Haas machine for the garage

davidp8282 · Sep 2, 2021

Hey guys I plan on purchasing a Haas 3 axis mill for the garage and I’m stuck between a the TM0P and Mini Mill. I’ll be working mainly with aluminum making car parts and some stainless steel for making things like golf putter and car parts.

I know the TM0P is fairly new so I don’t see many reviews on that machine. I spoke with one of the sales reps from Haas and they suggested that I get the mini mill if I’ll be working with steel due to the structure and options being better for the Mini Mill? I’m not exactly sure what he meant by the structure being better, but I did notice there were more additional options for the Mini Mill than the TM0P.

Regarding the options for the TM0P I chose the options that people on the forums suggested but not too sure if it’s really recommended or more of a nice to have. If there is an option you guys think that I won’t need and could save some money please advise me so. Here are the following options:
- 10k rpm spindle
- 4th axis drive and wiring
- WIPS (Probe system)
- Chip Auger
- High Speed Machining
- Rigid Tapping

Air compressors I noticed there’s the classic piston compressor and rotary compressor. Can you guys give me some recommendation on which compressor is the best bang for the buck. I’m not too sure what size gallon I should get and a rotary would be nice due to its low decibel noise but I prefer to save some money if possible ????
I look forward to the discussions and appreciate any feedback. Cheers.

Ianagos · Sep 2, 2021

I can’t speak to the haas as all the ones I’ve used have been sub par.

Maybe look into doosan they have some very competitively priced options for starting out. Typically cheaper than haas once you consider the options that come standard.

Also look at the thread about brother machines for a job shop. I don’t recommend one for a job shop but if you are mostly doing aluminum do dads it can be great and they are designed to be able to be moved with a pallet jack. They are also pretty affordable.

If you want a used machines there a few good options there. Definitely stay away from older used haas.

Onto compressors

I think for a small shop a piston compressor is better. The cheap screw compressors aren’t amazing from what I hear.

I got an emax 7.5hp piston compressor and while it is a bit small for my needs it’s been great for me. Pretty slow rpm motor and it’s not as loud as the typical high rpm options you see for sale. It has more of a thumping sound but mine is not in my main shop so no worries for me.

IcarusMW · Sep 3, 2021

I just got rid of a minimill I ran in my garage for over a year, so I have some experience here.

as far as machine choice, either will work for you. the MM is more rigid in some areas than the previous TM, but the new TM is a massive improvement.

a MM will require some parts to be removed to get under a garage door -- your HFO will charge you a couple hours labor for this. you'll also have to cut a hole in the ceiling drywall if you have any to allow for the cable carrier. I believe the new TM is low enough that you don't have to worry about those things.

keep in mind neither will ship for a while if you're buying new. Haas isn't currently building the small mills/lathes (smaller than VF2 or ST15) due to chip shortages -- they're focusing on the larger machines.

davidp8282 · Sep 3, 2021

Thanks for the reply

I don't have dry wall in my garage so ceiling clearance wont be an issue. The sales rep did mention that a mini mill has a 18 week lead time and 12 weeks for a TM0. BTW what compressor did you run for the mini mill when you had it in your garage?

TwinSpool · Sep 3, 2021

If you're mainly working small parts get the mini mill. The only reason to get the TM is if you're running large parts and need the travels. You probably don't need an auger if you're making small batches. If you're running aluminum definitely get the 10k spindle. I'd recommend the SMM if you can swing it. The WIPS is worth every penny. Same with high speed milling and rigid tapping. 4th axis is whether or not you have the work to justify it. You can always add that later.

If you can drop 4th and auger and make up the difference to a SMM that would be a good choice IMO.

LOTT · Sep 3, 2021

A Mini Mill with those options is over $50k, and I just don't see the value proposition. You can get vastly more capable machines from a variety of builders for that (or less) money.

If you have a high paying job and don't mind putting that into a hobby machine to play with, then go for it. But if this is the beginning of a shop I think you could get a much better and more capable machine for the money, and barely any bigger.

To clarify- I'm not saying the Mini Mill is a hobby machine itself, I'm referring to whether or not this is a hobby for the OP.

