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Tree Journeyman 325 with Delta 20: power issue

3Wishes

Plastic
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
First post here, typical new forum member looking for help…

I’ve read through almost every post with anything mentioning this machine and I have not found anything just like the issue I am having. The machine was working fine and then it was moved, stored for about a year then moved to its current location. Following the normal start up, turn on machine breaker, reset estop, turn on controller and hit reset, this turns on the main power and fans are on. The controller power supply is on but there was no activity on the monitor. I checked the power outputs on the controller PS and they appear to be outputting voltage. I don’t have a spec on the power supply but there is a post on this forum that lists some values and talks about a Meanwell substitute as a possibility.

There are red LEDs on a couple of the cards indicating a WDT failure (what it says on the cover)and I don’t know what that means. So over a few days I checked connectors, tightened terminal screws, removed and reseated the PCBs in the controller, inspected a couple of the boards for burned components or bad solder joints, etc. Then I was reading something that said not having air pressure and lube oil would limit certain things from working so I found that the air wasn’t on. I got that going and was surprised to see the monitor come on. It said tests were passed and at the bottom it said to replace the battery before continuing. I shut the machine down and went to get the lithium 3.6V it uses. Installed the battery and tried to start it up and it was back to no monitor and the red lights on the controller.

I have been in contact with Dynapath (wow, still supports the delta 20) and they say the air should have no bearing on the start up and it looks like a power supply problem. I’m still hoping for more details from them on the specific things to check but I’m sure it’s not high priority to solve the problem of a non-paying inquirer. I do appreciate the help they have given so far.

I’m going to double check the outputs on the controller PS based on what I found in the other post. I did discover that while the required voltage for the main power is 230V 3Ph the power actually supplied is 208V 3Ph. I saw in the set up instructions that you can change a lead to accommodate from 220V to 240V, but not 208. I did change it to the 220 setting but it didn’t help. The voltage getting to the Delta control PS is 107V, the tag says it should be 115V but the outputs seem correct.

To recap, everything is on, including the controller system, but there is nothing on the monitor and reset won’t start it. The monitor did come on once but not since.

Any insights or ideas are appreciated. I do have the set up manual for the mill, the delta 20 and a programming manual. I also have a set of schematics but they don’t include a lot of detail for the Delta.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
Not familiar with that machine, but if you replaced the memory back up battery with the machine off, you probably lost parameters.
What type of power supply is it, most have either the outputs marked or test pins on the board that are marked. A lot of machines share common components maybe some pictures would help.
 

Big B

Diamond
Joined
Jun 26, 2009
Location
Michigan, USA
First post here, typical new forum member looking for help…

I’ve read through almost every post with anything mentioning this machine and I have not found anything just like the issue I am having. The machine was working fine and then it was moved, stored for about a year then moved to its current location. Following the normal start up, turn on machine breaker, reset estop, turn on controller and hit reset, this turns on the main power and fans are on. The controller power supply is on but there was no activity on the monitor. I checked the power outputs on the controller PS and they appear to be outputting voltage. I don’t have a spec on the power supply but there is a post on this forum that lists some values and talks about a Meanwell substitute as a possibility.

There are red LEDs on a couple of the cards indicating a WDT failure (what it says on the cover)and I don’t know what that means. So over a few days I checked connectors, tightened terminal screws, removed and reseated the PCBs in the controller, inspected a couple of the boards for burned components or bad solder joints, etc. Then I was reading something that said not having air pressure and lube oil would limit certain things from working so I found that the air wasn’t on. I got that going and was surprised to see the monitor come on. It said tests were passed and at the bottom it said to replace the battery before continuing. I shut the machine down and went to get the lithium 3.6V it uses. Installed the battery and tried to start it up and it was back to no monitor and the red lights on the controller.

I have been in contact with Dynapath (wow, still supports the delta 20) and they say the air should have no bearing on the start up and it looks like a power supply problem. I’m still hoping for more details from them on the specific things to check but I’m sure it’s not high priority to solve the problem of a non-paying inquirer. I do appreciate the help they have given so far.

I’m going to double check the outputs on the controller PS based on what I found in the other post. I did discover that while the required voltage for the main power is 230V 3Ph the power actually supplied is 208V 3Ph. I saw in the set up instructions that you can change a lead to accommodate from 220V to 240V, but not 208. I did change it to the 220 setting but it didn’t help. The voltage getting to the Delta control PS is 107V, the tag says it should be 115V but the outputs seem correct.

To recap, everything is on, including the controller system, but there is nothing on the monitor and reset won’t start it. The monitor did come on once but not since.

Any insights or ideas are appreciated. I do have the set up manual for the mill, the delta 20 and a programming manual. I also have a set of schematics but they don’t include a lot of detail for the Delta.

