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Wohlhaupter boring/facing head shanks. Are they all removable?
- Thread starter eKretz
- Start date
- Replies 57
- Views 7,426
Servicar rider
Cast Iron
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2008
- Location
- Coggon Iowa usa
I'm happy to see this thread because I picked up a UPA3 head with a Morse 4 taper shank which appears to have a integral shank and I want to machine it to a straight taper? Howe hard are these shanks to turn?
Extremely hard! Probably the toughest material ever came across,I used cbn inserts and the chips were flying out incandescent,but the inner shank its soft enough,but still I tried to screw/unscrew but it didn't moved of 1 mm so I still have no idea how to open it,I'm waiting for somebody who has the same boring head and maybe know better how it's made under that shank
LexD
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2002
- Location
- Riddells Creek,Victoria,Australia
Can you post a photo of the side of the head (similar to the one in post #3)? That will tell you what shank it was originally made with and if it has something like Mo.4 then that shows it had a solid Morse taper shank that was not removable.
Wohlhaupter did not silver solder the shanks so the one you have has been modified somewhere along the line.
Wohlhaupter did not silver solder the shanks so the one you have has been modified somewhere along the line.
Sure,in this case looks like an r8 shank but seem to be a little bit different,also strange that the model upa5 s6 comes only with mt5 shank going up.
i don't know if you see on 1st image like a stainless steel ring in the body, i assumed thats the contact point but even using enough strenght seem to be impossible to unscrew
LexD
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2002
- Location
- Riddells Creek,Victoria,Australia
I can't read the shank size in that blurry image but I can see that it is a UPA4 not a 5. Can you see my photos now? I'm not sure what I did wrong there,how do you manage to post your pictures?
trevj
Titanium
- Joined
- May 17, 2005
- Location
- Interior British Columbia
As a minor side note, I see that the lathes.co.uk site now has a page on the Wohlhaupter heads with a scan of a brochure in there that shows the shanks available, and some other useful data.
Wohlhaupter UPA Boring and Facing Heads
It would be interesting to see how this line-up changed over the years, but the info in the brochure is at least a snapshot of what was going on at that time.
There are a couple threads in the https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/machinery-manuals-and-brochures/ Machinery Manuals and Brochures sub forum.
There is a decent video of a strip-down and clean of a small size Kuroda (clone of Wohlhaupter)head on YouTube by Stephan Gotteswinter. Kuroda boring head teardown - YouTube
Several videos of changing the shanks as well.
Wohlhaupter UPA Boring and Facing Heads
It would be interesting to see how this line-up changed over the years, but the info in the brochure is at least a snapshot of what was going on at that time.
There are a couple threads in the https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/machinery-manuals-and-brochures/ Machinery Manuals and Brochures sub forum.
There is a decent video of a strip-down and clean of a small size Kuroda (clone of Wohlhaupter)head on YouTube by Stephan Gotteswinter. Kuroda boring head teardown - YouTube
Several videos of changing the shanks as well.
awander
Stainless
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2012
- Location
- Eastern PA
Which part of that makes you think of R8?
LexD
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2002
- Location
- Riddells Creek,Victoria,Australia
OK, we finally have enough information to identify the boring head, it is a UPA4 that was originally made with an integral ISO40 shank that accepted an M16 drawbar, the shank and the body of the head are one piece and cannot be removed unless you cut it off, as I did. It is a pity that someone tried to modify it because it would be more valuable as an ISO40.
trevj
Titanium
- Joined
- May 17, 2005
- Location
- Interior British Columbia
Two parts.
The main one being that they state they will make you a shank in any shape you desire, by special order. As long as the maximum dimension listed does not get exceeded.
The secondary one is that the taper portion of an R8 is essentially the same taper and size as the NMTB30 taper with a longer additional shank added, which makes me wonder if a fella could make an R8 out of a NMTB30 by grafting the back portion on to make it match.
If the question was not for me, quote the guy you are asking, eh.
