Are my spindle bearings fucked?? - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by eKretz View Post
    I agree that the lines are too regular to be a spindle bearing problem. There's no way the spindle would stay clocked to the table like that to make straight lines all the way across.

    I don't think this machine has a rack though. I believe it's like my Micromaster in that it uses a hydraulic cylinder to move the table back and forth.

    It has a rack and pinion drive on the hand feed wheel. Tha automatic feed is hydraulic. That was the reason for my question about whether Marcus had been using the hand feed or not.



    PS:- 0.0003" runout is a bent spindle. But that shouldn't be the cause of the observed pattern.

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  3. #22
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    Is the grinding wheel tight in the wheel adapter?

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    When I moved to my current shop the manual grinder had the same issue. No amount of balancing the wheel or dressing solved it. All the other toolmakers dismissed it saying the grinder was "junk". It didn't sit well with me that the column squealed when the head was moved more than 6 inches off the table. I filled the oil reservoir and ran the head all the way up and down a few times, no more squealing. Ran the table back and forth while traversing the cross feed a few times and the waves went away.

  5. #24
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    One more thing- my grinder only works well when all four feet are in firm contact with the floor. Not only should it be level, but the load should be shared equally between the feet. When mine wasn't, it was much more prone to chatter.

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    If its a J&S 540 model, the flat drive belt if its been replaced at some point, should have a scaffed join in it otherwise there is a possibility of pantographing through the spindle when the join such as a lap one goes over the drive pulley. Alan.

  7. #26
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    Well I found the problem.
    Man do I ever feel stupid!!

    So I spoke in the past about trying to resurrect an old walker Ceramax chuck that came with the machine.
    I cleaned it up, and fixed it up but it still was not entirely satisfactory, so I went out and ordered a new one...it hasn't arrived yet but I'm in a pinch and need a grinder now.

    The grinder came with a sine magnet and it's stiff as hell so getting it down hard on the roll is almost impossible and there's no feature to force it down or clamp it in position.
    Stupid British design, (Ratcliffe) but hey, it was part of the package.
    So to get me out of a jam, I'll just stick the sine magnet on the platen and bolt it down.

    Turns out the sine mag chuck is bouncing at the free end as I run over it.
    I discovered it when I finally noticed the finish was way worse at the free end than at the pivot end.

    I stuck a little clamp onto the chuck at the free end, popped a workpiece onto the pivot end...the machine grinds just fine.
    I can't believe it took me so long to figure it out...I must be losing it in my dotage or something.

    So thanks to all with your suggestions and opinions; all were appreciated, I feel like a raw beginner (I've been surface grinding for forty years, but I may as well have seen my first grinder yesterday for all the brilliance of my diagnostic acumen) and I had a nice slice of humble pie today.

    But all is good now...my faith in the grinder is restored, and I'll never think unkind thoughts again when a beginner or a hobby guy asks an obvious question.

    Cheers

    Marcus
    Implant Mechanix • Design & Innovation > HOME
    Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

  8. #27
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    Sure, it's stupidly simple once you figure it out. Until then, not so much. Good job!

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    Marcus,
    Thanks for sharing your results.
    In a way I'm glad to know that I am not the only one who has moments like that from time to time or as it seems more frequently lately , even if it wasn't that particular problem .
    I don't use the surface grinder as often as various my cutter grinders but I was reminded of a few things I should pay more attention to in some of the other posts and some of the tips in the Suburban Tool videos that may come in handy some day .
    Maybe the thread will help someone else with their grinder issues when they find it in the future
    Jim

  11. #29
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    Maybe not funny at the time, but it’s a funny story. Glad you got it sorted.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    I had a customer who claimed his auction bough SG was no good because of a bad spindle.
    I pulled the wheel and it ran smooth as silk..the wheel had been coolant soaked and ran out of balance. I put on one of my wheels and it ground near perfect.

    Sometimes one can put such a wheel in a tub of washing water for a few days and clean to be Ok..Or break it in half and to the dumpster.

    Not Marcus's problem because he said he balanced this wheel.

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    QT: [Turns out the sine mag chuck is bouncing at the free end as I run over it.]

    So the whack whack with the hammer handle but end might have worked..and you guys thought I was joking.

    It was a good thread and some good grinding tricks were stated...

    QT: *[Maybe the thread will help someone else with their grinder issues when they find it in the future]

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    These machine are remarkably resilient, even with worn things...
    I changed my original almost-40-yr-old spindle bearings in January, not because I'd had a finish or flatness issue, but because the spindle was so incredibly stiff to move by hand.
    The back bearing was actually fine, but the front bearing was almost locked solid with rigid 40yr old greased-for-life grease that had hardened like glue. The balls were skidding around the race rather than rolling.

    The usual expert sources wanted the soul of my second child for a replacement bearing, but I got an equivalent P4/ABEC7 from Misumi in Germany for a fraction of what they wanted. And these are so easy to change out and set up again.

    old-bearing.jpg new-bearing.jpg

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    Glad to hear you solved your dilemma and that it's nothing major. Nice grinder.