I have a Dynapath Delta 20 on my cnc and from everything that I've learned about it you don't ever want to remove the battery with the power off. Now you need to re-enter the parameters before you will get it to run.

My machine also has switches on the carousel and if I forget to turn the air on the machine won't function until I turn the air on and the carousel raises up.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
I have a Dynapath Delta 20 on my cnc and from everything that I've learned about it you don't ever want to remove the battery with the power off. Now you need to re-enter the parameters before you will get it to run.

My machine also has switches on the carousel and if I forget to turn the air on the machine won't function until I turn the air on and the carousel raises up.

The one you own in imagination land? Where is a program, a picture? Strange you would show up here. Another stupid post, a Tree Journeyman 325 isn't a machining center and does not require air to function, it does not have a carousel. Stay out of threads like this you just look dumb.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
WDT failure probably just means it has exceeded allotted boot time. Take a picture of the power supply. If it looks similar to a PC styled one it is possible you can find a low cost off the shelf model that will configure. I have a machine that has two power supplies in it the OEM wants $600 each for, you can get them at an electric supply house for $30 each.
 

Big B

Diamond
Joined
Jun 26, 2009
Location
Michigan, USA
The one you own in imagination land? Where is a program, a picture? Strange you would show up here. Another stupid post, a Tree Journeyman 325 isn't a machining center and does not require air to function, it does not have a carousel. Stay out of threads like this you just look dumb.

Drinking a little early today or do you always start your day with a few shots of cheap vodka like you posted the picture of?

You don't own this forum you loser so keep your stupidity to yourself. I'll decide what I post and you decide what you post. What is it about you right wing morons that you think you can decide what others can say?

I know for a fact that you lose the parameters on a Delta 20 from reading it in the manual. I didn't say that it might do that like you did. You are guessing and I'm stating fact from the manual.

As to his mill not having a carousel, I'm aware of that but he did mention that the air needed to be on for it to run because of the lube system. "Then I was reading something that said not having air pressure and lube oil would limit certain things from working so I found that the air wasn’t on. I got that going and was surprised to see the monitor come on." I just added that my machine won't run without air either because of the carousel.

Maybe you think that everyone should bow down to you or you'll threaten to beat their ass like you did with me. You're such a hateful loser.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
Drinking a little early today or do you always start your day with a few shots of cheap vodka like you posted the picture of?

You don't own this forum you loser so keep your stupidity to yourself. I'll decide what I post and you decide what you post. What is it about you right wing morons that you think you can decide what others can say?

I know for a fact that you lose the parameters on a Delta 20 from reading it in the manual. I didn't say that it might do that like you did. You are guessing and I'm stating fact from the manual.

As to his mill not having a carousel, I'm aware of that but he did mention that the air needed to be on for it to run because of the lube system. "Then I was reading something that said not having air pressure and lube oil would limit certain things from working so I found that the air wasn’t on. I got that going and was surprised to see the monitor come on." I just added that my machine won't run without air either because of the carousel.

Maybe you think that everyone should bow down to you or you'll threaten to beat their ass like you did with me. You're such a hateful loser.

Most all machines lose parameters when the battery is pulled with the power off, so when I stated that I was sure I had a 99.9% chance of being right. The Tree Journeyman 325 is basically a manual mill retrofitted with a CNC control without a tool changer they would most likely have a manual or electric lube pump, NOT AIR. Look at a picture of a Tree 325 obvious electrical cable goes to the lube pump. Also if you OWNED a machining center why did you need to look in a manual to know they would alarm out with no air?

Caught lying AGAIN! Just stay out of threads like this for the sake of the people who need help, as you have no knowledge to pass on. You are doing a disservice, you could led someone down the wrong path as they have no idea of your lack of knowledge. Go start another useless Trump bashing thread and tone down your disgusting insults so it does not get locked and stay out of threads where people are requesting assistance.
 

3Wishes

Plastic
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
Thanks all for the responses. A couple points I want to clarify, I did read that the air and lube would possibly prevent booting but later I was told by the Dynapath guy that it didn’t have an effect on booting. The sequence of my bumbling was 1. Turn on air, 2, see it boot, 3. Shut down and replace batt (yes, later I read in the manual to do this with power on), 4, system now doesn’t boot even with air on.

The air on this machine is only for the tool holder release. If i believe the Dynapath guy then the one time it booted would be a coincidence. But maybe Tree did put it in the start up requirements and he just isn’t aware of it. At any rate, I have it on now and no boot. So that leaves the other variable of changing the battery with the power off. What happened was the guys that were trying to get it started before I got involved had pulled the battery (don’t know if they had the power on or off when they did it). But I discovered they put a regular 1.5V AA in it and it’s supposed to be a 3.6V lithium AA form factor. That one time it booted with the 1.5V batt and that’s when the monitor said the battery was low.