Sorry for late reply guys,as usual you can find a lot of knowledge here,I want to thank you all for your help I'm not far from the solution,on Ebay I found for sale an upa4 s5 which is the same model I have and in that case was a removable shank,since I couldn't get over it I decided to uncover a small portion of the final part of the shank using a boring head and this is what I found..basically now I just need to find out how the shank is connected,because looking the thread I should be able to unscrew it normally counter clockwise,my biggest concerns are: what if instead of unscrew the shank from that center "thread" or "bolt" like the form of the head would suggest I have instead to unscrew the inner part clockwise direction like if it was a bolt to release the head and then anti clockwise to release the shank exactly how would work for an upa3 model? Because I'm really afraid if that inner part was a bigger bolt and the shank was modified from the previous owner to unscrew the shank instead of the inner " bolt" and risk to break any block pin ( if there Is any) like it is on the upa3 Head..because if you look carefully you can see a silver ring on the body and if I have to bet I'd say that's the end of the shank where is connected to the head.sorry I know i didn't explained myself very well but if you look at the pictures will be easier to understand
I do believe you're on the right path,looking at the wohlhaupter catalogues that's exactly what I thought ,hence the concern of trying to twist the shank counterclockwise or the inner part somehow clockwise,I'm really afraid to find the 2 blocking pins at the base like those òn the upa3 and damage them in the attempt
LexD
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2002
- Location
- Riddells Creek,Victoria,Australia
Good luck, you obviously want to do it your own way.
Hahaha!! Absolutely no,I don't know what I'm doing and I'm looking for help,because on one side I have somebody saying that the shank is not removable,on the other I have someone with the same model of boring head and has a removable shank,now I find out there is a thread in the center,so if there is even 1 chance to detach the shank without cutting it off then I would rather go in that direction,I'm just looking for some advice from you all now that we have these new informations,knowing what's on the bottom of that shank would be very helpful,so far I haven't found any person with that head with that type of shank
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
I haven't read your whole thread, so I apologize if I'm way off but any chance you're dealing with an adapter?
https://www.practicalmachinist.com/...haupter-upa-2-a-381941/?highlight=Wohlhaupter
https://www.practicalmachinist.com/...haupter-upa-2-a-381941/?highlight=Wohlhaupter
AlfaGTA
Diamond
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2002
- Location
- Benicia California USA
So the head as LexD points out above originally was built with an integral (read...NOT REMOVABLE) #40 taper shank that was ID threaded M16....
The head is so engraved....That is the way that it was built from the original manufacturer...
Pretty sure what you have is a head that someone has modified....looks like they added a section above the the original 40 taper, likely to change the
ID thread to accept a different draw bar....
Shank has been changed no longer #40 (pity) But its still not removable!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Only thing to remove is the extension...That shank (lower portion) will not be removable...its one piece below the modification.
No way to know how to remove the modified portion (looks to me that most has already been removed at his point...
Your best course is to forget removal of the shank because it is not possible.....
Make an adapter that uses the existing (remaining) shank to fit the spindle your have.....
Easiest is to make the shank a standard dimension straight shank, and grip using a collet or "Welden" style EM holder with a set screw....
Cheers Ross
The head is so engraved....That is the way that it was built from the original manufacturer...
Pretty sure what you have is a head that someone has modified....looks like they added a section above the the original 40 taper, likely to change the
ID thread to accept a different draw bar....
Shank has been changed no longer #40 (pity) But its still not removable!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Only thing to remove is the extension...That shank (lower portion) will not be removable...its one piece below the modification.
No way to know how to remove the modified portion (looks to me that most has already been removed at his point...
Your best course is to forget removal of the shank because it is not possible.....
Make an adapter that uses the existing (remaining) shank to fit the spindle your have.....
Easiest is to make the shank a standard dimension straight shank, and grip using a collet or "Welden" style EM holder with a set screw....
Cheers Ross
No worries!! I wasn't super clear in the explanation, Alfa GTA gave us the solution,after saw that upa4 s5 on Ebay I thought being the same model that my shank was removable as well..but unfortunately it isn't so I will just machine it down to a straight shank and make an adaptor or I'll keep doing the work I've been doing so far with the boring head and I'll expose the whole m16 thread and later on I will make an adaptor to screw on it
