My crowded machine shop

Since we have at most two operators at a time, if a machine has a safe amount of room around it, it can be used where it is. However few of ours are so those not extremely level-sensitive are kept on pallets for easy moving when needed.

My machine shop, Intro:

http://www.pmdx.com/private-cloud/JohnMorrisHoard-1.mp4

My machine shop:

http://www.pmdx.com/private-cloud/JohnMorrisHoard-2.mp4

It has been the norm for 100 years that machine shops are over cramped with small walk ways, this do to the huge amount of tools crammed in to a small space because there is not the profit margin to pay the space we need. These shops become impossible to keep clean and the pathways clear. A field day for OSHA, until the profit improves nothing will change. As far as keeping machine on pallets until needed you will do jobs the hard way to avoid setting a machine up for a 5 min job, also there is a risk of tipping a machine over or breaking a handle off. Boy your floor will have to be clean to move the pallets around, and think or the power cords to feed all of that. You get a gold star for trying to salve the problem, I have fought it for 50+ years, no good outcome yet...Phil

A lot of stuff you have! I resemble that remark! Have the XL extension cord to power anything needed. although there is now some more hard wiring.

Although I like them I don't think I'll ever get another drill press. Other machines can do their job better.

I think the tagging and labeling is excellent. I've started into smaller tools, the next-of-kin is going to have no idea what to do with it. I'm going to leave HGR's phone number inside a "break glass in case of emergency" panel to help someone clear it out someday.

I've been hacking on the CAD layout to try to finish with 2 parking spaces for vehicles that can be backed-out if needed. Right now I have 3 entities without a place....so...

Hats off to anyone that can make a go of it in such limited space with so many machines . . . honestly, that would drive me crazy

We moved out of a 25,000 square foot facility that was "too small" and we have less than half the machines that are shown in this video. I remember buying a 21,000 lb Cleveland open side planer mill about a decade ago thinking this is the biggest machine we will need . . . last year we bought a Butler at 80,000+ pounds and I now I am wishing we had another 10,000 square feet in our new building and it is less than a year old!

I think the difference is that we build custom machines and design large control systems / machine retrofits and that pays better than a pure machining business does and that makes it easier to pay for more space.

I'd really like to expand my shop, or build a second building. The cost, I can handle. What I can't handle is the tax ASSessors showing up and raising my taxes over it.

GregSY said:

I'd really like to expand my shop, or build a second building. The cost, I can handle. What I can't handle is the tax ASSessors showing up and raising my taxes over it.

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How high is your mil rate there? We're at a bit under $18. The numbers on expanding must be very marginal if the capital costs are worth it but the property taxes make it not worth it.

motion guru said:

We moved out of a 25,000 square foot facility that was "too small" and we have less than half the machines that are shown in this video. I remember buying a 21,000 lb Cleveland open side planer mill about a decade ago thinking this is the biggest machine we will need . . . last year we bought a Butler at 80,000+ pounds and I now I am wishing we had another 10,000 square feet in our new building and it is less than a year old!

Click to expand...

The killer on those big mills is not only do you need space for the mill, you need open space next to it to flip parts.

Has that shop ever made anything? all I see is a warehouse full of old machinery.

SIP6A said:

Has that shop ever made anything? all I see is a warehouse full of old machinery.

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My feelings exactly. Looks like a used machine dealer to me.

SIP6A said:

Has that shop ever made anything? all I see is a warehouse full of old machinery.

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-Because of course it's widely known that machine tools stop working after about five years.

Doc.

Maybe the OP does want to sell tools. Got to admit, if his place was in my home town, I’d contact him.

L7

My shop IS crowded. When I laid it out I put the lathe, milling machine, and saw at an angle to the isles. This allows the stock or parts to stick out into the isles when that space is needed. My band saw is also against the back of the lathe bench and I often have stock run under the lathe while cutting it to length. That can actually take advantage of two isles. Now that I think about it, I could even have a 20' or even longer piece of stock sticking out the garage door while sawing it. I have no idea as to how OSHA would view this arrangement but I doubt that they would ever visit.

I have seen one shop where there was a lot of space between the machines and I mean an AWFUL LOT. You could easily drive forklifts up and down and even turn around at the crossings. It was a NASA facility and they probably had to plan for large parts: need I say more. I have also seen some very nice shops that were out in the woods, far from the nearest city. They also had a lot of space, but not as much as that NASA one. I suspect they were there because of the tax situation. It is also a real nice work environment. Most of those were on the same property as the owner's home. Set up and start a job on the CNC and take a stroll to the house to get lunch or a snack. Come back when it's done. Repeat.

