Hendey 16x6 Lathe with chain drive

salvageworkshop · Oct 28, 2018

Long time reader, first time poster!

This my "new" to me Hendey 16x6 lathe that we rescued from the location you see it at in the pictures. I believe the serial number is wc-23213.

I was hoping Hendeyman can tell me any history on its age and what it came with / who purchased it.

Also is anyone familiar with the chain drive setup that is on mine? Is that a something someone built or changed after it left the factory?

Thanks in advance!

johnoder · Oct 28, 2018

Chain was an option on the motorized 8 speed (thumbnail)

Here is manual scan, though mostly for cone heads - thanks to Greg Menke for hosting this for me

http://pounceatron.dreamhosters.com/docs/hendey/1920-Hendey-manual.pdf

Here is my old write up on their lead screw reverse system - starts at Post #17 in the linked thread

Hendey lathe "emergency"!

salvageworkshop · Oct 30, 2018

johnoder said:
Chain was an option on the motorized 8 speed (thumbnail)

Here is manual scan, though mostly for cone heads - thanks to Greg Menke for hosting this for me

http://pounceatron.dreamhosters.com/docs/hendey/1920-Hendey-manual.pdf

Here is my old write up on their lead screw reverse system - starts at Post #17 in the linked thread

Hendey lathe "emergency"!

Awesome!

Thank you for the information about the chain drive! I thought it looked original, but hadn't seen another one with the same setup.

hendeyman · Oct 31, 2018

salvageworkshop:

Hendey Lathe No.23213, a 16 x 6, eight speed, Geared Head model, was completed on may 7, 1920 and was shipped with a Taper Attachment,
a set of No. 3 Collets and a CMD (Chain Motor Drive). The original owner was Nash Motors Company, Racine, Wisconsin. There are no longer any Patterns, Castings or Repair Parts left in inventory for this lathe, but all of the original drawings are still in the files, so parts can be made if required.

Hendeyman

salvageworkshop · Nov 1, 2018

hendeyman said:
salvageworkshop:

Hendey Lathe No.23213, a 16 x 6, eight speed, Geared Head model, was completed on may 7, 1920 and was shipped with a Taper Attachment,
a set of No. 3 Collets and a CMD (Chain Motor Drive). The original owner was Nash Motors Company, Racine, Wisconsin. There are no longer any Patterns, Castings or Repair Parts left in inventory for this lathe, but all of the original drawings are still in the files, so parts can be made if required.

Hendeyman

Thank you Hendeyman! I appreciate the history of my lathe!

I will be working to get this old Hendey ready for it's 100th birthday!!

I will let you know if I need anything else!!

salvageworkshop · Nov 1, 2018

What are the advantages / disadvantages of having a Chain Motor Drive?

hendeyman · Nov 1, 2018

salvageworkshop:

The Chain Drive offers several advantages over Belt Drive. First, the drive is positive, no slippage like a flat belt drive, so full
power can be transmitted. The chain drive is for all practical purposes silent in operation, unlike some types of gear drive. When
Hendey introduced the 18 speed EBM lathe in 1922, it was belt driven, within eighteen months it had been converted to chain drive ECM.
Chain drive allows for more flexibility in the design stage regarding center distance and ratios. With flat belt drive the Arc of Contact
becomes a limiting factor with regard to power transmission, but is not a problem with chain drive.

One disadvantage with chain drive is for high speed operation. At certain speeds and depending on the arrangement of the links, an
harmonic vibration can be set up that will transmit to the work. This is common in some geared head lathes and planers where a phono-
graphic record is produced in the work piece. Where it is necessary to elimination this effect at high speeds, an endless flat belt is
usually employed, such as the Hendey No.1 High Speed lathe.

Hendeyman

Barry Lanier · Nov 1, 2018

I had a newer one with the drive motor underneath the lathe bed with the silent chain drive cool old machine

salvageworkshop · Nov 2, 2018

hendeyman said:
salvageworkshop:

The Chain Drive offers several advantages over Belt Drive. First, the drive is positive, no slippage like a flat belt drive, so full
power can be transmitted. The chain drive is for all practical purposes silent in operation, unlike some types of gear drive. When
Hendey introduced the 18 speed EBM lathe in 1922, it was belt driven, within eighteen months it had been converted to chain drive ECM.
Chain drive allows for more flexibility in the design stage regarding center distance and ratios. With flat belt drive the Arc of Contact
becomes a limiting factor with regard to power transmission, but is not a problem with chain drive.

One disadvantage with chain drive is for high speed operation. At certain speeds and depending on the arrangement of the links, an
harmonic vibration can be set up that will transmit to the work. This is common in some geared head lathes and planers where a phono-
graphic record is produced in the work piece. Where it is necessary to elimination this effect at high speeds, an endless flat belt is
usually employed, such as the Hendey No.1 High Speed lathe.

Hendeyman

That makes sense!

