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The US sanctions impacting the Chinese chip industry

Do you truly believe that? Is that what ВГТРК tells you to believe? Have you asked Tupolyev and Sukhoi how many chips are in their plains sourced from TMSC, Samsung, or Intel :)?, Because as long as Putin is F'n up in Ukraine, those are totally Verboten to both you and now to China. Not sure the troops can pillage enough washing machines in Ukraine to solve that problem.
do you want to talk about propaganda on television? are you from the country of the progenitor of this very propaganda?

in the nineties, thanks to you and our corrupt officials, civil aviation was practically destroyed in Russia. now thanks to the sanctions we will have our MC 21 completely. we will make our own processors, like China. the world is not the same as 30 years ago, start forgetting about us hegemony
 
"You guys are killing me here"....Relax Ries. Boeing still has be BIG business presence in China, and China will need a shit-ton of commercial airliners. Last word was the Boeing's 737MAX would return to service in China this weekend, so if China built airliners won't crash and burn and kill everyone on board there is always Boeing to fill the need.
as soon as china can saturate its market with its aircraft, it will wave goodbye to Boeing
 
do you want to talk about propaganda on television? are you from the country of the progenitor of this very propaganda?

in the nineties, thanks to you and our corrupt officials, civil aviation was practically destroyed in Russia. now thanks to the sanctions we will have our MC 21 completely. we will make our own processors, like China. the world is not the same as 30 years ago, start forgetting about us hegemony
good luck with that
 
"You guys are killing me here"....Relax Ries. Boeing still has be BIG business presence in China, and China will need a shit-ton of commercial airliners. Last word was the Boeing's 737MAX would return to service in China this weekend, so if China built airliners won't crash and burn and kill everyone on board there is always Boeing to fill the need.
My point is simple. the Chinese are at least a decade away from producing viable commercial quantities of the 919.
So, yes, I am in total agreement, its no competitor whatsoever to Boeing and Airbus at this point.
And the idea that the MC21 can be produced in enough quantity to even supply Aeroflot is highly unlikely.
For all the puffed up bravado of the resident russian, the russian aerospace industry barely exists. Again, they have made 6 planes of this type so far, its been under development for well over a decade.

The reason online records of the amounts of commercial aircraft actually produced in Russia, already miniscule, taper off after 2013, is because, in 2014, Putin invaded Crimea. Previous to that, the few planes they actually could made were based on joint ventures with Ukrainian firms clustered around Kiev and antonov. After that, the Ukrainians refused to work with the Russians, and the vaunted home made engines and chips all were revealed to be the vaporware they really are. Since 2013, Russian has built something like 200 commercial airliners in total. And thats a generous estimate. Boeing and Airbus each commonly build between 600 and 800 a year.
So far, of the 6 MC21's built, only ONE actually has russian made engines.
Engines are tough enough.
Chips?
Pull my other one.
 
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1. No.
The Chinese may be willing to produce commercial quantities of aircraft, soonish, if they find it necessary or advantegous.
In the past, US policies and generous sales terms made it expensive commercially, and undesirable politically.

The US may have changed the policies, and this may make the chinese decide to produce commercial aircraft in a serious manner.

Should the chinese decide to really focus on aircraft manufacture, they will certainly be able to do so within a very few years.

They already have the knowledge the build airframes, and powerplant technology is not actually all that hard if you have a few hundred million $ to invest and can hire the best trainers from all over the world at 1m$ salaries.

2. Yes.

Russia and china have not produced any meaningful amounts of commercial-grade export aircraft -- ever.
But russia has produced plenty of military aircraft of high quality -- perhaps at a high cost.

China is by far the world leader in very large big high-tech projects, often involving cutting-edge levels of technology.

High-speed trains are a good example.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So are space probes, going to the back of the moon, in only about 2-3 years.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So are computer motherboards.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So is solar cell PV tech - in scale, volume, efficiency, and quality.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So is refining rare metals.
- No-one else in the world is even close.

