Vetting potential employees

[michiganbuck]

I think an interview is just a crap shoot.
Can you work with not using your phone, except for a short occasional call?
Do you have transportation and can be to work every day?
Can you work with not having long casual conversations with fellow workers?
You will be required to sign the 90-day no-reason termination agreement.
For an experienced guy ask what are 3 grinding ( or mill, lathe, CNC) hazards/problems to be careful of.
The interviewer should write down the answers so the manager or owner can see them.
A test is good? only if it tests real skills for the needs of the job, testing engineering skills for a machine operator is not so good. Even testing engineering skills for a machine hand or skill name can cause missing a great guy in the field. A guy who has to pull out his pocket-book-guide for a certain calculation may still be the best guy/worker in that field.

Good to have basic a list of rules
No fighting, theft, refusing to do work(other than a very good reason) poor attention to your job, excessive taking breaks, failing safety concerns and rules, failing to regard the boss's instructions. fail to get along with other workers and the boss, missing too many days.
Generally, you may get 3 chances, but for serious issues, you may be terminated at the first offense.
Asking personal questions like "have you ever been fired" is just lier's grace so no point in asking personal questions.
My brother applying for a tool maker job was well-liked by the PR guy, and walking about the shop with the boss was asked a ton of questions and answered well, then the boss asked have you ever repaired this kind of welder..No. Likely the Boss had a friend he wanted to hire and was just fishing for one question my brother would answer wrong.

 

[Pathogen]

Smokers, Alcoholic and drunk, on drugs prescription, illegal drugs, and they all did their jobs and were damn good at it, craftsmen, engineers, doctors, etc.

Some hide it so well you wouldn't know unless they were tested.

And some are worthless when not using.

 

[Comatose]

I tell ya what, if you guys run into qualified machinists transitioning, or using they/them/zhe/xir or whatver pronouns, send em my way. I can't see how any of that impacts their job performance and if all yall can't show people the slightest consideration and call them what they want to be called, my people can.

No different than continuing to call someone "Sport" if they hate that.

 

[huleo]

I'd like to think I am pretty good at identifying good character, but I have well learned that talk is cheap. Hand a man a shovel and tell him to dig a hole, and you will find out real quick what kind of person you got.

I had a new hire a long time ago. he was 20yrs older than me and I was sure he would get all spun about this kid telling him what to do. Due had ZERO mechanical skill! I mean, he was running wood screws in until they spin out, then let them smoke, turn black, and complain that the screws are junk.

However, to oppose the position that I am a hard ass, he became a good employee! He needed careful instructions, but he could follow them. It was annoying at times, but after the wood screw ordeal, I might remind him "once the head is seated, that is it, no further".... We became friends on the job. I realized he was detail oriented, and I am anal about certain things. It worked! He would not overstate his ability and just allow me to coach and help him so we can get jobs done. Then I apparently rubbed the very top brass the wrong way and was excused, leaving that guy to "run the show"..... I hope I taught him well enough....lol

 

[DDoug]

I'm sure I will get blasted but as I mentioned, I am trying to work methods to size people up as to who they are, but nothing is pass or fail. If that car has 3 car seats in it, he/she likely has mouths to feed and might have some motivation. Guy shows up in a new BMW telling me he is the best machinist in the state.....I might expect the stars on my tests. He might actually be, but may also be trying to fast track to o

ther employment too.

Nothing set in stone, just seeing what methods others might use.

So now your looking at how they arrived ?
I'm not hot waxing my truck just for you.

 

[huleo]

I tell ya what, if you guys run into qualified machinists transitioning, or using they/them/zhe/xir or whatver pronouns, send em my way. I can't see how any of that impacts their job performance and if all yall can't show people the slightest consideration and call them what they want to be called, my people can.

No different than continuing to call someone "Sport" if they hate that.

To each their own. Post your digits so I can forward a referral. We all have our reasons but let me explain something, if someone is going through an "identity crisis", I am not a crisis center. Get things sorted on your plumbing first.

