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    Thanks for sharing!
    About 20 years ago, I visited a weapons museum in Perm (near to the Ural mountains). There was a large exhibition af tanks and artillery. The individual weapons struck me as a bit crude but very heavy and solid - and formidable. And so many of them! No wonder Hitler and his gang had a nasty surprise.
    I sincerely wish the russians and the U.S. will join hands. I have met both americans and russians and I cannot really see any large cultural difference.
    Just my .02 Euros. fusker

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    Quote Originally Posted by fusker View Post
    Thanks for sharing!
    About 20 years ago, I visited a weapons museum in Perm (near to the Ural mountains). There was a large exhibition af tanks and artillery. The individual weapons struck me as a bit crude but very heavy and solid - and formidable. And so many of them! No wonder Hitler and his gang had a nasty surprise.
    I sincerely wish the russians and the U.S. will join hands. I have met both americans and russians and I cannot really see any large cultural difference.
    Just my .02 Euros. fusker
    It’s interesting to look at the traits of soviet made goods as compared to those made in capitalist countries such as the us, it seems that the soviets built everything very heavily and very rugged, the goods they produced were “for the people” while capitalist produced goods were for the profit, and I think this had some interesting effects, many of the communist workers were forced in to thier positions and many were not highly skilled in their line of work, thus Soviet goods, while generally rugged designs were not very finely finished, while by contrast, under capitalism goods were usually much more finely finished but not necessarily as ruggedly designed, American workers had more of a motivation to build both quality yet inexpensive goods to compete in the free market, this also led to greater innovation as far as technology was concerned. The soviets were still using vacuum tubes for example long after were were in the transistor era. It’s an interesting subject to study imho.

    I agree with you on the subject of joining with the Russians, all I’ve met seemed to be good people, it’s the politicians always causing trouble, I’d like to see them all get in a ring and just duke it out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SIP6A View Post
    JHOLLAND. Can you read and speak Russian?
    He might not, but I can.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SIP6A View Post
    JHOLLAND. Can you read and speak Russian?
    Todd---no on both counts---but russian melodies are catchy

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    Quote Originally Posted by rusty old tools View Post
    It’s interesting to look at the traits of soviet made goods as compared to those made in capitalist countries such as the us, it seems that the soviets built everything very heavily and very rugged, the goods they produced were “for the people” while capitalist produced goods were for the profit, and I think this had some interesting effects, many of the communist workers were forced in to thier positions and many were not highly skilled in their line of work, thus Soviet goods, while generally rugged designs were not very finely finished, while by contrast, under capitalism goods were usually much more finely finished but not necessarily as ruggedly designed, American workers had more of a motivation to build both quality yet inexpensive goods to compete in the free market, this also led to greater innovation as far as technology was concerned. The soviets were still using vacuum tubes for example long after were were in the transistor era. It’s an interesting subject to study imho.

    I agree with you on the subject of joining with the Russians, all I’ve met seemed to be good people, it’s the politicians always causing trouble, I’d like to see them all get in a ring and just duke it out.
    Show me a factory full of machines without the nameplates etc and I could identify the Russian machines most of the time. They are by and large well made, sturdy, simple machines that will do the job. They are lacking somewhat in we would call " finish " or " styling " but they are well thought out and functional machines. If I had a shop full of Soviet era machines I would know that not much would go wrong with them and if it did I would be able to fix the problem

    The machines I worked on came fully equipped with what we would describe as extras. Nice vice, DRO, Dividing head etc on the milling machines for instance.

    The electrics were a bit " oldy worldly " but they worked.

    I'd also be able to pick out all the French machines but for different reasons. If you've ever seen a " Huron " you'll know what I'm talking about.

    Regarding the film- it looks bloody cold there. You can wear all the padded coat you want but your fingers will still be freezing. I thought the truck in the later photos looked older than the date given, but I'm no expert.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Always interesting to see other ideas and methods.

    '..soviets were still using vacuum tubes for example long after we were in the transistor era.'
    It is my understanding tubes are very tolerant of EMP and ESD events. Something to be said for that feature.

    In my teens visiting the Air and Space Museum in DC I was struck by Apollo-Soyuz display. To my mind it was like seeing a Ford tractor and Formula one car together. Knowing something about the speciality and finicky nature of race cars and the ruggard simplicity and reliability of a tractor, I would lean toward space traveling in the tractor but I suspect there is more detail to consider.

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    I liked the rusky cincinnati no3.
    Soviet machines have a simple but not crude about them.
    My stanko surface grinder came with full workshop parts drawings with material hardness etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pressbrake1 View Post
    I liked the rusky cincinnati no3.
    Soviet machines have a simple but not crude about them.
    My stanko surface grinder came with full workshop parts drawings with material hardness etc.
    I installed a large " STANKO " knee less milling machine a few years back. A bit like a copy of the old " Kendall & Gent " or " Noble & Lund " verticals.

    It came with the most comprehensive documentation I've ever seen with a machine tool. The folder with all the files in was about 6" thick. One of the files had drawings for every gear, shaft, leadscrews etc.
    When I say drawings I mean manufacturing drawings with every possible detail on the them. Material, hardening procedure for the gears etc. You could have made any part from those drawings.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
    Show me a factory full of machines without the nameplates etc and I could identify the Russian machines most of the time. They are by and large well made, sturdy, simple machines that will do the job. They are lacking somewhat in we would call " finish " or " styling " but they are well thought out and functional machines. If I had a shop full of Soviet era machines I would know that not much would go wrong with them and if it did I would be able to fix the problem

    The machines I worked on came fully equipped with what we would describe as extras. Nice vice, DRO, Dividing head etc on the milling machines for instance.