    A small Satori usually comes with a slice of humble pie for desert. Good for all of us now and then.

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    Those ruby red wheels are hard as hell.......

    I would use a softer ceramic or aluminum oxide for table dress.

    Coarse finish on wheel.

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    Hi Cash:
    It's a 46 J Triumph wheel.
    Not ideal for grinding soft steels but I've used them successfully in the past for tasks like these.

    It just happened to be the wheel that was on the hub at the time...I do have some blue 46J seeded gel wheels (I think they're Nortons) and some plain white Rappold 46 J aluminum oxide wheels.
    I just have to pick one, mount it, dress it and balance it.

    Any preference from that short list?

    Cheers

    Marcus
    Implant Mechanix • Design & Innovation > HOME
    Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

  20. #36
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    I don't think seeded gel wheels are a good choice for small grinders or soft steels. Mine have been expensive and disappointing, though they work well enough on hardened steels. Go with the white alox wheel.

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    In my experience you've really gotta push the SG wheels to get the grit to break down and "resharpen." If you're not doing heavy roughing or cutting vicious hard steel the plain Jane wheels are better IMO. I like both the white AlOx and the pink wheels, they both work really well in the appropriate hardness for the application. For a cast iron surface you'd be better off with a SiC (green) wheel though. Although an AlOx will still work too, just be ready for frequent dressing of the wheel if you are doing more than a dust cut. Cast iron loads a wheel like crazy. If I had to pick one from the 3 listed I'd go for the white wheel. Stop as soon as you notice any wheel loading effects (you can usually hear it and see the change in finish) and redress so you don't get a lot of extra heat.

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    Hi Conrad Hoffman and eKretz:
    Yeah, I found the blue seeded gel wheels really shone for hardened D-2 die sections and punches, were still pretty good for hardened mold steels and were not great for soft steels but got used anyway just because I was too lazy to change the wheel.

    I always liked the Tyrolit and Rappold brands of plain aluminum oxide wheels for general grinding of materials like mold bases and commodity grade steels like 4140, but they performed poorly on hardened D-2 compared to the SG wheels.

    Of course, being the lazy shit I am, if it was a white wheel on the machine and if it was only a single D-2 or Stavax block I grit my teeth, dressed the wheel a lot and beat my way through the job even when I knew better.

    I never bought a pink wheel in my life...all were gifted to me one way or the other over the years, and I never found them exceptional in any regard...certainly not so much as to make me go out and buy some more.

    Interesting tidbit about silicon carbide wheels against cast iron...I never thought to try it the few times I had CI to grind.
    Another place I did find them super useful and not commonly known was for grinding graphite EDM electrodes back when I was still employed as a toolbreaker (I make Telco trodes now to avoid the mess of graphite)
    That's a good tip eKretz...thank you for that!

    This is a good topic for the thread to have morphed into...all contributions in that new vein are very welcome.

    Too bad we can't change the thread title anymore, but as cnctoolcat pointed out in post #2, it is eye catching , so maybe it'll still get lots of views and new input.

    Cheers

    Marcus
    Implant Mechanix • Design & Innovation > HOME
    Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

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    I'd get a squirt bottle of coolant and keep it hosed down...works well for me at least, even on aluminium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by plastikdreams View Post
    I'd get a squirt bottle of coolant and keep it hosed down...works well for me at least, even on aluminium.
    It seems that pink hand soap sold in gallon bottles mal\es a good coolant. Most if not all brands have enough washing soda to help avoid rusting parts.
    Just dry washing soda and water makes a good coolant for grinding and machining.

    and it is safe enough to not harm the environment.

    I think for general one-ups and few-ups surface grinding one can't beat a white AO wheel for cost and performance.
    Yes. a few shapes, grit sizes and hardnesses are needed.
    a 1/2" wide very hard small grit for a small radius inside corner. perhaps 150 m.
    1/2 and 3/4" wide 46k for general purpose.
    a 1 1/2" wide 46 recess wheel so you can face grind to an inside step corner and not hit the wheel mount and use it doe topping.( box of auction wheels can be handy).
    Make a chart for corner radius obtainable with a certain grit size.
    A gauge plate perhaps 8x 12 x 5/8" to be a bench surface/gauging plate
    angle plate, simple diamond wheel dresser (1 x 1 1/2 x 3" homemade) pair of 123 blocks(economy)That can be used as an angle plate, couple of 6" light duty C Clamps, 6 or 8" fine hone stone, V block with a clamp that can side set so to avoid grinding the clamp, safe place to put wheels, a sharpi marker, surface gauge so to check squareness, measuring tools as needed, set of jo blocks if doing a lot of close work.
    Note: for an inside corner you feel a parked wheel to set your down and cross numbers, make a note so not to crash.

    Grit size RE: (A 46gt wheel might give a .03/.040 about inside corner at best)
    ANSI Particle Size Conversion Chart | Washington Mills


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