Anyone really familiar with Norton grinders? - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    " But I have not dealt with any vacuum controls. What does the vacuum side do ? Could the vacuum system be replaced with an electrical system ?"
    Well texasgunsmith, you're either REALLY a young guy or joking! VACUUM tubes- those little glass thingies that used to be in every TV and radio
    before 1970- In this grinder, they converted AC current to DC current for running the DIRECT CURRENT work head motor. There's NOTHING in this grinder that works with VACUUM- or the absence of air pressure. Before Variable Frequency Drives, DC motors were a method to get speed control. The grinder at HGR has the TUBES removed, and a solid state DC controler mounted on the left side of the machine. So you're okay- no vacuum controls to convert to electrical.

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasgunsmith View Post
    But I have not dealt with any vacuum controls. What does the vacuum side do ? Could the vacuum system be replaced with an electrical system ?
    .
    Sorry, but that gave me a really nice giggle right there......

  4. #23
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    Did you buy it?

  5. #24
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    Why would he buy it? You scared him off with the vacuum motors. Despite the slightly more modern DC controller hanging off the side.

    The 10 X 20 is a pretty nice machine for a small shop. Completely self contained with no external coolant tank, no swinging around the OD wheelhead
    to do ID grinding, it's the full meal deal for small parts. With a hydraulically actuated table, I think it's vastly superior to a tool and cutter grinder.
    If you're only doing ONE part maybe a tool and cutter grinder might be okay, but a real cylindrical grinder wins hands down for any real serious grinding.
    The Norton with a ten inch wheel, mine has a D-1-3 spindle so it takes the same chucks as a Monarch 10EE, is much better than my Cincinati #2 tool and cutter grinder.
    But every one can certainly think differently.

    Now of course a machine from HGR MAY not be anything more than a project. Undoubtably a very used machine.

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  7. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
    " But I have not dealt with any vacuum controls. What does the vacuum side do ? Could the vacuum system be replaced with an electrical system ?"
    Well texasgunsmith, you're either REALLY a young guy or joking! VACUUM tubes- those little glass thingies that used to be in every TV and radio
    before 1970- In this grinder, they converted AC current to DC current for running the DIRECT CURRENT work head motor. There's NOTHING in this grinder that works with VACUUM- or the absence of air pressure. Before Variable Frequency Drives, DC motors were a method to get speed control. The grinder at HGR has the TUBES removed, and a solid state DC controler mounted on the left side of the machine. So you're okay- no vacuum controls to convert to electrical.
    Lol, yea, i can see that being pretty funny. No, I never worked any tube type electronics, and while I'm not a total geezer, I don't think I'm that young, haha.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mebfab View Post
    Did you buy it?
    No missed out. I was kind of dragging my feet through the holiday weekend, thinking I'd make an offer Tuesday when they'd be back for business, but someone bought it straight out in the early hours before me. One reason I was digging it, is it looked pretty well complete, with drop down ID still there, chuck on back side of headstock, and even had a steady rest laying down in the coolant catching tray, plus the little increment adjuster on feed wheel. I was trying to do some research to find info on it, man very little out there I found, as you said.

    I had made my mind to get it anyway though because it looked most complete. But I was also dragging my feet because I was trying to choose between that, Brown and Sharpe #2 cylindrical, and a Cincinnati 10 x 24. The B & S is WW2 era, and has pretty simple controls, and something about it I really like, however I have also not found any useful info on it.

    In the end I picked up the Cincinnati. One, the cost came in nice with a little negotiation. I got machine and shipping cost combined. Two, once complete I think it will be the better machine than that particular B & S. Plus I got it cheaper than I think I would have ended paying for the Norton. Plus it seems like there are more parts, info and manuals on the Cincinnati. One reason I got it cheaper, some pieces are missing. The tail stock is gone, as well as the drop down ID attachment, though the ID motor is still there. Also I know some 10x 24's had basically remote coolant and hydraulic tanks, not sure if this also is that way, but I figure I'll work it out. It's a 1954 10 x 24 universal. Serial 4U2B5B-39, model ER.

    I picked up a parts book for a 1966 version. Also found a spec sheet on a 1947 version. Hate to hijack the thread with Cincinnati talk, but if anyone knows links to 1954 model ER's I'd appreciate it. I'll probably start a thread on it at some point, just not sure if under abrasive, antique and vintage, or Cincinnati specific forum locales, any suggestions ? Thanks.

    5.jpg7.jpg11.jpg

  8. #26
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    Isnt that the one they called a "knee hole" grinder?

    How much was shipping?

    What are you going to do about the missing ID spindle? I have been thinking about chinese router spindles off ebay.

  9. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mebfab View Post
    Isnt that the one they called a "knee hole" grinder?

    How much was shipping?

    What are you going to do about the missing ID spindle? I have been thinking about chinese router spindles off ebay.
    Not sure about the knee hole part.

    Hard to say exact number for shipping, as I bundled the shipping, loading, and machine cost into one, but I paid $2000 total for everything. That's shipping 1100 miles on a flatbed that I specified because I don't have a loading dock for van freight, and I doubt anyone could move it with a pallet jack.

    The ID spindle is not a huge priority at the moment. In fact if the whole machine turns into a giant project, I'll put it on the side for the time being. I plan to take a few days or so to go over it, if it can operate great. If not I'll let it sit till I get to it. I have two other machines that have higher priority to me for major tear downs.

    But I often allow myself to get side tracked, so I'm sure I'll tinker with this along the way. I plan to keep scanning for original parts, but I was already thinking I could fab the whole drop down ID assembly, at least until I come across one. I was also thinking I can make a base to clamp to inside table, and use the upper portion of a 9 or 10" lathe tail stock to mount to the fabricated base for my missing tailstock.

    Not sure the validity, or cost, but the Cincinnati website claims to hold all the prints to machines going back to the 30's or 40's I believe, and the site says they'll make any part you need, so another possible option.

    Right now I re-arranging my shop, and moving machines to fit this, the foot print is kind of large for my work space.

  10. #28
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    Couple of comments:
    1) you can move that around with a 5000# pallet jack.
    2) I happen to have an extra tailstock for that grinder that I would sell. If you're interested, send me a PM or e-mail at
    dmcgearsATyahooDOTcom

    That crap tan paint indicates it probably came out of a government facility and is most likely in good condition. If so, loosing something like a tail stock is pretty standard procedure!

    They are great little grinders. Dan

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  12. #29
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    Me and Dan have chatted, and I think its going to work out, which I really appreciate. For anyone interested I started a new thread on this machine here:
    http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...achine-344937/


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