Are (all of) these Starrett?

I recently was able to purchase a machinist's tool chest on kijiji/similar, and this set came with it.

I thought initially they were all Starrett because they all have the classic acorn nut that the starretts have, these all definitely have the same nut.

But I noticed that i could not find any stamp on the square or the center scriber.
The protractor says starrett on it, but not the other two.

Upon even closer inspection, the two unstamped ones appear to have a different paint on them as well. The wear on the confirmed starrett protractor is in the form of cracking peeling paint, whereas for the other two with mystery tools, the paint is wearing down gradually, as opposed to flaking off.

Are these other two starretts? If so why are they not stamped? Was it because they are considered a set, and therefore only one element needs to be stamped? The Rule is stamped starrett.

And if they are not starrett, why would they have the starrett nuts? I can only think that maybe whoever owned this set had a full starrett set, and when they "wore out" or something, he got new non-starrett ones but kept the original nut, and perhaps threaded locking pin.

What do you guys think?






Notice the different kind of wear on the finish.

I have a Sears Craftsman adjustable square from the 1950s - with "Starrett" nuts.

I don't think the nuts are Starrett specific. And the rule dimensions are "almost" universal - one rule will fit another maker's attachment.

Joe in NH

It is possible Starrett made them for someone else. I know they made them for Sears. I don't remember too much since it was quite a while ago a friend of mine purchased Craftsman Micrometers, I can't remember what it was that confirmed they were Starrett but they definitely were! Sears made nothing, they ordered usually the best from top makers of that item. A friend of mine's wife worked for Woolrich they made clothing foe sears that was better than their own branded items. I worked for Fedders, Sears ordered refrigerators with specifications that exceeded the Fedders items but they simply renamed their refigerators. Sear checked them and canceled the order on the spot!
So I suspect Starrett made the items when they insisted on quality.

Confirming all of above. Up until the era of the "plastic tray" Craftsman Tap & Die sets, Greenfield Tool & Die made Craftsman Tap & Die sets. Similar wooden box. Die-stocks painted red rather than black or natural, die segments "loose" and made to be inserted directly in the die stocks instead of a separate inserting collet, but dimensional the same as an equivalent sized GTD die.

In general I have found period era Craftsman tools about as good as could be bought then. Excepting possibly trade tools like Snap-On. One compares Craftsman power tools of the era and even now 50 years later the quality is above the current DeWalt, Kobalt, even Milwaukee.

Pick up a Craftsman "Alien Head" planer and one is impressed with the sheer mass of the device. Gut simple certainly but WELL MADE - which is why so many have survived.

Joe in NH

As I've liked to say jokingly, you can't now, nor could you ever, find a factory with a big Craftsman (or Kenmore) sign on the roof. Tower (photographic equipment) and Silvertone (musical instruments)are Sears lines and brandnames that are long gone. I think the Silvertone guitars were made by Harmony.

Back in the late 1970's I bought a 1-2" micrometer from Sears. Except for being marked "Craftsman" it looked identical to the 1-2" micrometer in the Scherr-Tumico catalogue.

David

old_dave:

Adding to the list of Sears branded items: J.C. Higgins was their label on a variety of sporting goods including firearms, as well as camping supplies. J.C. Higgins was also the Sears brand on the bicycles they sold. Homart was the Sears brand on their plumbing supplies including well pumps. David Bradley was the Sears brand used on farm and garden equipment, the most well known being the David Bradley two wheel tractors ("walk behind tractors"). For a time, these were fitted with "styled" housings that resembled the nose or front grille of a 1930's automobile or light truck.


Allstate was more than auto insurance. Originally a Sears brand, Allstate was also their name on automotive supplies, including long block remanufactured engines.
Sears sold all sorts of things, including "home kits"- these kits contained all the materials including plumbing and a heating boiler. In their farm and garden supply catalogs, you could buy live animals from baby chicks and ducklings to donkeys. Sears was the "go to" store for a lot of people of my parent's and my own generations.
Sometimes, you'd walk into Sears stores and there would be stuff on sale that never was in the catalogs, nor was it branded as anything from Sears. An example of this was WWII surplus rifles. I can recall in about 1962, walking into the Sears store in Brooklyn, NY with my father. In the sporting goods department was a rack of rifles, not locked and fully accessable to anyone interested in them. I was about 12 at the time, and took a WWII Enfield .303 carbine off the rack. I worked the bolt, threw it up to my shoulder and drew a bead on the light fixture. No one took any notice of it. I showed the Enfield, which was marked at a price of 14 bucks, to my father- a WWII veteran. Dad's answer was: "Joe, that is a powerful rifle that you have no need of..." I put the Enfield back on the rack. No one freaking out about a kid handling a rifle, business as usual. From the time I was a small boy, I loved when my parents shopped at the Sears, Roebuck store. I spent my time happily in the tool and plumbing departments while Mom browsed for clothing or household stuff. After Christmas, we kids got our ice skates at Sears, on knock-down sale. Sears was an institution, a part of America. Dad bought a Craftsman 8" table saw in about 1948. He used that saw to alter and fix up our home. Up and down our block, on warm evenings, you could hear the sounds of those table saws as men worked on their homes, with knotty pine boarded basements being a big favorite. When I left home on my first engineering job, my folks got me several sets of matched khakis (pants and shirts), with Dad telling me I needed to "dress like an engineer, not a college kid". Sear had the matched khaki (or as the WWII era vets called them "suntans") work sets.