 

[Shawnrs]

4) Do you plan on insisting we use your pronouns? NO

5) no hablo ingles

 

[Comatose]

To each their own. Post your digits so I can forward a referral. We all have our reasons but let me explain something, if someone is going through an "identity crisis", I am not a crisis center. Get things sorted on your plumbing first.

330 dash 634 dash 1430

In my experience, employees are ALWAYS having this crisis or that. One's always getting divorced, or their kid is sick, or their drinking has become a problem, or they're moving, or their car broke down, or their house got hit by a tree, or they need a surgery and will be out 16 weeks, or whatever. To have employees is to be a crisis center. I'm not sure one saying "I prefer they pronouns" raises to the level of a crisis, but to each their own.

I actually did have an employee transition while they worked for me, some years ago.

 

[10 fingers]

Over 25 years of running my own business and 10+ years of prior mgmt has yielded some good indicators of potential fits.
First, the list of instant disqualifications:
Unable to generate a data sheet or resume.
Chronic short term employment.
Late to an interview.
Looks at his cell phone. (I don't want to know it exists.)
Ball cap on backwards.
Head or neck tattoos.
Homemade/prison tattoos
Stink/poor hygiene
Obvious substance abuse
Smoker's cough
Filthy car. (if no respect for their own property, how will they treat my machines?)
Flaunting political/sexual/agenda bias

If pass the sniff test move on to interview:
Ask, "What did you do to prepare for this interview?"
Ask, "Do you own a Machinery's Handbook?"
Ask, "what do you know about us?" (Have they done research or desperate for any job irrespective of interest.)
Hand them a drawing and ask for sequence of mfg.
Ask, "exactly what machinist tools do you own?"
Make and model of every machine you became fluent with. (Bull shitters speak in vague terms.)
Discuss hobbies. (Does this person have friends and a social life? Or, is he an overbearing dolt?)
Attempt to discern if candidate has high standards. Does he take personal pride in a job well done?
Does a talent for finesse or fine detail exist? Associated hobbies like gunsmithing of watch repair that would make them a valuable machine builder.
Fluent with shop math? Offer a brief test including odd number hole patterns and sine plate usage.
Demonstrate perfect comprehension of surface footage calculation.

 

[kustomizer]

Over 25 years of running my own business and 10+ years of prior mgmt has yielded some good indicators of potential fits.
First, the list of instant disqualifications:
Unable to generate a data sheet or resume.
Chronic short term employment.
Late to an interview.
Ball cap on backwards.
Head or neck tattoos.
Homemade/prison tattoos
Stink/poor hygiene
Obvious substance abuse
Smoker's cough
Filthy car. (if no respect for their own property, how will they treat my machines?)
Flaunting political/sexual/agenda bias

If pass the sniff test move on to interview:
Ask, "What did you do to prepare for this interview?"
Ask, "what do you know about us?" (Have they done research or desperate for any job irrespective of interest.)
Hand them a drawing and ask for sequence of mfg.
Ask, exactly what machinist tools do you own?
Make and model of every machine you became fluent with. (Bull shitters speak in vague terms.)
Discuss hobbies. (Does this person have friends and a social life? Or, is he an overbearing dolt?)
Attempt to discern if candidate has high standards. Does he take personal pride in a job well done?
Does a talent for finesse or fine detail exist? Associated hobbies like gunsmithing of watch repair that would make them a valuable machine builder.
Fluent with shop math? Offer a brief test including odd number hole patterns and sine plate usage.
Demonstrate perfect comprehension of surface footage calculation.

That guy has his own shop and is there to steal your top guys

 

[DouglasJRizzo]

If someone "chokes up" on a test written in the context of their CORE CAPABILITIES, the place where they should be the most comfortable and experienced, that, all by itself is potentially an indicator the person isn't right for the job. Making high-dollar, complex parts, or grinding through high-repetition production provides far greater opportunities for really "choking up". Someone make a mistake, or someone putz up the specs fed to the machinists to begin with, and I can assure you the pucker-factor is more severe than anything a basic interview Test imposes.

That's just it. I've had folk who just couldn't do a written test. But could set up, indicate, and get rolling as good as anyone would want.
To me, and it's just my 2c, written exams are good for certain areas - and you made mention of that - but for general shop, I think the "test drive" is the best.