I do have one thing i cannot figure out... How do i disengage the back gears on this chain driven lathe? I cannot find a pin like the cone head versions, and we even pulled the top off and cannot find the way to disengage it... any help would be appreciated!

spaeth · Nov 2, 2018

Salvageworkshop,
Backgear should be engaged by the tall lever
on the headstock. Four speeds selected with the brass knobed lever and high, low and neutral using the tall one. The other lever on top of the headstock is the clutch to start and stop the spindle. Cool old machine for sure.
spaeth

johnoder · Nov 2, 2018

And Post #2 shows the horizontal "pole" to operate clutch

spaeth said:
Salvageworkshop,
Backgear should be engaged by the tall lever
on the headstock. Four speeds selected with the brass knobed lever and high, low and neutral using the tall one. The other lever on top of the headstock is the clutch to start and stop the spindle. Cool old machine for sure.
spaeth

salvageworkshop · Nov 2, 2018

spaeth said:
Salvageworkshop,
Backgear should be engaged by the tall lever
on the headstock. Four speeds selected with the brass knobed lever and high, low and neutral using the tall one. The other lever on top of the headstock is the clutch to start and stop the spindle. Cool old machine for sure.
spaeth

The brass knob changes the speed and works correctly after some oil. The clutch lever engages and disengages the drive properly. The tall lever slides left & right and has the three detents, High, Neutral, & Low, and they all work properly, but I'm not sure how that lever disengages the back gear.

Other than the levers and knobs on the apron, I cannot find anything else that could engage / disengage the back gear.

Currently when I set it up to run on back gears, i can pull the chain and get the chuck to turn, but when I go back to the front gears, its locked up SOLID because the back gear will not disengage.

I will get some pictures of what it looks like with the cover off and show you what I'm looking at. I have not hooked up the motor because I want to figure this out before I give her power and mess something up! lol!

salvageworkshop · Nov 2, 2018

To operate the clutch on this one there is a horizontal lever on the top of the headstock, best seen in my 4th picture... I dont have the long pole setup like the advertisement.

johnoder · Nov 2, 2018

Currently when I set it up to run on back gears, i can pull the chain and get the chuck to turn, but when I go back to the front gears, its locked up SOLID because the back gear will not disengage

Back gears stay engaged and are not in use (or preventing spindle rotation) when vertical lever is in the high speed position

I would imagine NOT being able to turn it in high has nothing to do with back gearing and instead suggest a common old Hendey problem of front bearing being worn enough in thrust to make it difficult or impossible to turn spindle by hand

It has come to be known on this forum as HENDEYITUS

It requires disassembly to repair. It is in no way an adjustment issue

Here is a recent occurrence - of course a cone head has somewhat different stuff on the spindle

https://www.practicalmachinist.com/...hendey-14x6-26230-a-354882/?highlight=helpful

salvageworkshop · Nov 2, 2018

johnoder said:
Back gears stay engaged and are not in use (or preventing spindle rotation) when vertical lever is in the high speed position

I would imagine NOT being able to turn it in high has nothing to do with back gearing and instead suggest a common old Hendey problem of front bearing being worn enough in thrust to make it difficult or impossible to turn spindle by hand

It has come to be known on this forum as HENDEYITUS

It requires disassembly to repair. It is in no way an adjustment issue

Here is the last occurrence - of course a cone head has somewhat different stuff on the spindle

https://www.practicalmachinist.com/...hendey-14x6-26230-a-354882/?highlight=helpful

I read about that, but i was under the impression that since i was able to get some movement in the chuck with the back gears, the bearing wasn't locked up?

Is there a way that it only locks up in the forward gears?

johnoder · Nov 2, 2018

salvageworkshop said:
I read about that, but i was under the impression that since i was able to get some movement in the chuck with the back gears, the bearing wasn't locked up?

Is there a way that it only locks up in the forward gears?

Sure - you have a huge mechanical advantage when it is in back gears - like 9 to 1 - or what ever the back gear over all ratio is

The little bit of force you can apply to pulling on the chain is helped by that much when in back gears

On Edit..........

8 speed 12 to 20" design comments from about 1920ish

salvageworkshop · Nov 2, 2018

johnoder said:
Sure - you have a huge mechanical advantage when it is in back gears - like 9 to 1 - or what ever the back gear over all ratio is

The little bit of force you can apply to pulling on the chain is helped by that much when in back gears

On Edit..........

8 speed 12 to 20" design comments from about 1920ish

That makes sense. Thank you for the help!

I am new to lathes, and learning everything I can!

Here are a few pics of the exactly what your advertisement shows... We have the top off the Hendey at the moment.

salvageworkshop · Nov 2, 2018

A few more of the inside of the Hendey...

salvageworkshop · Jan 14, 2021

I am finally getting around to restoring this machine on my YouTube channel, but I need some help!

When I shift the lever on the front over from front gears to back gears, all the gears bind up and will NOT turn at all.

They all spin fine in front gears and in neutral, but when I move the lever all the way to the left (back gears) it binds up and will not spin at all.

I'll get some better pictures here soon, but any help would be much appreciated!

Any ideas on what might be going on here?

M.B. Naegle · Jan 14, 2021

It sounds like there might be a shaft seized in a bearing. If you still have the top cover off, when in neutral, does the very back shaft and gear assembly spin freely?

Hendey 16x6 Lathe with chain drive

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