Sears was a fine store, and the salesmen all wore neckties and were quite polite and knowledgable. The store was well kept, clean, and even had a snack bar. For us kids, a big treat was a hot dog grilled on the rolling steel heated bars, and a mug of root beer drawn from a finished wooden barrel with the tap coming out of it. A trip to Sears was great fun for us kids. A box of Craftsman mechanic's tools was a rite of passage and as American as apple pie. With Sears nearly defunct and much of the Craftsman tools coming out of China, when my own son asked for a box of tools, I bought New Old Stock Craftsman tools and good used ones off eBay. As for the toolbox, the local industrial surplus place had an ancient Craftsman hip roof box that needed a handle. The old crinkle-finish blue-gray paint was about gone from the toolbox, but I knew it was ca 1950's Craftsman. I refinished the toolbox with hammertone paint, made a new handle out of steel and Micarta, and filled the toolbox with mainly Craftsman tools (some J.H. Williams, some Snapon) for my son. I could not stomach the idea of Chinese made Craftsman tools in a blow molded plastic box as something to give my son to continue the old traditions. Browsing the Sears stores on rainy days or knowing you could get good tools at a reasonable price and good work clothes is history. Shopping on-line seems to be the replacement, but it lacks being able to go into a nice store and try on the work clothes or heft the tools in your hand before buying them.

Sears is nearly history now, just a shred of its former self. Sad days, indeed.

Joe Michaels said:

...Sometimes, you'd walk into Sears stores and there would be stuff on sale that never was in the catalogs, nor was it branded as anything from Sears. An example of this was WWII surplus rifles. I can recall in about 1962, walking into the Sears store in Brooklyn, NY with my father. In the sporting goods department was a rack of rifles, not locked and fully accessable to anyone interested in them. I was about 12 at the time, and took a WWII Enfield .303 carbine off the rack. I worked the bolt, threw it up to my shoulder and drew a bead on the light fixture. No one took any notice of it. I showed the Enfield, which was marked at a price of 14 bucks, to my father- a WWII veteran. Dad's answer was: "Joe, that is a powerful rifle that you have no need of..." I put the Enfield back on the rack. No one freaking out about a kid handling a rifle, business as usual. ...

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In my case the WWII .303 Enfields were featured in Sears' newspaper ad around 1954. We went to look, as I was just starting to shoot real guns. (I had a .22 rifle and a Detroit steel bullet trap in my 60 foot basement. The .22 went to high school every week on the school bus, to shoot in the school's basement rifle range.) It turned out that Sears had a couple dozen Enfields stuck butt-up in a 50 gallon fiber barrel in the tool department. My father did not know much about guns, but they were cheap, so he bought one for me, along with a box of ammo. That .303 and later, an 8mm Lebel soft point were the only two bullets that ever punched holes in my bullet trap. I fixed it once I got an oxy-acetylene welder and still have the trap.

I really must get out my Starrett combination squares and return to topic.

Larry

I really must get out my Starrett combination squares and return to topic.

Larry[/QUOTE]
Before that happens: Remember the Henry J auto? It was a cool looking little thing and a fellow had three of them. One was an "AllSTATE" and every way a Kaiser.

Sears sold Cushman scooters with the name All state too.

I recently bought a Craftsman vise (that I do not need) at a flea market, couldn't resist the $10 price. It's a 4" clone of the 5" Columbian vise my dad had on his workbench.

I still have most of the Craftsman tool set my mother bought me one Christmas at age 13.I'm 74 now.

Meant to add there are still some of the mail order Sears houses left in Jacksonville.
Sears tried to have something for everybody;good,better and best.Montgomery Wards and Western Auto were smaller clones.
I can't think of any modern equivalent including whats left of Sears, and there will never be one in the future. Modern logistics and marketing sealed their fate. Was a different time and place.

L Vanice said:

In my case the WWII .303 Enfields were featured in Sears' newspaper ad around 1954. We went to look, as I was just starting to shoot real guns. (I had a .22 rifle and a Detroit steel bullet trap in my 60 foot basement. The .22 went to high school every week on the school bus, to shoot in the school's basement rifle range.) It turned out that Sears had a couple dozen Enfields stuck butt-up in a 50 gallon fiber barrel in the tool department. My father did not know much about guns, but they were cheap, so he bought one for me, along with a box of ammo. That .303 and later, an 8mm Lebel soft point were the only two bullets that ever punched holes in my bullet trap. I fixed it once I got an oxy-acetylene welder and still have the trap.

I really must get out my Starrett combination squares and return to topic.

Larry

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Let me get this right Larry... you were shooting a 303 Enfield in your basement?!

Frank R said:

Let me get this right Larry... you were shooting a 303 Enfield in your basement?!

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Just the one shot. Mom did not like the smell of black powder in the house, but the muzzleloaders never hurt the bullet trap. Neither did the .44 magnum and .357 magnum, but the noise was bad, so they also only got shot once each.

Larry

I like the part about taking guns to school on the bus, and having a rifle range at school! My, how times have changed! Imagine what trouble you would be in today if you even thought about this? We are losing our freedoms.

Growing up in central Florida,just about every guy had a gun and many carried them to school in their vehicles.Ditto on pocket knives.
Don't remember any one pulling a knife or gun on anyone after a fight.Much less because of a different viewpoint on any thing.Or even threatening anyone with a weapon.
There seems to be to many people who live just waiting for the next slight or insult to justify bad behavior.
What to hell happened?

ratbldr427 said:

What to hell happened?

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Liberal, "progressive" politics and "dumbed down" education standards is what's poisoned our culture.


.

I had a rifle in high school three days a week, after all I was captain of the rifle team. I bought a Ruger Old Army revolver from my professor in the college building. I guess that couldn't happen today.