Example:
China built the biggest tsla factory in the world for ev cars and tech in 1 year.
(Employing 100.000 workers at some point, apprently.)
In the US it takes 5-8 years, in the EU almost the same.

My point is simple. the Chinese are at least a decade away from producing viable commercial quantities of the 919.
So, yes, I am in total agreement, its no competitor whatsoever to Boeing and Airbus at this point.
1.

And the idea that the MC21 can be produced in enough quantity to even supply Aeroflot is highly unlikely.

For all the puffed up bravado of the resident russian, the russian aerospace industry barely exists. Again, they have made 6 planes of this type so far, its been under development for well over a decade.

The reason online records of the amounts of commercial aircraft actually produced in Russia, already miniscule, taper off after 2013, is because, in 2014, Putin invaded Crimea.
2.
Previous to that, the few planes they actually could made were based on joint ventures with Ukrainian firms clustered around Kiev and antonov. After that, the Ukrainians refused to work with the Russians, and the vaunted home made engines and chips all were revealed to be the vaporware they really are. Since 2013, Russian has built something like 200 commercial airliners in total. And thats a generous estimate. Boeing and Airbus each commonly build between 600 and 800 a year.
So far, of the 6 MC21's built, only ONE actually has russian made engines.
Engines are tough enough.
 
My point is simple. the Chinese are at least a decade away from producing viable commercial quantities of the 919.
So, yes, I am in total agreement, its no competitor whatsoever to Boeing and Airbus at this point.
And the idea that the MC21 can be produced in enough quantity to even supply Aeroflot is highly unlikely.
For all the puffed up bravado of the resident russian, the russian aerospace industry barely exists. Again, they have made 6 planes of this type so far, its been under development for well over a decade.

The reason online records of the amounts of commercial aircraft actually produced in Russia, already miniscule, taper off after 2013, is because, in 2014, Putin invaded Crimea. Previous to that, the few planes they actually could made were based on joint ventures with Ukrainian firms clustered around Kiev and antonov. After that, the Ukrainians refused to work with the Russians, and the vaunted home made engines and chips all were revealed to be the vaporware they really are. Since 2013, Russian has built something like 200 commercial airliners in total. And thats a generous estimate. Boeing and Airbus each commonly build between 600 and 800 a year.
So far, of the 6 MC21's built, only ONE actually has russian made engines.
Engines are tough enough.
Chips?
Pull my other one.
I guess time will tell and your 10 years lead time is based on current production capability?

Right now major nations, and not some not so major, are choosing up sides. Some may decide to sit everything out on the sidelines and some nations may be more agressive in participating with one side or the other.
Since the C919 at this point is only ever going to be for domestic service, I don't know how much a lack of large series production will hurt China. Sanctions by the U.S. have put a stop to the C919 gaining worldwide use and certification so domestically China will do what China must do---maybe high speed trains will haul more souls. Maybe China will access the thousands of legacy airliners that are in storage around the world. Maybe China will recruit (buy) brain power from other countries and nations. Won't be the first time a nation, including us, relied on foreigners to move our tech forward.

Oddly am not seeing any discussion in the media regarding the effects of economic retaliation from China, whatever that may be. I'd guess that West, East, and Gulf ports value the container trade in the $hundred of millions...if not more. What of that?

My take on it would be to recognize that no matter what, China and Russia will likely achieve some level of technology to keep their countries running. It may take years but they will do it unless they are destroyed, because the reality that the U.S. sanctions at this point are driven by military considerations mainly AI. The U.S., it would seem to me, would benefit by raking in money from sanctions and tariffs and use those funds to keep us one step, or generation ahead of our competition. If it's not too late.
 
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They already have the knowledge the build airframes, and powerplant technology is not actually all that hard if you have a few hundred million $

Really? Not that hard? Well, tell that to PWA or GE Aerospace!
They perhaps should hire Chinese engineers for their next gen. commercial engines.
Me thinks you're off at least a couple of 0-s.
Can they build new engines? Perhaps.
Will they be efficient enough for airlines outside of China to buy it?
Will their airframes be compatible with engines of the big three?

