Hendey lathe

I am looking at a Hendey lathe and was wondering what to be aware of.Here is the description.
Older machine showing its age and wear, but still works. Actual swing is 17+ inches. Has taper attachment, two 3-jaw chucks, one 4-jaw chuck, face plate, collet set-up and collets, tool post, steady rest, and more. Five horsepower 3-phase motor. $500.00 obo
He has said the cross feed ,clutch,gears on the feed and the ways are worn.
I am new to this and I thank you in advance for the help.
Nick

If the seller honestly admits to that much wrong..........you need to look for another lathe. I've been down this path and enthusiasm is no substitute for wear, however go look. It may not be that bad, just use your eyes and common sense. If there is perceptable wear on the ways it simply won't be accurate. Broken handles, chipped gear teeth and obvious abuse are all arguments for a lower price. The taper attachment and chucks are a plus, but if it is badly abused then in my opinion it would be worth perhaps scrap value for whatever parts you can salvage.

Advice:

1) Get the serial number and post it here. The records of the Hendey company still exist and are accessable to a member of this forum. [Hendeyman] He can tell you how the lathe was equipped when it left the factory.
2) IMHO $500 is a bit high but only a bit. Depends on how bad the ways are worn.
3) Read this advice on buying old lathes: http://www.mermac.com/advice.html
4) I'm with you on the worn gears on the feed. I am about to buy a drawing or two from Hendeyman to see what the gear on the left end of the spindle, and the one below it, was like when it left the factory. Mine are worn almost to sharp points. The feed train obviously rules the accuracy of threading.

I can almost guarantee that you will get $500 worth of fun and learning out of it even if it is quite worn. A Hendey was a Cadillac of lathes.

John Ruth

Crossfeed screw and nut, and feed gears are straightforward to replace. You'll likely spend another $500 there. Worn ways, well, that's a whole 'nuther story. I have "well-worn" ways on my 14" Logan -- .018" at its worst. Sometimes it drives me nuts, like if I'm trying to hit +/-.001" across a few inches, on a skinny piece or narrow bore. Most of the time though it's pretty irrelevant. For anything over a couple inches OD, sizing issues from moderate bed wear are lost in the noise.

Don't know anything about the clutch so I can't advise there.

I will say though that if this lathe were available local to me, I'd be very tempted to buy it. I make a lot of replacement parts for lathes (including George's Hendey ) so the crossfeed and feed gears are no problem. A well-worn Hendey would be a real nice step up from my well-worn Logan .

If you end up buying the lathe, I'd be happy to give you some prices on replacement parts.

Regards.

Finegrain

Ray is right and I apologize for my comment. I've owned several of the older lathes, just 'cause I like 'em and have had worn ways that did just fine. I'm at the point now of having my Hendey set up for grinding back to accuracy, which is a big step for me. I guess I've forgotten how badly I wanted my first lathe and a little way wear isn't that big a deal.

The other posters are correct.....give it a fair chance, but point out to the seller that having new gears made, etc. is not cheap. Still gives you some wiggle room on the price.

fiatdad:

As John Ruth has pointed out, the serial number will determine the age and style of this
lathe. The serial number will allow all of the original drawings to be checked for each of
the damaged parts. From that information I will be able to determine if the repair part is in inventory or if it will have to be made.

The term "clutch" coupled with worn feed gears could mean several things. First, depending on the age of the lathe, there are normally three clutches on a Hendey. They
control the main power to the headstock, the longitudinal feed and the cross feed.
Besides the clutches made by Hendey in the early days, they also purchased from three
vendors, namely Johnson, Conway and Twin Disc. I have very few repair parts for John-
son and Conway, but a fairly good supply of Twin Disc parts. All three companys no
longer manufacture a clutch for the Hendey lathes. When Barber Colman took over Hendey in 1955, they were advised by Twin Disc that some of the clutches were no longer available and they were forced to make substitutions on the lathes they produced.
Hendey used two types of Twin Disc clutches on their lathes and shapers: dry and wet
(running in an oil bath).

The clutches used for the longitudinal and cross feeds were always made at Hendey
using special hobs and taper gages. The specifications for these clutches varied over
the years and with different models. I keep a selection of both raw castings and finish-ed clutches in stock. I have all of the special hobs and taper gages that Hendey used
to make these clutches, but I seldom have to use them as it is very rare to find a
clutch worm wheel so badly damaged as to need replacement. Usually, cleaning the
surface of the worm wheel taper and the clutch disc solves the problem, but you won't
know for sure until you remove the apron and inspect the parts.