At this point I don’t know how I would re-enter the parameters if it won’t boot. I would think the boot system is on the EPROMs which would retain that information with the battery out. I thought the battery was to retain any user settings and programming in RAM.

I’ll try to attach some pics

A47F7F82-F008-47EB-A5A1-7287801B733E.jpg
 

3Wishes

Plastic
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
Sorry about the small and rotated pics. I’m not clear on how to work with pictures here
 

Big B

Diamond
Joined
Jun 26, 2009
Location
Michigan, USA
Most all machines lose parameters when the battery is pulled with the power off, so when I stated that I was sure I had a 99.9% chance of being right. The Tree Journeyman 325 is basically a manual mill retrofitted with a CNC control without a tool changer they would most likely have a manual or electric lube pump, NOT AIR. Look at a picture of a Tree 325 obvious electrical cable goes to the lube pump. Also if you OWNED a machining center why did you need to look in a manual to know they would alarm out with no air?

Caught lying AGAIN! Just stay out of threads like this for the sake of the people who need help, as you have no knowledge to pass on. You are doing a disservice, you could led someone down the wrong path as they have no idea of your lack of knowledge. Go start another useless Trump bashing thread and tone down your disgusting insults so it does not get locked and stay out of threads where people are requesting assistance.

FYI I didn't need to look in the manual to see why the carousel needed to be up. If I forget to turn the air off to the machine the screen shows a fault.

And now that I know that the supreme god of cnc's is in the house I'll make sure that you don't steer this guy wrong.

My first response to the OP, not to you but you always feel a need to troll me. I hope it makes you feel better.
 

Big B

Diamond
Joined
Jun 26, 2009
Location
Michigan, USA
Thanks all for the responses. A couple points I want to clarify, I did read that the air and lube would possibly prevent booting but later I was told by the Dynapath guy that it didn’t have an effect on booting. The sequence of my bumbling was 1. Turn on air, 2, see it boot, 3. Shut down and replace batt (yes, later I read in the manual to do this with power on), 4, system now doesn’t boot even with air on.

The air on this machine is only for the tool holder release. If i believe the Dynapath guy then the one time it booted would be a coincidence. But maybe Tree did put it in the start up requirements and he just isn’t aware of it. At any rate, I have it on now and no boot. So that leaves the other variable of changing the battery with the power off. What happened was the guys that were trying to get it started before I got involved had pulled the battery (don’t know if they had the power on or off when they did it). But I discovered they put a regular 1.5V AA in it and it’s supposed to be a 3.6V lithium AA form factor. That one time it booted with the 1.5V batt and that’s when the monitor said the battery was low.

At this point I don’t know how I would re-enter the parameters if it won’t boot. I would think the boot system is on the EPROMs which would retain that information with the battery out. I thought the battery was to retain any user settings and programming in RAM.

I’ll try to attach some pics

View attachment 341716

From what I've read you need to punch the parameters in manually from the keyboard. I can't send them to you from my manual now as I'm a couple thousand miles away but I think someone will have them for you on here. It may take a new thread to get them though.

And I apologize for the antics of citizenf16. He trolls every post that I make.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
From what I've read you need to punch the parameters in manually from the keyboard. I can't send them to you from my manual now as I'm a couple thousand miles away but I think someone will have them for you on here. It may take a new thread to get them though.

And I apologize for the antics of citizenf16. He trolls every post that I make.

Stop projecting, I posted here before you did so who is the troll? Also his machine does not have a carousel, could you be any stupider? Along of course of being a chronic liar living in imagination land?
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
Is the power supply the silver box on the upper right of the picture, that is what I was interested in. Even if all the parameters are gone it should still boot. First things first. You should list what city you are in,there might be someone local to you that could help you out.
 

3Wishes

Plastic
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
Is the power supply the silver box on the upper right of the picture, that is what I was interested in. Even if all the parameters are gone it should still boot. First things first. You should list what city you are in,there might be someone local to you that could help you out.

Yes, that’s the power supply. I’ve read there is a Meanwell PS that should be a good replacement for it. I think you are right, it should boot at least to where the monitor is displaying the start up checks. As it is the monitor won’t display anything so I can’t input anything. The cause is elusive. I’ve traced power to everything and the one place it is missing is the circuit that latches it on when you hit reset. It is being stopped somewhere on the terminal board that’s behind the keyboard. I am going to see if I can get the schematic for it from Dynapath. I’m in Oroville. CA.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
Yes, that’s the power supply. I’ve read there is a Meanwell PS that should be a good replacement for it. I think you are right, it should boot at least to where the monitor is displaying the start up checks. As it is the monitor won’t display anything so I can’t input anything. The cause is elusive. I’ve traced power to everything and the one place it is missing is the circuit that latches it on when you hit reset. It is being stopped somewhere on the terminal board that’s behind the keyboard. I am going to see if I can get the schematic for it from Dynapath. I’m in Oroville. CA.

