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Strongest rod available

Froneck

Titanium
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Location
McClure, PA 17059
I'm working on a project that I want alloy metal with the highest Tensile/yield strength possible. A bit off topic here but here I find the best minds on the forum.
Diameter will be .201" and no larger than .203", Hardness in the RC 40ish range. Can anyone direct me to the strongest material available in pre-hardened condition, I guess if RC 40's are not available then 30's will do. Length will only be 1.0". I can machine rod to size, I'm thinking hammer forged is I can find it.
Any suggestions?
 
The pre-tensioned concrete people use stuff IIRC runs 280ksi.
It's stranded, but each strand looked to be the dia. you need (Sort of).
 
I'm working on a project that I want alloy metal with the highest Tensile/yield strength possible. A bit off topic here but here I find the best minds on the forum.
Diameter will be .201" and no larger than .203", Hardness in the RC 40ish range. Can anyone direct me to the strongest material available in pre-hardened condition, I guess if RC 40's are not available then 30's will do. Length will only be 1.0". I can machine rod to size, I'm thinking hammer forged is I can find it.
Any suggestions?

How bout this? Object moved
 
An 'Unbrako' socket head capscrew can be used for material at a pinch. Get a long one and the unthreaded portion can be used, though there are probably easier/better answers than this!

From my old Unbrako Technical Catalogue:

Unbrako inch series:
Hardness Rc 38-44
Tensile Stress: 190 KSI
Shear stress: 114 KSI
0.2% Yield Stress: 170 KSI

Unbrako ISO Metric series:
Grade 12.9
Hardness Rc 38-44
Tensile Stress: 1240 MPa
Shear stress: 744 MPa
0.2% Yield Stress: 1115 MPa
 
I'm working on a project that I want alloy metal with the highest Tensile/yield strength possible. A bit off topic here but here I find the best minds on the forum.
Diameter will be .201" and no larger than .203", Hardness in the RC 40ish range. Can anyone direct me to the strongest material available in pre-hardened condition, I guess if RC 40's are not available then 30's will do. Length will only be 1.0". I can machine rod to size, I'm thinking hammer forged is I can find it.
Any suggestions?

4340, 4140, or EN26 would get you in the 200 to 220 kPsi range. if you need corrosion resistance 440C, for extreme conditions iconel or variants.

Edit: Here is a link to Carpenter for steel selection Selection of High Strength Stainless Steels for Aerospace, Military and Other Critical Applications
 
The McMaster Carr listing is for an M2 steel which is a 'high speed steel'. It is formulated for use as cutting tools, where hardness and ability to retain hardness at elevated temperatures are the primary requirements. Strength is secondary, with shear strength and tensile strength (to resist bending or deflection of a cutting tool in use) would be considerations. However, M2 is a comparatively brittle steel.

There are some newer alloy steels that are used for things like industrial/hydaulic wrench parts that have some incredibly high strengths and are 'tough' as well.
Even a steel like a 4340 or 4140, when heat treated properly, will develop some comparatively high strengths. I do not know how high a tensile strength the OP needs, but a heat treated 4340 or 4140 can (if I remember rightly) have an ultimate strength of somewhere around 100,000 psi or a bit more.

The issue with some of the higher strength steels is that the yield point stress value crowds up closer to the ultimate strength value. In plain English, this means the steel has little deflection (within the yield point range, where the steel will return to normal dimensions), and even less ductility (ability to deform or 'stretch' in what is known as 'plastic deformation'). As I like to put it: "There is little warning and then 'SNAP !!"

Stressproof steels are supplied with a hammer forged and cold drawn process. I do not know of any other off-the-shelf alloy steels supplied in bar stock made by hammer forging as opposed to rolling or drawing.

All of this brings back fond memories of my days as a student at Brooklyn Technical HS in the mid 1960's. We had a basic strength of materials course with a well equipped lab. We 'pulled' various specimens of steels and different metals. I remember the wonderment I had as I watched an ASTM 505 (.505" diameter across the test shank area, or 0.400 square inches- handy for calculations in the slide rule days) specimen stretch like taffy before 'rupturing'. We kids had to plot the stress-strain curve and calculate the modulus of elasticity. It was an incredible lesson and something that became a true 'foundation block' not only my education but my life's work as an engineer. I tend to think in simplistic terms, and one thing I fixed in my mind is that higher strength metals are not always the ideal material until I see the spread between their yield point stress and ultimate stress. Tight spread = a material that 'gives little warning and goes 'Snap !"

At the hydroelectric plant I retired from, we were making the switch from slugging wrenches and 16 or 25 lb beaters to hydraulic wrenching systems. I was astounded at the light weight and thin walls on some of the wrench parts, and asked the tech rep about it. He told me they were using titanium for some of the wrench mechanism bodies or frames, and some very high strength alloy steels formulated for the wrench sockets and drive parts. He may have said some of those steels had yield strengths well up over 100 or 150,000 psi. Find some of that steel and the method of heat treating it to get that strength and the OP will likely have all the strength he needs.
 
Aermet 100 has the highest UTS that I've ever used. Course getting a single small piece is going to be difficult. Maybe you could get someone to send you a sample or find a drop somewhere.

You didn't give alot of specifics but a carbon fiber rod might be more suitable, you can get much higher axial strength that way.
 