Hendeyman

hendey lathe

How much would this lathe weigh? (would I need a crane) Would this be a good lathe to learn on or would a South Bend be better (9x36). My son will be worling on gun barrels and smaller parts.

fiatdad:

Your Question is similar to asking "how much does a brown dog weigh". You have not posted the size of the lathe (cast into the bed, near the headstock, in large letters),
furnished a serial number or a photograph of the beast. Whether a cone head or a geared
head will effect the weight of any given size of bed as well as when it was built. For an
accurate weight, please furnish more information. The fact that it can swing about 17
inches is not a great help, because there is a difference in weight between a regular
swing lathe and an RA (raised swing) model.

A Hendey lathe is an excellent machine to learn on. The size of the lathe and the spindle
bore will determine if it will work for the kind of gunsmithing you want to do.

Let us look at the matter of the selling price. Some folks may think that this price is a
little on the high side, but a review of the accessories should put things in prospective.
If this lathe were worn beyond any reasonable limits and you decide to sell it, you would
most likely be able to recover your purchase costs by selling just the accessories, never
mind parting out the lathe. The taper attachment and the drawing-in attachment with
a box of collets are very desireable items and you wouldn't have any trouble selling them.
I would suggest that if it within your budget to buy this lathe, you should do so. After
you have had a chance to examine it and determine what you really have, then you can
make a decision of whether to keep it or sell it.

Hendeyman

Thank you for the information. I seem to learning more each day.
The owner said it weighs around 4000 pounds.
I agree the parts are worth more than the sum.I admit I am nieve about moving these, but how do you do it without a crane. I have three people to help.
I also saw a Standard Modern 13x40 Metal Lathe on ebay same price range
Is a Standard a good machine?
Thanks for you patience
Nick

Standard Modern is also a fine lathe but I guess I'm partial to Hendey because I've run them at most shops I worked for in the past.That's why I leaned toward Hendey when the chance came up to buy the two I own,American Pacemaker would be my second choice although DSG is what I'd really like to own.Alas I'm getting to that time in life where true retirement seems more and more logical,so my own Hendeys and K&T milling machines may be up for sale.Nick,as for patience,there's loads of it here on this wonderful site,so let the questions flow and the answers will be forthcoming.

My first "real" lathe (beyond the Sears Dunlap) was a 14" Flather built after 1908. Several big large gouges in the ways about midway and the points of the triangular ways under the chuck had been "bumped" quite a few times by someone dropping the chuck off the spindle nose. This didn't hold it back a bit. I could keep to within 0.001 over a 12" shaft after I had leveled the bed (and shimmed a bit on my supposedly flat concrete floor.)

Hendeys were probably the premier lathe after 1900. The "tie bar" Hendeys were especially prized. Smith in his book "Advanced Machine Work" (which I recommend for anyone interested in using a lathe, advanced or not - reprinted by Lindsay and also available online at www.books.google.com) shows the tie bar hendey in about half the descriptive pix.

Joe

As far as moving.....all lathes are top heavy and take fiendish delight at tipping over at the most inopportune time. If a forklift is available it's well worth a few extra dollars for the safety factor. Just don't let the operator lift without making sure something won't be damaged.

Here's how I've moved several machines......

You'll need two timbers (at least 4x6's) long enough to go past the end of the legs a bit. Using a hydraulic bottle jack, raise the headstock end a few inches and slide the timbers under the legs (or cabinet). Run a couple of beefy lag screws through the leg holes into the timber and gently lower everything. Now jack up the tailstock end and push (or hammer) the other ends of the timbers under the legs and lagscrew. Before lowering, place pipe rollers under the timbers and wedge them temporarily so they can't roll. Jack up the headstock end again and place more rollers, evenly spaced along the length of the timbers. Lower the machine and you're ready to move....SLOWLY. Remove your wedges and begin pushing the lathe out to your trailer, making sure you don't run out of rollers at some point. As soon as a roller is free, move it up to the front....just like the Egyptians building the pyramids.

Always keep in mind that gravity is a heartless wretch. Plan every move and go slow.

Once out at the trailer, it's time for the forklift. Again, be sure the forks won't damage anything during the lift and have the operator set it on. If no forklift is available, a tow truck can lift the headstock end on first, then lift the tailstock end while you winch it on horizontally. Just remember you're playing with the weight of a pickup truck, so think before moving.

Tie it down...no chains across the ways! I usually have a "safety chain" from the lathe to the rear of the trailer as well, in case of sudden stops. You don't want to be wearing it like a shirt!

Ditto on being safe. See my description of moving my 1700 lb. Flather at http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/showpost.php?p=810929&postcount=16 Note that this is NOT a description of how I would do it today, except perhaps for the last paragraph or two.

I was young and stupid then. I'm not so young anymore.

Joe

Where in Pa.?

Enough PM/Antique Machinery members live in the OH/PA/NY/NJ/Md area, that it might be possible to get some experienced loading/unloading assistance if you asked for it.

