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Bridgeport round ram knee mill machine

TMB

Plastic
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Location
Litchfield AZ
Hello. First time here, was referred by a frequent follower to give Practical Machinist a couple photos for identification and history if possible.

Pictures include serial number 2909 and various view shots, left right center and close up.

Would love to know if this is the correct way of submitting photos and would appreciate any further instruction on finding out more about my mill machine. Thank you in advance.

TMB2013-06-26 12.43.19.jpg2013-06-26 12.41.04.jpg2013-06-26 12.41.33.jpg2013-06-26 12.42.13.jpg2013-06-26 12.42.28.jpg
 
Welcome.
I've seen several flavors of Bridgeports, but not quite like that... Will be interesting to learn more about it. I think you will find some info.
 
You have an early style "round ram" Bridgeport with "M" head. The early style is easily identified by its vertically split casting and the twin ram lock handles. Serial number 2909 dates it as 1943. Later machines were produced with the turret casting split along the horizontal, and the handles were replaced with a pair of cap screws vertically to lock the ram in place. Not at all special really. BP made thousands of these before switching to the newer style. They made almost 27,000 of the round ram units in all before starting the superior v ram style circa 1957.
 
Hello TMB : I'm not to far from you ,63rd Ave and Thomas Rd. One of my BPs is a round ram like yours, a few years newer about 48. Mine has a J vari speed head on it. Yours has a much larger than orignal motor on it,interesting.
 
Thank you Cast Iron. I was told that maybe I would be able to find out the history on my machine like when and where it started out. Was it a special purchase
Was it used for the war effort? Would be interesting to know with the low serial number.
 
Most likely yes it was used with war related production, however that isn't a given. All tool purchases were controlled by war production ratings. The defense projects were ranked from highest to lowest and consumer production came after that. Maybe people mistakenly believe all consumer production stopped and that isn't true. It was curtailed but some smart people realized that those "consumers" at home were war production labor force. If you couldn't get things like repair parts for you car you couldn't get to work.

As far as I'm aware Bridgeport didn't keep detailed production roosters like some other makers. So there is no way to track who the original owner was.
 
TMB,

Nice machine. I have two ram style BPs like that. One is an M head and the other is a J. My M head is not as nice as yours as the original motor was swapped out for a 3/4 HP DC motor. Still I love the intimacy that you get with an M Head especially with tiny tooling. It is my primary vertical mill as the J head is currently needing repairs. Tell me is it the BS #7 or the MT #2 spindle?

Best Regards,
Bob
 
For many years, Bridgeport used a "pancake" type motor. This was a motor which was larger in stator diameter, but short in height, sort of like an old-time coffee can. The motor on your round ram machine looks like it is either not original, or else was put on for some special purpose. It is possible that during WWII, the pancake type motors were in short supply, so the larger frame motor was put on. Another possibility is that someone modified to mill for a specific job and that bigger motor went onto it. The clue will be to check the horsepower rating. The Bridgeport head is kind of light duty to start with, so putting a bigger motor on would not accomplish much. Possibly, the mill was used in WWII aircraft work, and was doing a lot of high speed running, milling aluminum or similar materials. If the mill was in production work during WWII, possible the original pancake motor gave out, and the shop the mill was in retrofitted the quickest thing they could find to get the mill back into production work.

I've got a ca 1972 Bridgeport with the newer "J" head. By 1972, Bridgeport had stopped using the "pancake" type motors, and used a flange-mounted motor with a more commonly available frame size. I know who the last owner of my Bridgeport was prior to my getting it, but if he was the original owner, there is no way of knowing. What I do know is in the late 1960's, as defense production work for the Vietnam War ramped up, Bridgeports became a "hot commodity". People got on a waiting list for new Bridgeports. Used Bridgeports were commanding insane prices. A lot of Bridgeports in that time period were ordered with dual heads and set up with hydraulic tracer equipment. My Bridgeport, being a 1972 machine, came in at the tail end of the Vietnam era, so not telling where it went when new. The dealer who sold the mill new is out of business, so the trail ends as far as I can tell. If anyone has means of tracking Bridgeport serial numbers and original purchasers, I'd be interested to know.
 
Thank you for your reply Bob. I will agree with you on using this mill you can really get the feel of the material your working with. This is my first machine and I think old school is a great place to start learning.
It's been amazing the people I have been running into that were tool and die makers for 20 years who know old Bridgeports all to well. As for the spindle I believe it's a BS #7 as the collects are tapered is that
correct?