I've got 280ksi stuff I'll send you a length of if you cover shipping but its around the .205" range. No idea what the hardness is, its king wire out of 7 wire strand.

You do realize that higher strength doesn't mean stiffer, right?
 
Carpenter RDS (their name for AISI L6 or UNS T61206) has values like 240,000 tensile at 50 Rc and 320,000 at 60 RC. Yield isn't far behind at 280,000 at 60Rc

Sounds like pretty good "iron"
 
How about maraging steel (Vascomax 250, 300, or 350), having yield strengths around 250, 300, or 350 ksi? Question is whether you can get it in small diameters.
 
I'm working on a project that I want alloy metal with the highest Tensile/yield strength possible. A bit off topic here but here I find the best minds on the forum.
Diameter will be .201" and no larger than .203", Hardness in the RC 40ish range. Can anyone direct me to the strongest material available in pre-hardened condition, I guess if RC 40's are not available then 30's will do. Length will only be 1.0". I can machine rod to size, I'm thinking hammer forged is I can find it.
Any suggestions?

The question took me back to classes I took about 60 years ago. (I am older than Joe.) Much has been forgotten, but a few points have stuck because of potential usefulness. For instance, all steel has the same modulus of elasticity, so stiffness in the elastic range is not related to strength or hardness. And today, the point is that hardness of steel corelates directly to tensile strength. Not yield strength, by the way.

"Alloy metal" is a rather loose term. If you mean steel, then the answer is rather simple. Hardness of HRC 40 means the tensile strength will be quite close to 1250 MPa (181 KSI). Any plain carbon or alloy steel, any heat treat: hardness relates to tensile strength directly, with only slight variations in test data. I suspect there may be some exotic alloy steels that fall somewhat off the chart, so be prepared for variations. The following paper explains and has nice tables and charts.

https://www.cabinc.com/uploads/case_studies/CorrelationHardnessTensile-wp.pdf See page 5.

Here it is again, in fewer words and no tables. Handbook-Mechanical Properties

Larry
 
The question took me back to classes I took about 60 years ago. (I am older than Joe.) Much has been forgotten, but a few points have stuck because of potential usefulness. For instance, all steel has the same modulus of elasticity, so stiffness in the elastic range is not related to strength or hardness.

Larry

This is always seems to be a hard one for folks to swallow. It just doesn't seem right, but it is.
 
The question took me back to classes I took about 60 years ago. (I am older than Joe.) Much has been forgotten, but a few points have stuck because of potential usefulness. For instance, all steel has the same modulus of elasticity, so stiffness in the elastic range is not related to strength or hardness. And today, the point is that hardness of steel corelates directly to tensile strength. Not yield strength, by the way.

......................

Larry

That can fool you, though, unless you think about it right.

Steels typically will seem stiffer if hardened. Example being lock picks, since they are thin and yet appear much stiffer than a part of the same shape made of annealed steel or low carbon steels.

The trick is that the stiffness is the same, but the yield point is reached with the soft steel, where it is not reached in use with the hardened steel. So it's really two different things that cause the effect you see.

You see the true stiffness with the hardened steel. The soft steel yields well before the force you can exert with the hardened steel is reached. Before that point, the deflections are the same, but you never notice that.

The yield point does go up with hardening, as seen with the lockpicks. The shape of curve vs hardness will be different than the curve of hardness vs strength.
 
I see quite a few steels, I do not need corrosion resistance, everything else in the assembly is steel. However I do have to tap it, I can use NF threads and NS if taps are available. Even metric is OK but the rod has to be tapped thru the center of the length that is almost 1" long (center being 1/2" from either end) Tapping 50 or 55RC is kinda tough, maybe carbide tap?
 
Hmmm, I’ve never tapped steel over 390-440Bhn (aka 42-46Rc)… I have tapped hot work & 4340’s in the 360-390Bhn strength condition using good taps & soluble oil @ around 65-75% thread depth. I checked my ASM Vol3 (machining) and it has an example of H13 being tapped at a slightly higher HT strength with a modified tap (less hook & modified relief) with success. Likely could also be thread milled by someone who’s handy at it.

You gotta be careful with “strongest steel” terms as it leads to rabbit holes too often. Depending on the steel most of them won’t like a lot of abuse north of 45Rc hardness, they mostly just break with a louder noise.

Perhaps you could expand with just how you fear it will fail? BTW, I have a good number or hardness to strength charts, the most complete would be from CAT and NONE OF THEM actually agree very well north of 32 rockwell C regarding hardness vs strength??? It's the best we got though, so far…

Good luck,
Matt
 
Someone mentioned "Unbrako" socket screws.........these used to be a good source of HT steel.........however,the name is now owned by Indians,the socket screws are made in India ,and barely meet SAE Gr 5 specs.....................a similar warning about using Asian Gr 8 fasteners as a source of HT material......Chinese and other Gr 8 fasteners are the same material as Gr5 fasteners from Asian sources,the extra yield coming from extreme hardness ,and consequent brittleness ......do not use Chinese Gr 8 fasteners for any critical application.
 
For something already hardened somewhat, I use Stress-proof or for a bit more strength, Fatigue-proof. Both available from McMaster-Carr

For something that small, I have used allen head bolts.............I made a pin out of a Holo-krome bolt, it was pretty hard and gave the carbide a bit of a workout.
 








 
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