Facing Head for HBM Help Identify Maker
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  1. #1
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    Default Facing Head for HBM Help Identify Maker

    d066945b-f879-4c8a-a10c-aaea010ce8ad.jpg

    At a recent auction I bought a facing head, hoping to fit it to my G&L 25T. It was an online auction, and the head was on a pallet with some lathe faceplates. I could not tell the size, but it looked like a smaller head, not those 36" ones you see on Ebay all the time. Well I was the successful bidder and I picked it up. Left the faceplates.
    It turns out to be 20" in diameter, and about 5" thick. I need to weigh it, but it seems about 150+ pounds. The center hole is 4" and the bar holder takes a 2" bar. It mounts to the machine with 4 bolts on a 5.5" spacing, 16mm size bolts. It has a short taper, like a lathe chuck, maybe an A-8 or A-10 size. My rough tape measure reads it at 7".
    There are 2 gears on the back where it attaches to the machine. I think that means the machine had a handwheel to adjust the offset and powerfeed the facing. The gear that moves the slide mechanism is about 12" dia and it seems to be 10 pitch and 14.5 pressure angle. The gear that is coupled to the housing is I believe 8 pitch, and 12.5" dia. There is a ruler scale on the front face to rough read the offset, and it is in inches.
    There is no name on it, but there is some numbers and letters stamped. Need to post pics. It looks like they had a mixed bunch of number stamps, as the characters are of different size. My guess is this thing is Polish or Chech or some place like that. Looking to make an adapter to mount it to my G&L 25T. Is this a good idea??? Can anyone identify the maker of this head??
    Thank you --
    --Doozer

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    Second video.

    There seems to me a maker's mark stamped on a few parts of this head.
    "CTC" and a number, like 73A or 78A, all within a circle is what they
    look like. Maybe that helps identify it.

    --Doozer

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    Congratulations on finding a reasonably priced facing head. I'm still on the hunt to find one for my G&L 25. Being in southern Idaho there just isn't a lot of iron to find but I haven't given up. Sorry I can't help with the identification of what you found. Sounds like you have a plan to move forward. I think the original heads that shipped with the 25 were 13 inch heads but I think with care you shouldn't have any trouble with your 20.



    My name is Brian and I'm a toolaholic.

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    That's new one to me. I think I can rule out it being British.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    I thought Tyrone would nail it on the first try.
    Oh well. Thanks for trying.
    --D

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doozer View Post
    I thought Tyrone would nail it on the first try.
    Oh well. Thanks for trying.
    --D
    Sorry matey, the ones I worked on weren't as sophisticated as that one. They just bolted on to the master spindle nose and worked against an external reaction bar. You couldn't easily put a cut on whilst the facing slide was revolving. To be honest you rarely saw a " spindle only " machine back in the pre CNC days over here. Most machines came with a built in facing slide were you could put a cut on whilst the machine was running.

    Edit after watching the last video. Mm, the ones I worked on worked with the sliding element that holds the tool holder being like the back of a three jaw self centring chuck jaw and they had a revolving scroll inside the body of the facing slide itself. You could use a handle like an Allen key to wind on a cut when the spindle was stationary like you would tightening a 3 jaw chuck. That would be just for plain boring. The main body of the facing slide bolted to the master spindle that the travelling spindle runs through.

    If you wanted to face a casting there was a 3 position lever that was mounted to the backing plate of the facing slide. The backing plate was stationary at all times and was held in position by a fixed reaction bar. The three position lever gave you - Facing outwards, No facing, Facing inwards. The rate of feed was fixed. You could lock the sliding element for plain boring.

    They were easy to take on and off, you just had to be sure that the backing plate was fitted into the reaction bar.

    I had a close escape one time. I was fitting one to a boring machine and I had the facing slide rigged in a soft broad webbing sling. I'd bolted the facing slide onto the machine and I just reached behind myself to grab the pendant of the crane to lower off the sling.
    Unfortunately the pendant for the machine was roughly the same size and height as the one for the crane and I accidentally pressed " Run Forward " on the machine ! All of a sudden the facing slide is doing about 500 revs inside the sling ! Luckily for me the sling was just loose enough to allow that to happen.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    I bought 2 boring/facing heads last year at an online auction, I paid $50 for the pair. Here is a thread I made when I got them home.

    Large Boring Heads

    One is 15", the other is 11" and both are much more simple than yours. I believe they are to be used with an external reaction bar like Tyrone mentioned ^. They cleaned up really nice, but I noticed they used dovetail ways just like yours.

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    Looks like Japanese Shibaura/Toshiba/Kuraki.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doozer View Post
    That looks very much like yours. I've never seen a " Summit " in the UK. " Kearns ", " Richards ", " Giddings Lewis and Fraser " had the British market more or less sewn up with the odd Eastern European machine like " Union ", TOS " and " Stanko " coming onto the market as people ( bean counters ) became more price conscious.

    Could be that black handled lever at the front bottom of the spindle frame puts the facing slide in and out of gear.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    I do not have a parts breakdown of my G&L 25T.
    Was wondering if the spindle has ball bearings.
    Pondering this because the facing head that I
    have apparently came from a much larger machine.
    That SUMMIT looks huge compared to my G&L 25T.
    Does anyone know if my machine has ball bearings
    on the main spindle? I will make my flange adapter
    with minimal stick-out to minimize the overhung
    load, but just wanted someone who knows the G&L 25T
    to chime in. Thanks.

    --Doozer

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    Doozer,
    Probably, you'd better ask this question in a new thread.

    Paolo

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    I believe Summit is a re-seller or "brander" of machine tools, still in business as far as I know. To my knowledge, Summit sold machine tools made mainly in Eastern Europe carrying the "Summit" brand or name. Possibly, the Summit firm could furnish an O & M manual (or relevant portions) for the OP's boring and facing head.

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    Thanks Joe. Well it is really not really important to me what brand it is.
    More of a "like to know" type of thing, and I thought it was fun to post
    it here. Also not really looking for a manual for it. It is a very simple
    device. If you watched my videos, you see that I took it completely apart
    to clean and inspect it. It might not have 10 parts total to it, less the
    screws. I sorta just wanted to know what size of machine it came off of.
    I guess I got my answer, a much larger one.

    -D

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    fba30947-4a19-4c8f-8d80-b751d3aa9e26.jpgHi I have two machines for sale with facing heads Collector

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    Was wondering if the spindle has ball bearings.
    Per serial book.....

    Made two digit serial between '25 and '29 - and they made three digit serials between '40 and '48

    I would suppose ALL the two digit serials have plain bearings

    I would wonder if the "T" suggests TIMKEN tapered roller bearings

    Their huge HBM hand book in sections here

    Giddings & Lewis Manufacturing Co. - Publication Reprints | VintageMachinery.org

    ph

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    Thank you John, I think my machine is a 1946.
    Yes I stumbled on to the books at Vintage Machinery.org.
    Collector, Nice looking machines you have there.
    I google mapped your city. It looks like a glorious place!

    --Doozer


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