 

[Ries]

I find you just got to talk to them, for a while, and you can generally smell issues.
As an aside- I have had really good employees, who do, indeed require certain pronouns. No issues whatsoever.
Also had one who was undergoing a trans related surgery. Great employee.
Had some good old boys, who drove pickups, and some were great, and others, well- who knew part of being a boss is giving an advance to pay for the lawyer to make sure they didnt go to jail?
Although that worked out fine in the end, he worked another year, and paid everything off.
Takes all kinds.
Prejudging doesnt always work.
Had a butch lesbian with a crewcut once, would hire her back in a New York minute.

 

[kustomizer]

That's just it. I've had folk who just couldn't do a written test. But could set up, indicate, and get rolling as good as anyone would want.
To me, and it's just my 2c, written exams are good for certain areas - and you made mention of that - but for general shop, I think the "test drive" is the best.

My dyslexia has helped me fail written exams most of my life, but I can hold my own in the shop.

 

[DouglasJRizzo]

My dyslexia has helped me fail written exams most of my life, but I can hold my own in the shop.

Exactly! You're not the only one, either.

 

[michiganbuck]

What side of the start button do you push to get a machine started?
Who do you align with as the next president?
What bathroom do you use most often the Men's or Ladie's?
What helps you get through the day oxy cotton, pot or hasheesh?
If a bird poops on your car who would you shoot?
Name three techniques that help win a bar fight?

 

[jccaclimber]

The pronouns thing here sort of cracks me up. Admittedly I’m a layer removed from the shop most of the time, but due to my geography I've worked with a lot of people with pronouns that don’t match their birth certificate.

I’d say at least 50% of them I wouldn’t have noticed if it hadn’t come up in a casual conversation. I just don’t associate someone with a beard that I’ve always known as “he” as having originally been “she”. As for the other 50%, it doesn’t impact their work performance and so I don’t care.

Avoiding people with a strong agenda, sure, but that covers all kinds of topics. If a guy comes in talking about how their last 5 employers were dirtbags I’m going to lean towards not wanting to be #6.

As for qualifications, I’ve found that asking “why” and going into a bit of detail shuts down anyone who is trying to talk about someone else’s accomplishments.

Get a feel for what they’re good at, then go into detail there. No point in asking a lathe guy for complex mill fixturing questions. On the other hand, if he understands a lathe well and is motivated, you can probably teach him to run a mill. My first step is to find out if they’re good at *something*, then I start seeing how that applies to where I want them to go. A lot of people fail that first part.

 

[turnworks]

One thing I see places missing is most workers need to find a home whether its their main machine they run or welding booth. Back when I was doing the hiring if the new person wasn't nesting their area with in a couple weeks they never amounted to much or didn't last long.

 

[triumph406]

As an aside- I have had really good employees, who do, indeed require certain pronouns. No issues whatsoever.

If you want to use pronouns fine.

The problem becomes when somebody decides that they don't want to use somebodies pronouns, and then they get accused of being transphobic, then it gets complicated for the everybody involved, the trans person, the person who refuses to recognize pronouns, and the employer. And then there's going to be issues with the bathroom, .

Then some bodies going to say transwomen aren't women

Or somebodies going to say transwomen shouldn't compete against girls/women

Too many minefields

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If I had 2 candidates for a job, each were identical, except one was straight, and one was trans, no way in **** am I hiring the trans person. The potential problems they could cause to the smooth running of the company could be endless.

--------------------------------------------

Now if it's one of these ridiculously hot Thai trans gurls (with the long legs) interviewing for the secretarial job, that might be a difficult story.

 

[Matt@RFR]

You should really, REALLY think twice about what you're putting on the internet. Do you not realize that if anyone in the future complains to a lawyer that you discriminated against them, you just full-on admitted guilt in your above post.

The internet is not anonymous boys. Think.

 

[AJ H]

I don’t mind talking shop and answering some questions, but at this stage in my career if someone asks me to take a math test and a bunch of other nonsense I’m going to politely tell them to eat my ass.