A dead monitor is most always the monitor itself or the power supply. You could have multiple failures, that does happen. The power supplies I bought were Meanwells, they have held up well even during power company issues that took out the original power supplies. Did you check all the outputs and inputs on the power supply, sounds like you think it is ok? If it is hooked to a phase converter did you make sure if it has a wild leg that it was kept out of the control circuit? Pretty much all converters have a wild leg unless they are Phase Perfects. Oroville?, sounds like a like a small country town, never heard of it.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
Drinking a little early today or do you always start your day with a few shots of cheap vodka like you posted the picture of?

You don't own this forum you loser so keep your stupidity to yourself. I'll decide what I post and you decide what you post. What is it about you right wing morons that you think you can decide what others can say?

What do vodka and politics have to do with a guy needing assistance on trying to bring his machine to operating condition? You should not be posting misinformation in threads seeking help as you are doing a disservice. I found another bit of that saying the guy needs to punch in parameters by hand. I have never run that controller on a CNC mill, but I have ran many that are similar, all of them either had floppy drives or RS232 ports. Even if you go back to ones that used DOS commands they had a way of installing information with out pecking on the keyboard like a chicken. I used to think old timers unwilling to train people were the worst jackasses in the trade, now I have found someone worse, someone passing on misinformation because they are posing as someone way more knowledgeable that they are.
 

3Wishes

Plastic
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
A dead monitor is most always the monitor itself or the power supply. You could have multiple failures, that does happen. The power supplies I bought were Meanwells, they have held up well even during power company issues that took out the original power supplies. Did you check all the outputs and inputs on the power supply, sounds like you think it is ok? If it is hooked to a phase converter did you make sure if it has a wild leg that it was kept out of the control circuit? Pretty much all converters have a wild leg unless they are Phase Perfects. Oroville?, sounds like a like a small country town, never heard of it.

I’ve measured outputs from the PS and there is 24v, 15v, and 2 5v. I don’t know if they are correct or stable. The guy from Dynapath says that any red lights indicate a power fail. He says there is a line called Power Fail or PF on the PS. Any idea which one that is on that supply? The main power is directly from the panel. But as I mentioned it’s 208 3ph. But since there was the one time it did boot it doesn’t seem like the 208 should matter (the machine calls for 230).

Oroville is the county seat in Butte County, Northern CA but it is fairly small, 25000 people. It’s near Paradise CA, where the PGE caused Camp Fire burned down the town in 2018.
 

CITIZEN F16

Titanium
Joined
May 2, 2021
I’ve measured outputs from the PS and there is 24v, 15v, and 2 5v. I don’t know if they are correct or stable. The guy from Dynapath says that any red lights indicate a power fail. He says there is a line called Power Fail or PF on the PS. Any idea which one that is on that supply? The main power is directly from the panel. But as I mentioned it’s 208 3ph. But since there was the one time it did boot it doesn’t seem like the 208 should matter (the machine calls for 230).

Oroville is the county seat in Butte County, Northern CA but it is fairly small, 25000 people. It’s near Paradise CA, where the PGE caused Camp Fire burned down the town in 2018.

Is that the only power supply? A lot of CNC machines have two of them, usually a separate one of 24 DC running contractor coils. A power failure red light can also be generated by a board failure, it does not always point to the power supply itself. Most machines will happily run on 200-240 volts. Most OEMs use off the shelf power supplies, if your voltages on it aren't marked or there aren't voltages marked on the wire bands, get the part number off it and do some research. If it is obsolete without manufacturer information, someone on E-bay will be selling a used one and would probably know.

if by 2 5V, mean two 5 volt outputs the only thing that seems strange is 15 volts. 24's and 5's are common, but 15v, that seems odd to me.
 

3Wishes

Plastic
Joined
Feb 8, 2022
Is that the only power supply? A lot of CNC machines have two of them, usually a separate one of 24 DC running contractor coils. A power failure red light can also be generated by a board failure, it does not always point to the power supply itself. Most machines will happily run on 200-240 volts. Most OEMs use off the shelf power supplies, if your voltages on it aren't marked or there aren't voltages marked on the wire bands, get the part number off it and do some research. If it is obsolete without manufacturer information, someone on E-bay will be selling a used one and would probably know.

if by 2 5V, mean two 5 volt outputs the only thing that seems strange is 15 volts. 24's and 5's are common, but 15v, that seems odd to me.

Yes, two 5V outputs. I agree the 15 seems odd now that you mention it. I will be digging into it again this afternoon. I’ll pull the power supply, I’ve read there is a tag under it that shows the outputs. News at 11.
 








 
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