Struggle Finding New Employees.

[Maxim]

Economy of high wages and protectionism allows for wealth to be kept inside the country and therefore actual prosperity.

You know what doesn't help? Defending criminal countries like SK against best korea while they steal our economy via dumping.

 

[john.k]

Raise the tariff wall........If China was 100% sanctioned,how many of the great US fortunes would be snuffed out overnight.......you could probably name 100 billionaires whose fortunes are made from selling manufactured Asian imports,to the exclusion of all else............these fortunes are actually the reward for destroying the US ,and it will come to pass.

 

[jaguar36]

Maybe its just me, but 'flipping burgers' seems like a shitton more work than any job in a machine shop. There is a guy on youtube who makes videos of working the various jobs at a McDs and it looks very intense. Particualrly when during the busy periods he is constantly flying around doing a bunch of different things. I'd much rather being doing anything in a decent machine shop, even if its just sweeping the floors.

 

[michiganbuck]

In my opinion, the difference in job value is how much skill and instruction are required.
If you can teach burger flipping in 3 minutes and a person can do adequate performance then the skill and pay rate is low. The same with a machine operator who can be instructed in about 5 minutes..
A machinist who is required to plan and create the process has the much greater skill and so may deserve higher pay.

 

[cnctoolcat]

Unfortunately I think America is becoming a gaggle of dipshit deadbeats.

Have you been to a WalMart lately, and witnessed a cross-section of "middle-to-lower" class Americans? Here's a clue: it's not a pretty sight.

All the younger generations want to wait tables and work bar for $200 per night in cash tips, and that's great. But where are they gonna be in 10 years?

And a lot of young people are disqualifying themselves for better jobs later in life with the ridiculous amount of tattoos they have!

A large percentage of livable-wage, career-type jobs involve interacting the the public or other companies' personnel, and most real companies don't want their people to look like circus acts.

And the younger generation's work ethic is by-and-large shit. (Always exceptions...)

Every generation says that about the previous ones, but not in human history have we had such dramatic cultural changes taking effect: the distraction and ADD-causing effects of the smart phone, the legalization of marijuana and other laziness-enhancing drugs, and the desire by Uncle Sam to create a nanny state.

 

[BoxcarPete]

Unfortunately I think America is becoming a gaggle of dipshit deadbeats.

Have you been to a WalMart lately, and witnessed a cross-section of "middle-to-lower" class Americans? Here's a clue: it's not a pretty sight.

All the younger generations want to wait tables and work bar for $400 per night in tips, and that's great. But where are they gonna be in 20 years?

And a lot of young people are disqualifying themselves for better jobs later in life with the ridiculous amount of tattoos and piercings they have!

A large percentage of livable-wage jobs involve interacting the the public or other company personnel, and most real companies don't want their people to look like circus acts.

And the younger generation's work ethic is by-and-large shit. (Always exceptions...)

Every generation says that about the previous ones, but not in human history have we had such dramatic cultural changes taking effect: the distraction and ADD-causing effects of the smart phone, the legalization of marijuana and other laziness-enhancing and productivity-killing drugs, the welfare floodgates being opened wide from Uncle Sam...

Minor gripe here, but I'll take a swing at it anyway. Real ADHD can't be caused by smartphones and video games. It's a fundamental structural difference in the way the brain works. Recently, there has been an emergence of reclassifying certain "disorders" (including autism, ADHD, and dyslexia) as "neurodivergence" instead, as living with one or more can be both a blessing and a burden.

True ADHD tends to produce individuals who are outside the box thinkers and experience periods of hyperfocus, where an all-consuming drive can push us to some seriously impressive feats (I once did over a week's worth of CAD work in a single 17-hour day), but that's pretty rare. Mostly it's just chasing after the elusive state of directing a strong yet narrow focus on something productive and remembering to grab your lunch before leaving the house.

It might be easy to conflate or confuse that with what you're describing, but that's just garden variety distraction and/or addiction, that can happen to anyone and deserves its own discussion.