Rstewart · Sep 3, 2021

I've made some fairly impressive parts on a mini mill. Yes, it's a Haas and a "mini" at that but they're capable. Are you looking to make money, or do you just have the money for hobby? Tyson Lamb started on a MM making putters and we saw how that turned out $$$$$.
I now program bigger and better machines, but if I was buying for my garage, it'd probably be a Haas mini.
Get the probe for sure, air blast, and the auger.
Just my 2¢

Renegade212 · Sep 3, 2021

Sorry I only read the initial post.. I have 2 haas tm mills, a 1p and a 3p both 2007 models. First off I have beat the living snot out of both. I've made hundreds of thousands between the 2 machines which I picked up for a combined total of 40k. When I was 24 just starting to dip my tip in machining these guys were perfect. I've slammed the spindles down full rapid and they don't seem to have the power to do anything other than break the tool/part but not hurt the machines themselves. Put 30 yards of 4140 chips through the tm1p in the last 6 months. Would I ever buy another one? Absolutely not.....

- cheap 20 gallon piston compressor is all you need
-chip auger is useless
-if you get a 10k spindle don't run anything of any duration at high rpm. Ive cooked cartridges this way.
- these tm mills don't move fast enough to waste money on hsm feature. Get a CAM with a good filter for high speed paths and your golden.
-probes are nice but if your buying a tool mill your not doing anything that a 10$ edgefinder can't handle. That being said I hold .0005 all day.
-get a bigger coolant tank

Moral of the story is find a bigger garage and get a fadal

wheelieking71 · Sep 4, 2021

Renegade212 said:
Sorry I only read the initial post.. I have 2 haas tm mills, a 1p and a 3p both 2007 models. First off I have beat the living snot out of both. I've made hundreds of thousands between the 2 machines which I picked up for a combined total of 40k. When I was 24 just starting to dip my tip in machining these guys were perfect. I've slammed the spindles down full rapid and they don't seem to have the power to do anything other than break the tool/part but not hurt the machines themselves. Put 30 yards of 4140 chips through the tm1p in the last 6 months. Would I ever buy another one? Absolutely not.....

- cheap 20 gallon piston compressor is all you need
-chip auger is useless
-if you get a 10k spindle don't run anything of any duration at high rpm. Ive cooked cartridges this way.
- these tm mills don't move fast enough to waste money on hsm feature. Get a CAM with a good filter for high speed paths and your golden.
-probes are nice but if your buying a tool mill your not doing anything that a 10$ edgefinder can't handle. That being said I hold .0005 all day.
-get a bigger coolant tank

Moral of the story is find a bigger garage and get a fadal &#55357;&#56846;

In red ^^^^ Bullshit. I'm not experienced with haas MINI's. But I'm pretty sure in '07 they were air/mist cooled spindles just like the larger mills.
I've owned 5 haas's and ran countless. I have never seen a spindle go bad from extended high RPM.
All 3 of my current machines are SS models. And the spindles pretty much live at 12,000RPM. All day, every day.
If the tool is an end-mill? You can pretty much bet it is spinning 12k. Unless it is larger than 1/2" or longer than 2". Its spinning 12k.
An old employee even crashed one of mine bad enough about 6 years ago that it changed the pitch and volume of the sound it makes while running.
I figured "well, I might get another 30 days out of that spindle". It is still going strong.
Tool balance (harmonics) kill spindles. Time? Not so much.

Renegade212 · Sep 4, 2021

wheelieking71 said:
In red ^^^^ Bullshit. I'm not experienced with haas MINI's. But I'm pretty sure in '07 they were air/mist cooled spindles just like the larger mills.
I've owned 5 haas's and ran countless. I have never seen a spindle go bad from extended high RPM.
All 3 of my current machines are SS models. And the spindles pretty much live at 12,000RPM. All day, every day.
If the tool is an end-mill? You can pretty much bet it is spinning 12k. Unless it is larger than 1/2" or longer than 2". Its spinning 12k.
An old employee even crashed one of mine bad enough about 6 years ago that it changed the pitch and volume of the sound it makes while running.
I figured "well, I might get another 30 days out of that spindle". It is still going strong.
Tool balance (harmonics) kill spindles. Time? Not so much.

Dude its called a "CARTRIDGE" for a reason. Haas doesn't make anything air over oil unless your getting into the really expensive options. All I meant was if you surface stuff like I do don't crank 10k for 12 hrs because you will push the grease out of the bearings because they are most certainly NOT a/o.

TwinSpool · Sep 4, 2021

Renegade212 said:
Dude its called a "CARTRIDGE" for a reason. Haas doesn't make anything air over oil unless your getting into the really expensive options. All I meant was if you surface stuff like I do don't crank 10k for 12 hrs because you will push the grease out of the bearings because they are most certainly NOT a/o.

