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New to me ... Jones & Shipman 540 Questions

Jersey John

Stainless
Joined
May 29, 2015
Location
Beccles / Suffolk, United Kingdom
Hi folk ... Just got a Jones & Shipman 540 Surface Grinder and have a few basic questions:

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Firstly: Serial numbers, there seems to be two, one is stamped in the Lefthand End of the table (1839/74) but where is the second one please (71074)?? and is 71xxx the year.

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Also I want to remove the main outer ring of the Cross feed handle, it seems to be held by three Cap Heads but doesn't want to move ... ??? Is there something else I should be doing??

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Finally, the hydraulic oil is pretty dirty IMO ... how often would you replace the filter in the oil tank??

Many thanks

John
 
The outer/fiducial ring is held on by a a retaining ring that's held by screws into the back of the handwheel. IIRC you need to remove the feed reversing T-handle and the four-star locking knob, then the three Allen screws inbord of those ones. After that, the wheel should be able to come off. There's a bloody gread oil seal around the rim, so it'll be a bit of a struggle.

I might also have misremembered.

Maybe Bruce Allen will chip in?

The serial number is what's on the table. The ones on the nameplate are almost-certainly factory numbers from it's previous home.
 
To access the oil pump and sump remove the lower front panel.
IIRC it is possible to remove and clean the sump through this access but it requires undoing the hydraulic lines and swearing while wiggling the tank out of the machine. There is a basic screen on the inlet, and the filtration seems to be by settling only.
 
The outer/fiducial ring is held on by a a retaining ring that's held by screws into the back of the handwheel. IIRC you need to remove the feed reversing T-handle and the four-star locking knob, then the three Allen screws inbord of those ones. After that, the wheel should be able to come off. There's a bloody gread oil seal around the rim, so it'll be a bit of a struggle.

I might also have misremembered.

Maybe Bruce Allen will chip in?

The serial number is what's on the table. The ones on the nameplate are almost-certainly factory numbers from it's previous home.

Hi Mark - Thanks very much for the reply, really was not expecting that process to take the knurled ring off. I think it may have to stay there until I get to know the machine more.

As for the serial number on the L/H end of the table ... Is it safe to assume the 74 is the year of build?

Appreciate your time ...

John :cheers:
 
To access the oil pump and sump remove the lower front panel.
IIRC it is possible to remove and clean the sump through this access but it requires undoing the hydraulic lines and swearing while wiggling the tank out of the machine. There is a basic screen on the inlet, and the filtration seems to be by settling only.

Hi and thanks fot taking the time to reply.

Yes, I'm aware of the process to get at the tank and remove it but not sure about the filter side. Here in the UK a new replacement filter sells around GBP/£25.00 from Andmar (Nil stock though) which I thought was reasonable to change as I've no idea how long the original has been there if EVER changed!

John :typing:
 
Hi and thanks fot taking the time to reply.

Yes, I'm aware of the process to get at the tank and remove it but not sure about the filter side. Here in the UK a new replacement filter sells around GBP/£25.00 from Andmar (Nil stock though) which I thought was reasonable to change as I've no idea how long the original has been there if EVER changed!

John :typing:

Apologies, the filter is a really basic metal screen screwed into the pump inlet. My machine is about the same age as yours and had a little sludge in the tank, I cleaned it and the filter with kerosene and refilled with new oil.
 
Mark, I'm sorry, either I did not take off

that part, or I have forgotten how it went. Will send the OP some documentation that might help him with the various questions.

Cheers - Bruce

Hi Bruce, thanks for the PM, much appreciated :D

As per my thoughts in the opening thread (Image #4) I removed the three Cap Heads and the Star knob then the outer knurled ring and scale simply pulled off.

IMG_3383s.jpg IMG_3387s.jpg

Now I've got to try and free the rotatable scale around the vertical-feed handwheel ...

Cheers

John :typing:
 
That's the bit that my 1400 parts diagram shows as being retained by a retaining ding screwed to the back of the hand wheel. It also shows three springs and pins between the wheel and the dial to give a bit of friction. Might not be the same at all. There are a fair number of differences between 540 and 1400, and over the years...

To be honest. Even though I've taken mine apart, to replace the bellows at the back and the oil seal at the front, I didn't even realise that the fiducial ring was supposed to be 'rotatable'.

Another little job for when I do the proper rebuild, after calibrating/re-lapping/re-calibrating the surface table and straight edges to make them flat enough to do the grinder :crazy:.
 
That's the bit that my 1400 parts diagram shows as being retained by a retaining ding screwed to the back of the hand wheel. It also shows three springs and pins between the wheel and the dial to give a bit of friction. Might not be the same at all. There are a fair number of differences between 540 and 1400, and over the years...

To be honest. Even though I've taken mine apart, to replace the bellows at the back and the oil seal at the front, I didn't even realise that the fiducial ring was supposed to be 'rotatable'.