 

[TeachMePlease]

And a lot of young people are disqualifying themselves for better jobs later in life with the ridiculous amount of tattoos they have!

A large percentage of livable-wage, career-type jobs involve interacting the the public or other companies' personnel, and most real companies don't want their people to look like circus acts.

Why? Who says those jobs require people to not have tattoos?

Younger people don't give a damn... And the young shall inherit the Earth...

 

[charlie gary]

Why? Who says those jobs require people to not have tattoos?

The people finding candidates for those jobs, frequently based on feedback from customers.

Younger people don't give a damn... And the young shall inherit the Earth...

Very true that young people don't give a damn, and that's okay. People frequently change as they age, and I've met many people who in later years expressed regret regarding decisions they made in earlier years.
I'm not saying I'm for or against tattoos. To me, they're like boats and expensive cars. I like it when other people have them. I am saying that tats, piercings and other forms of expression that involve modifications to the body can limit where a person can be without being judged by their appearance.

 

[Micmac1]

So quick update, we found a perfect candidate, offered him exactly what he wanted and.....His current employer gave him a promotion and a substantial raise when he went to put in his two weeks. Back to square one. Second time this had happened.. I guess companies are just at a point where the can not afford to loose any employees so they are offering up just to keep them.

 

[cnctoolcat]

His current employer gave him a promotion and a substantial raise when he went to put in his two weeks.

You have to be expecting this in today's machining in America!

So be prepared next time, when the ideal candidate gives you the bad news about getting a big raise to stay at his current employer, offer a substantial increase of your own, right there on the spot! Maybe throw out an additional week's paid-vacation, or the chance for more/less OT...

Give him something to think about!
His "promotion" at his original job was probably just a title, and they probably gave him only $2-$3 more per hour. Significant in his mind, especially with the known-aspects of his current job.

But imagine if he hears $5-$8 more per hour than you were originally offering him, with the reasoning being "you're our ideal candidate, we assumed your current employer would counter-offer, but we're willing to pay what it takes to get you."

 

[PDW]

So quick update, we found a perfect candidate, offered him exactly what he wanted and.....His current employer gave him a promotion and a substantial raise when he went to put in his two weeks. Back to square one. Second time this had happened.. I guess companies are just at a point where the can not afford to loose any employees so they are offering up just to keep them.

I don't really get this.

You're looking for a new job, I assume you've had the discussion WRT promotion/pay raise with the current employer and they've said no can do because <insert reasons here>.

So you get a good offer, you accept and put in your notice and NOW your current employer says 'wait we really value you and here's the money/promotion we told you that you couldn't have.'

I'd be out the door saying it's too late for that.

And I'd also think I'd made an agreement with the new place and going back on that wouldn't sit well with me either.

So - I don't get it really. But I don't play those games.

PDW

 

[Seesecurity]

I don't really get this.

You're looking for a new job, I assume you've had the discussion WRT promotion/pay raise with the current employer and they've said no can do because <insert reasons here>.

So you get a good offer, you accept and put in your notice and NOW your current employer says 'wait we really value you and here's the money/promotion we told you that you couldn't have.'

I'd be out the door saying it's too late for that.

And I'd also think I'd made an agreement with the new place and going back on that wouldn't sit well with me either.

So - I don't get it really. But I don't play those games.

PDW

I had a guy turn up for interview and his first words were, "I don't really want the job, I'm just using you to get a payrise, but I thought I'd come over and have a look anyway"
I said thanks for wasting my valueable time...

 

[john.k]

Ive talked to several young guys about why they work at Mc Ds ........answer is "young vibe ,and meet cool chicks".........In my observation,its also got an element of the army about. it.....McDs do their thinking for them.

 

[john.k]

And in more bad news,in the latest Oz election ,voters under 40 were a majority for the first time.......and home ownership has also fallen below 50%,meaning all the tax the rich ,free houses for the young gets traction in the mainstream.............I must say ,whats alarming to me is a house/apartment for lease will have 20 people waiting outside on open day......IMHO ,this is a portent of serious shit happening to people with assets....like me.