Pittsburgh PA

I live just north of the city> Shaler , North Hills of Pittsburgh

I ran across a little assembly place out in San Diego in the late '80s that was making 15" swing Hendey Toolroom lathes. A really nice sturdy looking one with a variable speed headstock kinda like a Graziano but inside a more squared shape headstock casting like the bigger Italian Summits or a Daewoo A-20.

Guy said he was getting his grey iron castings from a Malayan foundry (as was LeBlond Makino by then). I cannot find a picture of that '80s version of a Hendey anywhere on the internet. I used to have a brochure of it but not sure where or if at all anymore. They were running for about $50,000 in the '80s. No WESTEC booth. I'm guessing someone bought the company name when they went under. Has anybody else ever seen one of these things?

icewaterslim:

There is a good chance that you saw this lathe at 1212 McKinley Avenue, National City, California. That was the location of Aable Machine
Tool Rebuilders, a Navy contractor. The man you talked to was Tom McCune, owner of Aable and the driving force behind the reintroduction
of the model 1610T lathe. Originally it was designed and built by Barber Colman between 1956 and 1962. The selling price for the 30"
center distance was $9,950 in 1959 and by 1960 had increased by $2000.

Fast forward to 1981, Tom was a successful Navy contractor (his back fence was the Navy Yard fence) and "Uncle" had deep packets. He
decided to make a new version of the 1610T. Under his agreement with Barber Colman, he couldn't make or sell any of their designs and
prohibited from any competition for five years. With the time restrictions almost up, he decided to start the 1610T project. The bed
castings were machined by Mattison and except for the prototype bed, three others were completed. Over the years, while this project
was unfolding, Tom went from a general contractor to a sub-contractor and his cash flow was a problem. In 1987, he shut down the shop
in National city and moved to Arizona. In 1990, we discussed the 1610T and I told him that a used 1610T could be purchased used for
under $10,000, so why would anyone pay $53000 for a new one? He was determined to pursue the project. In 2006, Mrs. McCune ordered me
to scrap the prototype. If you want another sales brochure, let me know.

Hendeyman

hendeyman said:

icewaterslim:

There is a good chance that you saw this lathe at 1212 McKinley Avenue, National City, California. That was the location of Aable Machine
Tool Rebuilders, a Navy contractor. The man you talked to was Tom McCune, owner of Aable and the driving force behind the reintroduction
of the model 1610T lathe. Originally it was designed and built by Barber Colman between 1956 and 1962. The selling price for the 30"
center distance was $9,950 in 1959 and by 1960 had increased by $2000.

Fast forward to 1981, Tom was a successful Navy contractor (his back fence was the Navy Yard fence) and "Uncle" had deep packets. He
decided to make a new version of the 1610T. Under his agreement with Barber Colman, he couldn't make or sell any of their designs and
prohibited from any competition for five years. With the time restrictions almost up, he decided to start the 1610T project. The bed
castings were machined by Mattison and except for the prototype bed, three others were completed. Over the years, while this project
was unfolding, Tom went from a general contractor to a sub-contractor and his cash flow was a problem. In 1987, he shut down the shop
in National city and moved to Arizona. In 1990, we discussed the 1610T and I told him that a used 1610T could be purchased used for
under $10,000, so why would anyone pay $53000 for a new one? He was determined to pursue the project. In 2006, Mrs. McCune ordered me
to scrap the prototype. If you want another sales brochure, let me know.

Hendeyman

Click to expand...

Yeah it was down by San Diego Marine docks in National City (formerly Sun Marine) and right about '87. I guess I'll check out the brochure at the address below and thanks!

If I remember correctly (questionable) the specs had it much heavier than a Monarch EE which I guess it would be at 15" of swing. I do remember hearing $50 thou though as the last thing I asked, lol. Maybe he thought he saw one coming in the door, lol. I believe we were line boring a tunaboat for a rudder post when we happened to come across him and I didn't actually get a look at the lathe.

Nearly bought a '50s 18" swing by about 80" Monarch down there in some used sales place and the guy there said he could get me plenty of 4140 shaftwork and would let me run it there to pay it off. But I was kinda right in the middle of my mid-life crises and would've been distracted by having a life so I passed it up . . . perhaps another foolish decision back then. Anyway here's my address:

Jim McCurdy
5107 N. Tiara Ct.
Otis Orchards WA 99027

Thanks again

BTW
They had an old pre-war soft ways Hendey down there at San Diego Marine's shop. I only played with it slinging hot rolled tubing chips once. They had a little of everything in engine lathes there to mess with: An Axleson, Cincinnati, Clausing, big Atlas,huge antique Lodge & Shipley plus all kinds of foreign stuff brought up from WESTEC demo and sold to them on the docks for cheap. Some with metric dials. My favorite little shaft lathe there though was a 20" grey Japanese Summit because it was tall for our market and I didn't have to stoop to run it.