Thanks again,
TMB
 
Thank you Joe for all the information. The motor on my mill was swapped out to a 1 1/2 HP and according to the manual I found it said that it came with a 1/2 HP. I did get an extra motor that is a 1/2 HP not sure if
it is the original.
Thanks again,
TMB
 
Thank you for your reply Bob. I will agree with you on using this mill you can really get the feel of the material your working with. This is my first machine and I think old school is a great place to start learning.
It's been amazing the people I have been running into that were tool and die makers for 20 years who know old Bridgeports all to well. As for the spindle I believe it's a BS #7 as the collects are tapered is that
correct?

Thanks again,
TMB

I think the most common taper on these is BS #7. That is what mine is. However Morse #2 was also used and the collets look very similar. There is a third one that escapes me for some reason. However, you should find out for sure before you purchase any tooling for it.

Aftermarket collets can still be found new at a couple of places, but other tooling will be difficult to find and expensive. I The reason for my question is that I'd like to see some examples of the others and ask how well they perform holding the tools. I have rarely had a tool shank slip once it's tight in the BS7s I think it holds as well or better than R8. However, you really have to beat the drawbar pretty good to release them. I've been using the machine for years without a spindle problem so I guess that's normal.

It is amazing how well the M-Head performs being 70+ years old. Good luck and enjoy your new toy.

Best Regards,
Bob
 
I think the most common taper on these is BS #7. That is what mine is. However Morse #2 was also used and the collets look very similar. There is a third one that escapes me for some reason. However, you should find out for sure before you purchase any tooling for it.

The spindles were #2 Morse, 7 Brown & Sharpe and the third type was Bridgeport B-3. The rare B-3 taper should be easy to identify in a M head because it has two tapers like an R8 collet. Whereas Morse and the Brown & Sharpe were uniform. I have a 7B&S taper M head and use straight shank looking exclusively.
 
My round ram Bridgeport

Here is a picture of my circa 1940 B'port.
That is a wind chest from a 1919 Wurlitzer pipe organ up on the table.
Keith
HPIM0765.jpg
 
Hey, just registered for this forum to get more info about the mill I just purchased from a neighbor up the street. I was a machinist for 35 years and have a small southbend lathe and have always wanted a mill. Finally got one. The only time i ever saw a round ram was a lot of years ago but it only had a stroker head on it for broaching. This one has S/N 5525 (No letters)on the knee and M8935 on the head. It is also only a 1/2 HP motor. My biggest questions are, what size collet system is this and can it be converted to R-8? Want to use larger than 1/2" cutting tools and will also fit with a larger motor.One more thing, the spindle doesn't want to go down all the way and seems to stop solid about an inch short of full travel. Anyone have any ideas about that as well? P1030471.jpgP1030472.jpgP1030474.jpg
 

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New to Forums

Hey, just registered for this forum to get more info about the mill I just purchased from a neighbor up the street. I was a machinist for 35 years and have a small southbend lathe and have always wanted a mill. Finally got one. The only time i ever saw a round ram was a lot of years ago but it only had a stroker head on it for broaching. This one has S/N 5525 (No letters)on the knee and M8935 on the head. It is also only a 1/2 HP motor. My biggest questions are, what size collet system is this and can it be converted to R-8? Want to use larger than 1/2" cutting tools and will also fit with a larger motor.One more thing, the spindle doesn't want to go down all the way and seems to stop solid about an inch short of full travel. Anyone have any ideas about that as well? Thanks, Don

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1/2HP motor with 1/2" max collet size are the norm for these machines because that's what they were designed to max out at. I've seen some larger end-mill holders go up to 5/8" and the like, but bear in mind this machine was not made to hog metal. AFAIK they were available in Morse #2 or Brown & Sharpe #7 spindle sizes. You might be able to buy or make an adapter, but don't do so thinking you can fit big cutters in and take full depth passes. Even if it doesn't stall the motor, the machine's not rigid enough for big cuts and the round ram especially can slip and lose tram.

It should only have 4" of quill travel. If it's not reach that I'd wonder if there's something loose and keeping it from going all the way down.

I've got an old round ram M-head BP in my garage at home and think it's great (don't recall the serial but it's a 1941). As long as you think about how you are cutting, there's a lot it can do. I have a lot of old stock HSS end mills with B&S7 shanks that go up to 1" diameter, but I use those for the radius they can produce, not for their full cutting capability.

Remember that when these came on the scene, the heavy horizontal mills were still common in shops and doing all the heavy work. These are for 'high speed' small work.
 








 
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