Another little job for when I do the proper rebuild, after calibrating/re-lapping/re-calibrating the surface table and straight edges to make them flat enough to do the grinder :crazy:.

There's always lots to do ... especially when most of my machines are years old because thats what my budget allows :codger:

John:cheers:
 
Well I was not looking forward to cleaning out the hydraulic oil sump but it had to be done ...

Getting the tank out was a bit of a struggle as the cover had not been put on correctly so it restricted my access to the hydraulic hose fittings that needed to be dis-connected.

A few choice words, a bit of knuckle left on the main casting and it was out!

Didn't know about a "Rectangular" gauze filter so that was a surprise ... Anyway a couple of hours of cleaning and it was ready for re-fitting, re-filling and test for leaks ... All OK :)

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Just the table to remove and clean now!

John :typing:
 
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The cleaning continues ...

The rotatable bezel around the Vertical Feed handwheel was jammed solid with congeiled oil.

The first part of the strip down was to remove the three very small cap head allen screws in the centre, then the boss just lifts off. Once removed there is a 1" nut to remove (normal thread) and with that off the whole handwheel body should pull off (I would advise you disengage the fine vertical feed knob).

After that all is self explanatory ...

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HTH someone ... and hope you stay safe!

John :typing:
 
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Well I was not looking forward to cleaning out the hydraulic oil sump but it had to be done ...

Getting the tank out was a bit of a struggle as the cover had not been put on correctly so it restricted my access to the hydraulic hose fittings that needed to be dis-connected.

A few choice words, a bit of knuckle left on the main casting and it was out!

Didn't know about a "Rectangular" gauze filter so that was a surprise ... Anyway a couple of hours of cleaning and it was ready for re-fitting, re-filling and test for leaks ... All OK :)

View attachment 280862 View attachment 280863

View attachment 280864 View attachment 280865

Just the table to remove and clean now!

John :typing:

I'm sure I've seen that pump on other machines. Is it made by " David Brown " by any chance ?

Regards Tyrone.
 
Decided to go the whole hog and strip the Fine feed vertical wheel (What else would you do when you're in isolation?)

The handle itself is held on the pinion shaft with both a spring pin and a grub screw/set screw (Deep inside the handle). When you push the pinion out of the handle and main handwheel casting BEWARE there is a ball bearing spring loaded within the casting.

HTH

John
 

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John, the links for the photo attachments are broken in your last post. Please try uploading again. It's probably not your fault: I have seen this happen on PM when something is not working right behind the scenes with their web infrastructure.

Interesting Bruce ... they were there during "Daylight" hours yesterday.

Take care in these strange times

John:typing:
 
Hi folk

Now at the stage of removing the table for inspection / cleaning. I've removed the table attachment bolts at each end of the piston rod but the table still does nt want to lift off ...

... am I missing something???

Keep safe

John:typing:
 
On my 1400 that's all that stops the table floating off with the breeze. Can get a decent suction from the oil on the ways, but nothing compared with the weight of the table.
 
On my 1400 that's all that stops the table floating off with the breeze. Can get a decent suction from the oil on the ways, but nothing compared with the weight of the table.

Hi Mark

Thanks for the comments - much appreciated! ;)

The table came clear with more effort - a combination of suction and not totally appreciating the weight.

After some cleaning, heres the images:

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IMG_3481s.jpg IMG_3485s.jpg

I noted a leak from the righthand end of the piston and a little bit of heavy wear to about a third of the rack. Not sure if I'll replace the rack (Cost dependant) but need to replace the piston seals (If the UK suppliers are still trading).

So here's the machine right now. It was covered in rust a month ago as the company that owned it lost some roof panels over Christmas/New Year and it was soaked during a period od heavy rain.

Its taken over a 100+ man hours to clean it and restore it to a fully working condition. Some of the rusted panels needed repainting so nine aerosols later its pretty much there.

IMG_3489s.jpg

Finally, I've never owned JS540 ... so are the seals easy to change??? Comments greatly welcomed.

Keep safe

John :cheers:
 
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If it's the piston rod end seals, they're Walker Lion Twinset seals (if yours is the same as mine) and it's just a matter of removing the end cover, fishing out the old seal and putting a new one in. Or not bothering, since the oil will just drain back to the tank unless it's really gushing out. Are J&S (AKA Hardinge, now) still answering the phone? If not, there's always Andmar.

I'm currently making some patterns, so I can cast some mirror mounts, so I can use them with the autocollimator to calibrate/re-lap/calibrate my surface table and granite straight edge and get them good enough to tackle the 1400's table and saddle ways. Mine look worse than yours!!

PS:- What paint did you use? Looks quite close to the J&S blue.

PPS:- Here's how not to paint one.
 








 
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