But russia has produced plenty of military aircraft of high quality

Well, they must be so stealthy that not even Ukranians can see it!
 
I heard the opinion that in order to loop the economy, you need about 800 million people to be self-sufficient. I think the world is moving towards this. the process of deglobalization was launched even before the conflict in Ukraine, as experts say, there will be several currency zones, the monopoly of the dollar as an international reserve currency will become a thing of the past
“the monopoly of the dollar as an international reserve currency will become a thing of the past”

I rather doubt that because who would replace it? The RF, China, India, Saudi or Germany? Who will do it?
 
[snip]

High-speed trains are a good example.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So are space probes, going to the back of the moon, in only about 2-3 years.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So are computer motherboards.
- No-one else in the world is even close.

So is solar cell PV tech - in scale, volume, efficiency, and quality.
- No-one else in the world is even close.
So is refining rare metals.
- No-one else in the world is even close.

I'm sorry, but the two I bolded are just plain wrong.

If we can send probes to the moons of Jupiter (Jupiter Icy Moons Explorer, ESA, scheduled launch 2023; Europa Clipper, NASA, scheduled launch 2024), then I'm fairly certain we could send a probe to the dark side of our own. China has yet to send anything to Jupiter, they might do so in 2029 at the earliest. Saying "nobody is even close" might technically be correct, but it's like saying nobody is close to breaking my buddy's world record of "kicking oneself in the head the most times in one minute" because there isn't really demand for that kind of thing.

China is only the world leader in computer motherboards if you count Taiwan, which most international organizations do not.
 
What I was trying to say is that Taiwan is the actual world leader for this commodity, not PRC.
I am pretty sure the boards themselves are done on the mainland. More labor, less tech.
The chipsets however are either from Taiwan, Malaysia, Ireland, S Korea or USA.
 
When people say this or that country can not run with the USA I am reminded of a time when the USA was the leader in automobile production.
CNC machine tools... nobody can touch our tech and greatness.....That worked out well.
Seems they learn quickly if real money on the table.
 
When people say this or that country can not run with the USA I am reminded of a time when the USA was the leader in automobile production.
CNC machine tools... nobody can touch our tech and greatness.....That worked out well.
Seems they learn quickly if real money on the table.
Fair 'nuff, but!
Would the " this or that country " include China in your view?
Can you name a world renown Chinese automobile? CNC machine tool? Television? Watch? Carbide cutting tool?
And I don't mean stuff carrying a "Made In China" label on a the very bottom of an otherwise world renown brand package, but the real McCoy?

And if you can, the next question is if it was purely home grown, or was it based on something stolen from greedy dumb bastard foreigners looking to make an easy bank?
 
Fair 'nuff, but!
Would the " this or that country " include China in your view?
Can you name a world renown Chinese automobile? CNC machine tool? Television? Watch? Carbide cutting tool?
And I don't mean stuff carrying a "Made In China" label on a the very bottom of an otherwise world renown brand package, but the real McCoy?

And if you can, the next question is if it was purely home grown, or was it based on something stolen from greedy dumb bastard foreigners looking to make an easy bank?
Sorry but China is maybe all that.
This based on experience where for a long time I thought Japan could never build a good car, machine or cutting tool.
Own any of these now?
They were a joke making cheap toys and we did not take them seriously.
Do you think made by the J-A-PAN now all low end trash? Did your view change at some point?
Where they smarter than us? Where they bigger than us? Did they have a better plan?
Bob
 
When people say this or that country can not run with the USA I am reminded of a time when the USA was the leader in automobile production.
CNC machine tools... nobody can touch our tech and greatness.....That worked out well.
Seems they learn quickly if real money on the table.
Well, watch this space; it might be returning

 








 
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