DanielG said:

The killer on those big mills is not only do you need space for the mill, you need open space next to it to flip parts.

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I don't know what the tax rate is...but I know the taxes are high. What's worse is there is a cap on the amount the can raise your taxes each year...that keeps the tax man from going hog wild. But, the cap gets removed if you do any construction.

So, if I pour a 8' x 8' slab in my backyard, that counts as construction and the cap comes off....so a $2,000 shed can cost you 'untold millions' in added taxes over the next 20 years....

I think he is a collector, not a user.

Tom

Cannonmn said:

Since we have at most two operators at a time, if a machine has a safe amount of room around it, it can be used where it is. However few of ours are so those not extremely level-sensitive are kept on pallets for easy moving when needed.

My machine shop, Intro:

http://www.pmdx.com/private-cloud/JohnMorrisHoard-1.mp4

My machine shop:

http://www.pmdx.com/private-cloud/JohnMorrisHoard-2.mp4

Click to expand...

I hope he is not using that oxy Acetylene set with the Acetylene bottle laying down! No chips anywhere, not much happening there.

Hi All:
I agree with those who see a collector at work here, not a machine shop.
There are no chips anywhere I could see, but there is crap stacked on every machine to the point where it would take half a day just to get it clear enough to approach it and put on a job.
Maybe he uses some of these machines once in a while to make something for the "project" machines he's fixing, but I would go nuts if I had to actually make anything in there.
I may be wrong, and perhaps it does get used regularly, but I see a hazardous environment there and I can't see an OSHA inspector ever letting a facility like this have any employees in it...just the tripping hazard is extreme.

Cheers

Marcus
Implant Mechanix • Design & Innovation > HOME
Vancouver Wire EDM -- Wire EDM Machining

I guess all those tags attached to the machinery is a clear indications that the items are either for sale or stored in this space after being purchased. The rest points to it too, of course.

It can also be a combo of a storage and work shop for occasional use ("storage with benefits").

I counted:

5x surface grinders
2x tap extractors
2 press and 1 finger brake
8-10 drill presses depending how you count the gang drills
6x horizontal mills
3-4 Bandsaws
3x Moores, one grinder and 2 borers
2x pipe threaders
3x compressors
6x vertical mills including 1 CNC
~5x lathes including screw machine and turret
1 Shaper
1 Ironworker
3 presses (1 platen and two H-presses)

And no chips

Also, no proper tool storage. You can see he collects multi drawer office cabinets which is a common mistake people make thinking they make good tool storage. You really need Lista-style storage, it makes an enormous difference to clutter. Small outfits these days seem to mostly be general repair and fabrication shops, of which Abom79's is an excellent example, or production shops with CNC. For the former with two guys, you'd need the one big lathe, 1 Horizontal, maybe the 50tper OKK and a Bridgeport and the CNC if it was working. You'd also need one surface grinder and one band saw, but you'd be better off with cold saw and a horizontal band saw. The jig borers are serious antiques which have been almost entirely replaced by EDM. Dan Gelbart keeps one in his shop, along with a restored shaper and a small planer as decorations, but he has the space. Also if you are keeping the sheet metal stuff, get a CNC plasma or waterjet, (My friend just got a used waterjet for like $25K) and set up a more complete fabricating facility with an organized welding bench, a spot welder, and maybe spray or powder coat to go with the sand blaster. One can obviously argue which of these tools you would keep in a functional shop, but this currently is not a functional shop.

ps the cameraman's comment about saving on screw storage space by using a screw compressor was excellent.

I wish that my shop had that much open space. I'm the only one that ever works in it so all I need is room for the machines and myself. As to no chips, some people actually clean the work area after they are done working. I do and get comments about it a lot when someone visits my shop. I use a shop vac on the floors after the machines are cleaned off and I sweep up the big chips that won't vacuum up. I hate hearing my wife complain about finding chips in the house.

Granted when I was running 60 or 70 hours a week it was harder to keep up than now when I only occasionally do commercial jobs but I still managed to keep things clean.

You overlooked at least 3 forklifts.

This must be just storage even thought there are electrical outlets all around. All of the other stuff from cannonmn have been about moving into an old house. This building appears to be relatively new.

Tom