete outside yet. The problem we have is the cushion tire forklift they want to use they said is a no go without concrete. They have a pneumatic tire forklift but it isn't rated for the weight.

I'm in central AZ and we have a fair amount of clay and lots of rock. I cut the grade down around the shop removing a lot of the top soil to level everything and whats left is a bunch of rock mostly fractured/decomposed granite and clay. I have a thin layer of ABC road base down and its been driven on for a few years and as long as its dry its pretty dang hard.

I'm planing on pouring concrete outside but wasn't planing on it until later this year. I've suggested to the rigger we could unload from inside the door and if they can't get their trailer close enough to the door we can put the machine on my goosneck trailer as I know I can get it right in front of my door. The rigger said he's worried about driving the forklift in my driveway unloaded. I offered to sacrifice sheets of OSB and he said that could be problematic too. I have a cat416 backhoe I own on site and it has forks but can only lift about 5k. The only type of forklift avalible to rent around here that isn't 90 miles away I have found is a 12k telehandler and they want $1,750 for the day.

The rigger was confident they would come up with a solution. I think they may have a bigger pneumatic tire forklift but it may require a second semi truck at 180 miles round trip vs the cushion tire forklift which they could use for other work in the area saving costs for both parties.


Here is an outside view of the front 12'x14' door of the shop.
View attachment 385512
Here is a picture of the gravel in front of the door
View attachment 385513
Besides pouring concrete and waiting 30 days for it to cure is there anything I can offer to make it easier for the riggers and not rent a telehandler for $1,750? The only thing I can think of is adding a layer of material like crusher fines and going over with a plate compactor.

The ground looks a heck of alot better then when I did mine, was 11800 Lbs and they brought an indoor style forklift that weighed 18,000lbs on gravel, in the spring, that was wet. The most part the ground held, only had 2 soft wet spots, and the driver sunk the forklift just as it got to the edge of my shop door. He stopped and it just spun.
I'm 100% sure, if you can drive on it, the forklift would be fine. Biggest thing is to have the ground dry and rock solid, if you need to pick axe to get through the gravel, its plenty hard. Mine had 6 days of rain..... in april. It was saturated and was the only day to move it.

Have you a piece of 1/2" rod? try to hit it in the ground with a blunt end. if it doesn't move much its fine, if it slides right into the ground after a couple hits, might need to do something. Like a few loads of gravel or crushed asphalt and compacted.

 

[Overland]

If you "take a risk" on a big loaded forklift on gravel, and it gets stuck, you'll have a very big problem.
I paid about $100 an hour for the Roll-back. Getting it onto the Roll-back with a forklift is easy. I've even winched a machine off a trailer onto the Roll-back with its own winch, but that can be time-consuming.
You'll need to plan how to slide the machine down off the Roll-back. One way is to leave a bit of the machine base overhanging the bed so it touches the floor first and that may be enough to get it to slide.
Another way is to winch it off, but that depends on having somewhere to anchor the winch. I've anchored a winch to the back edge of the bed and pulled from there.
Roll-back is a safe reliable way to do it, and it sounds like you'll have the riggers there to help you.
Bob

 

[Kingbob]

Yeah man, your situation is similar to ours but our gravel is literally on top of swampy mud. The local riggers keep plates on the trucks as standard operating procedure. The ground here is so bad while unloading our slant 550 M (long since sold when oil crashed in 2014) the 12" thick chain wall on the edge of the slab outside the shop door caved in while unloading the machine. I about died, but the rigger stayed calm and slowly lowered the load and the fork truck stopped sinking once and edge of the machine contacted the ground.

 

[Overland]

So how did it go ?
What did you do ?
Bob

 

[goldenfab]

I talked to the rigger again and they do have a forklift that can do it but its big so they would need two trucks at 180 miles round trip each. Additionally they may not be able to serve other customers in the area with that forklift so I'd pay full price for their mileage. I mentioned renting a rollback locally, they said they are usually fine with lathes but didn't like using them for mills. So where I'm at is waiting for an estimate from them and a date.

Found a place online for renting trench plates for as little as $7 a day but I'm sure delivery is at least $300. Not sure if there is going to be much savings going this route.

I called another rigger and talked to someone and gave them all the specs and locations of what I wanted moved and was told I'd be called back and of course they have not called me back.

I spread out some more road base when it was wet and hit it with a plate compactor. Everything is bone dry now. I can't imagine it would be an issue for them especially since the subgrade is mostly rock but I have not been able to convince them. I can't say I blame them because if they did get stuck its bad for everyone. I do have a backhoe on site and chains to pull things out I might mention to them.

 

[just Dave]

The ground looks okay for the task. Some people can drive a cushion tire forklift on similar ground effortlessly. A rigger takes responsibility for the load, and has to be cautious of the worst case scenario. With a hoe to pull them out if needed it should be fine. Good luck with the move.

 

[just Dave]

If all dry. I should add

 

[Overland]

When I moved my 12,000 lb Mazak on the roll back it went really well.
Loading it on with forklift was easy, and also strapping it down.
We put some scrap OSB between machine and bed.
Winching it off was easy. When we got it over the edge of the roll back, we set the leading edge on two skates, and carried on winching, onto a second set of skates.
Then rollback can go back for 2nd machine while you're setting first.
If you have nothing to anchor winch in the building, attach winches to edge of roll back bed, then just go around the machine.
We used a chain type "cum-along".
Myself, a good buddy and the rollback driver got my mill in.
If the riggers don't want to do it, don't worry. Just get them to bring machine to hard pavement near your shop and take it yourself from there.
All you need is some skates, "cum-along", straps and some chain.
Then a $75 toe jack to get the skates out. Would save a few dollars I imagine.
Took us about 2 hours to get it in off the roll-back.
Good luck.
Bob

 

[Bill in PA]

Had a 28K pneumatic-tire lift at the shop last year. Part of the driveway is asphalt millings. If he turned the wheels too far, it would plow the stone. Had a neighbor on stand-by with his 4 wheel drive backhoe to push the forklift when it got stuck. The forklift needed its own trailer.

Bill