    The electrics were a bit " oldy worldly " but they worked.

    I'd also be able to pick out all the French machines but for different reasons. If you've ever seen a " Huron " you'll know what I'm talking about.

    Regarding the film- it looks bloody cold there. You can wear all the padded coat you want but your fingers will still be freezing. I thought the truck in the later photos looked older than the date given, but I'm no expert.

    Regards Tyrone.
    We came across a pair of Russian made 50T eccentric presses that were bigger than the average 100T's. They were well made, but then again not much to an eccentric press. It was an amazing sight, they were MASSIVE! They were definitely 50T just by the look of the ram and ram screw and flywheel but the casting of the body was insane. Made me wonder if they got more money for imports by weight?

    And yeah, Huron's are called the Rolls Royce of mills here. We had a guy start here on his first day, having never worked on one before and didn't realise that the table (Z axis) moved so smoothly up and down. He put it in feed, rapid down and tried to stop it when it just effortlessly moved down on it's own bottoming out and jamming the hand wheel up. He was just about in tears when he came to me telling me that he thinks he has screwed the machine up... I put it in it's slowest feed up and it gave a small shudder, then feeding so smoothly up again. I got free lunch out of that one the next day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NAST555 View Post
    We came across a pair of Russian made 50T eccentric presses that were bigger than the average 100T's. They were well made, but then again not much to an eccentric press. It was an amazing sight, they were MASSIVE! They were definitely 50T just by the look of the ram and ram screw and flywheel but the casting of the body was insane. Made me wonder if they got more money for imports by weight?

    And yeah, Huron's are called the Rolls Royce of mills here. We had a guy start here on his first day, having never worked on one before and didn't realise that the table (Z axis) moved so smoothly up and down. He put it in feed, rapid down and tried to stop it when it just effortlessly moved down on it's own bottoming out and jamming the hand wheel up. He was just about in tears when he came to me telling me that he thinks he has screwed the machine up... I put it in it's slowest feed up and it gave a small shudder, then feeding so smoothly up again. I got free lunch out of that one the next day.
    I heard that russian import/ export were weight related, indeed i have a old magazine and it lists UK import exports of machine tools by weight not unit numbers

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    The machines I worked on came fully equipped with what we would describe as extras. Nice vice, DRO, Dividing head etc on the milling machines for instance.
    A friend of mine had a polish utility plane, a Wilga, that came like that. It even came with an extra engine and all tools, it seemed as if they thought things through.

    It came with the most comprehensive documentation I've ever seen with a machine tool. The folder with all the files in was about 6" thick. One of the files had drawings for every gear, shaft, leadscrews etc.
    When I say drawings I mean manufacturing drawings with every possible detail on the them. Material, hardening procedure for the gears etc. You could have made any part from those drawings.
    Wow, now THAT would be an asset to find an old machine and the drawings for it! Not a capitalistic concept there I agree, here there is far too much money in selling OEM replacement parts to allow that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by partsproduction View Post
    A friend of mine had a polish utility plane, a Wilga, that came like that. It even came with an extra engine and all tools, it seemed as if they thought things through.



    Wow, now THAT would be an asset to find an old machine and the drawings for it! Not a capitalistic concept there I agree, here there is far too much money in selling OEM replacement parts to allow that.
    Two different philosophy's at work there. Western companies see the sale of spare parts as a very lucrative sideline. I suppose the Soviet thinking was that the manufacture of spare parts should be open to the customer if they had the facilities.

    Regards Tyrone.

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    One thing about all those old Russian films. Not too many smiling faces.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BGL View Post
    Always interesting to see other ideas and methods.

    '..soviets were still using vacuum tubes for example long after we were in the transistor era.'
    It is my understanding tubes are very tolerant of EMP and ESD events. Something to be said for that feature.

    In my teens visiting the Air and Space Museum in DC I was struck by Apollo-Soyuz display. To my mind it was like seeing a Ford tractor and Formula one car together. Knowing something about the speciality and finicky nature of race cars and the ruggard simplicity and reliability of a tractor, I would lean toward space traveling in the tractor but I suspect there is more detail to consider.
    From my experience with Russian tractors we had I wouldn't want to fly one, nor even travel on the highway, though sending them into space certainly sounds a good idea. As Tyrone says though, nothing ever went wrong that couldn't readily be fixed.


    Richard

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
    Two different philosophy's at work there. Western companies see the sale of spare parts as a very lucrative sideline. I suppose the Soviet thinking was that the manufacture of spare parts should be open to the customer if they had the facilities.

    Regards Tyrone.
    A customer bought a new old stock stanko lathe, it came with spare clutch plates halfnuts and crossfeed nut. A set of half nuts is £1400 and clutch plates are about 50 each from dsg

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    20180517_123730.jpg20180517_123747.jpg20180517_123845.jpg

    Pics from my manual

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
    Show me a factory full of machines without the nameplates etc and I could identify the Russian machines most of the time.
    A lot of Russian (and Czech-made Tos) machines came to NZ (C.W.F. Hamilton, Kiwis may recall), probably in the 1970's, maybe earlier. Russian lathes, mills, grinders and shapers Tos mills and drill presses and probably more.

    I used a Russian surface grinder a bit and it was quite good. Not an overly heavy machine. Also a big old lathe, the rapids on the carriage were the first I had come across, good as long as you kept clear...

    Anyway...I heard a description of the appearance, probably referring to the older, rounded-style lathes - "Quarried".
    Last edited by Peter S; 05-17-2018 at 10:28 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pressbrake1 View Post
    20180517_123730.jpg20180517_123747.jpg20180517_123845.jpg

    Pics from my manual
    They're just like the drawings I was referring to earlier.

    Regards Tyrone.


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