 

[jccaclimber]

I had a guy turn up for interview and his first words were, "I don't really want the job, I'm just using you to get a payrise, but I thought I'd come over and have a look anyway"
I said thanks for wasting my valueable time...

That's easy, that's when you call the last place on his resume (he brought one, right?) and tell them.

 

[jccaclimber]

You have to be expecting this in today's machining in America!

So be prepared next time, when the ideal candidate gives you the bad news about getting a big raise to stay at his current employer, offer a substantial increase of your own, right there on the spot! Maybe throw out an additional week's paid-vacation, or the chance for more/less OT...

Give him something to think about!
His "promotion" at his original job was probably just a title, and they probably gave him only $2-$3 more per hour. Significant in his mind, especially with the known-aspects of his current job.

But imagine if he hears $5-$8 more per hour than you were originally offering him, with the reasoning being "you're our ideal candidate, we assumed your current employer would counter-offer, but we're willing to pay what it takes to get you."

So you're going to lowball the initial offer by $16k/year (plus any overtime) from what an employee is worth to you and then be surprised when you don't get good applicants?

 

[john.k]

I pulled the same stunt with the sandblasters ...$10 an hour raise...........It took me a couple of weeks to realize I was indespensible to these dickheads,but one partner refused point blank to increase my pay..........so I went for another job.....what a shit show ...the foreman was a tattoed all over muscle freak ,shacked up with the female company owner ,but very high pay was offered ................there was funny reason the previous mechanic was fired ...........seems he had fitted an automatic levelling device on an EWP 90deg out of position....soon as the freak engaged the auto level ,the basket turned on its side ....60 ft up.

 

[jaguar36]

I don't really get this.

You're looking for a new job, I assume you've had the discussion WRT promotion/pay raise with the current employer and they've said no can do because <insert reasons here>.

I know of some large companies that will specifically say there isn't anything they can do for you unless you have an offer. Salaries to new hires have gone up in alot of areas by 10-20% in the last two years. If you haven't switched jobs, you're probably underpaid compared to if you were just starting with the company at your level. I don't know anyone who has gotten 6-7% raises the last two years, despite that being what inflation was.

As for not breaking an agreement, the best thing to do is to go to your current employer once you have a written offer, but before you've accepted. Not without risk though. At an old job the owner gave someone a raise when they threatened to leave, then fired them 3 months later.

Most good bosses however realize its not a personal insult though, and will work with you.

 

[Micmac1]

You have to be expecting this in today's machining in America!

So be prepared next time, when the ideal candidate gives you the bad news about getting a big raise to stay at his current employer, offer a substantial increase of your own, right there on the spot! Maybe throw out an additional week's paid-vacation, or the chance for more/less OT...

Give him something to think about!
His "promotion" at his original job was probably just a title, and they probably gave him only $2-$3 more per hour. Significant in his mind, especially with the known-aspects of his current job.

But imagine if he hears $5-$8 more per hour than you were originally offering him, with the reasoning being "you're our ideal candidate, we assumed your current employer would counter-offer, but we're willing to pay what it takes to get you."

We offered exactly what he said he was looking for, which was about $5 over his current position. If i had to guess, he got a $10+/hr raise to stay.

 

[TeachMePlease]

I know of some large companies that will specifically say there isn't anything they can do for you unless you have an offer. Salaries to new hires have gone up in alot of areas by 10-20% in the last two years. If you haven't switched jobs, you're probably underpaid compared to if you were just starting with the company at your level. I don't know anyone who has gotten 6-7% raises the last two years, despite that being what inflation was.

As for not breaking an agreement, the best thing to do is to go to your current employer once you have a written offer, but before you've accepted. Not without risk though. At an old job the owner gave someone a raise when they threatened to leave, then fired them 3 months later.

Most good bosses however realize its not a personal insult though, and will work with you.

Some of us got raises that beat inflation specifically because anything that didn't match it was a pay cut.

But not every company thinks about that...

Or cares...