My Haas has an oil line going to the spindle. Similar to the routing in the below link.

I think the main value proposition for the Haas is cheap parts and easy to fix. They put out a ton of service content on YouTube.

I just had an air line split going to the spindle. It took several hours to replace. Would have been an expensive service call. I'm not sure what class of machine you'd have to step into to get significantly less maintenance.

Spindle Minimum Lubrication System - Troubleshooting Guide

Renegade212 · Sep 4, 2021

TwinSpool said:
My Haas has an oil line going to the spindle. Similar to the routing in the below link.

I think the main value proposition for the Haas is cheap parts and easy to fix. They put out a ton of service content on YouTube.

I just had an air line split going to the spindle. It took several hours to replace. Would have been an expensive service call. I'm not sure what class of machine you'd have to step into to get significantly less maintenance.

Spindle Minimum Lubrication System - Troubleshooting Guide

What model, rpm is your machine?

eaglemike · Sep 4, 2021

wheelieking71 said:
In red ^^^^ Bullshit. I'm not experienced with haas MINI's. But I'm pretty sure in '07 they were air/mist cooled spindles just like the larger mills.
I've owned 5 haas's and ran countless. I have never seen a spindle go bad from extended high RPM.
All 3 of my current machines are SS models. And the spindles pretty much live at 12,000RPM. All day, every day.
If the tool is an end-mill? You can pretty much bet it is spinning 12k. Unless it is larger than 1/2" or longer than 2". Its spinning 12k.
An old employee even crashed one of mine bad enough about 6 years ago that it changed the pitch and volume of the sound it makes while running.
I figured "well, I might get another 30 days out of that spindle". It is still going strong.
Tool balance (harmonics) kill spindles. Time? Not so much.

They were grease/cartridge spindles. I bought a MM2 in 2012, it was advertised as oil/air. When I got it, was grease/cartridge. Haas offered to extend warranty on the spindle for a year. BFD. Other than that, TS. They changed the website the next day, and accused me of being "confused" when the site has clearly said that.
Also, on my Super MiniMill, the installer said they were not made to run 10K all the time, even though 10K spindle.
Just another reason to run Brother. 10K for as long as you need.

mhajicek · Sep 4, 2021

You could always do a Mini Mill 2.

Houndogforever · Sep 4, 2021

One thing that always makes me cringe about a Haas machine is that they offer a second year of warranty, and it costs $5-6k.
Are they really thinking that paying $5000 now is a savings for year 2? How much maintenance/warrant work does a new machine need?

If the manufacturer thinks it will need more than$5000 service in year two, then I am not sure I want to buy in.

Renegade212 · Sep 4, 2021

Houndogforever said:
One thing that always makes me cringe about a Haas machine is that they offer a second year of warranty, and it costs $5-6k.
Are they really thinking that paying $5000 now is a savings for year 2? How much maintenance/warrant work does a new machine need?

If the manufacturer thinks it will need more than$5000 service in year two, then I am not sure I want to buy in.

I'm still wish I would have bought a fadal for my first "garage" machine. Little slow, yes, but if its tight you'll have more rigidity than a haas vf all day long. Now I run all hardinge V series and no looking back. I still abuse the tool mills daily though.

mhajicek · Sep 4, 2021

Houndogforever said:
One thing that always makes me cringe about a Haas machine is that they offer a second year of warranty, and it costs $5-6k.
Are they really thinking that paying $5000 now is a savings for year 2? How much maintenance/warrant work does a new machine need?

If the manufacturer thinks it will need more than$5000 service in year two, then I am not sure I want to buy in.

You can often get them to throw that in as a freebie.

Houndogforever · Sep 4, 2021

mhajicek said:
You can often get them to throw that in as a freebie.

I would hope so, however they still establish a value of it so they can "give" you X dollar value.

I bet if you said, nah, I don't want the second year, but I will take $5,000 off the price they would say no.

Extended warranty on a machine tool just screams "I'm disposable".

plastikdreams · Sep 4, 2021

Lol the haas hate is strong once again...

Renegade212 · Sep 5, 2021

plastikdreams said:
Lol the haas hate is strong once again...

Haas has made a lot of people a lot of money over the years. Bottom line is there are a lot of builders making better machines for the same or less money. Now if i had a product and Haas sold marketing services that screams fortune 50.

Haas machine for the garage

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