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Thread: Sidney lathe

  1. #21
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    Hi all. Looking at picking one of these up soon. It's 60" between centers. We are attempting to shoehorn it into a tight spot. Using the manual, which is a bit hard to read, I was figuring that a 6' bed was 97" for a 16 speed, which is 24" between centers, so a 60" centers would be 133". Does that sound reasonable to you all? Also, I take it that the models with the upper lever like KD4 shows all are 16 speed (herringbone models), and if all the levers are low down like b2's, it's the 12 speed? It's a '43, I guess that all of them were 16 speed then?

    Tony, dcheff, thanks.

  2. #22
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    In my undated brochures (which are likely different ages) 12 speed has handles you pull out to shift gears, 16 speed does not - so they must be spring loaded detents. Good view of the "pull-out" handles in post #3

    Have some "mimeographed" (how old is that?) price sheets - lots of money back in the day

    I'd guess 9 ft on 60" centers. Sid says the 66" centers M16 20" was only 9 foot "rated" bed length

    This more less aligns with my CW16 X 102 Monarch which is 14 foot - seems like about 10 foot for 60"?

    Thumbnail is M32 Fluid Tracer with the later style "handles" for shifting gears. I would imagine this is on up in the fifties.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails scan-02.jpg  

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnoder View Post
    In my undated brochures (which are likely different ages) 12 speed has handles you pull out to shift gears, 16 speed does not - so they must be spring loaded detents. Good view of the "pull-out" handles in post #3

    Have some "mimeographed" (how old is that?) price sheets - lots of money back in the day

    I'd guess 9 ft on 60" centers. Sid says the 66" centers M16 20" was only 9 foot "rated" bed length

    This more less aligns with my CW16 X 102 Monarch which is 14 foot - seems like about 10 foot for 60"?

    Thumbnail is M32 Fluid Tracer with the later style "handles" for shifting gears. I would imagine this is on up in the fifties.
    It must be a herringbone model then. I'm not trying to figure out the bed length, but the total. Seller said 12 feet. I don't think it's quite 12 feet. There is a ledge that the clutch housing can stick over, otherwise it needs to fit in a 134" location.

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    Happy to see some activity on Sidney lathes again, and was pleasantly surprised to see all of the great information posted on Tony's lathe page. That is awesome! My Sidney is still going strong, and everyone who visits the shop comments on how massive it is for its model designation, a 14. The carriage is just huge, and the ways are bigger than any other machine I've seen in its class. Very rigid. No wonder they never wear out! Hopefully "ClappedOutBport," you already have arranged to fit the Sidney you found in your shop. You will not regret it.

    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by b2major9th View Post
    Happy to see some activity on Sidney lathes again, and was pleasantly surprised to see all of the great information posted on Tony's lathe page. That is awesome! My Sidney is still going strong, and everyone who visits the shop comments on how massive it is for its model designation, a 14. The carriage is just huge, and the ways are bigger than any other machine I've seen in its class. Very rigid. No wonder they never wear out! Hopefully "ClappedOutBport," you already have arranged to fit the Sidney you found in your shop. You will not regret it.

    Mike
    The Sidney is one of the lathes that was in the back of my mind as a take-to-the-grave type machine. Dad casually brought up that he saw one for sale cheap, didn't even think it was worth mentioning to me. I gave him quite a scolding on just how good these machines are haha. He's got quite a tight shop that is already overfull, but it's hard to let these great machines go. We've got a giant miller 330A/B, royersford excelsior, bridgeport, 10x36 lathe, rockwell 20" DP, keller hacksaw, a bunch of woodworking tools, workbenches, etc. It's packed. So there really isn't room for these machines, but I'd like to buy some off him when I get a little older and have some money. I think he's wanted a bit better lathe for a while too and seems pretty on-board. It's gonna be a monumental task fitting it into the shop if we grab it. I guess it will depend on condition.

  6. #26
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    It must be a herringbone model then
    Easy to tell - if 12 speeds it isn't and if 16 (or much later 32) it is

    There are also the late twenties / early thirties Monotrol and Tritrol, many of which were 8 speed, with some later being 16 speed - all herringbone

    There are no 12 speed herringbone Sidneys

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    I inspected it today. Very promising. Not too badly worn. It's more like a 48" or maybe 54" between centers depending on how it's measured. The handles on the headstock were all buggered, and the cross-slide screw attachment casting on the back was busted. Any parts machines out there or would I have to fix everything? It also had a bad knocking sound from the QCGB at higher speeds. I didn't see a broken gear, but maybe a bent shaft or chip packing. Headstock seemed fine internally.

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    I’d plan on fixing or recreating what you have.
    Low probability on parts machines with Sidney’s relatively low production numbers.
    High probability the outcome will be worth the effort.

    Scott

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    Agree with Scott. I’m just reproducing the broken or missing parts on my 32 instead of searching for parts.

    Neil

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    Quote Originally Posted by svs View Post
    I’d plan on fixing or recreating what you have.
    Low probability on parts machines with Sidney’s relatively low production numbers.
    High probability the outcome will be worth the effort.

    Scott
    Yep, that's certainly the plan B, and probably now plan A. Won't take too long. I'm decently quick at making new parts. We brought her home today, all 4700 or so LBS.

    sidney.jpg

    Now comes the riskiest part, unloading. The guy had it rigged and ready when we got there, slung/sitting on a two post car lift. Probably wasn't 15 minutes from the initial lift to starting to strap her down. I'm pretty exited. It even came with the factory steady.

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    Congratulations-that is a nice size for an all around lathe. My Sidney is 30” centers and it’s occasionally limiting.

    Good luck as you dig in to it.

    Scott

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    Quote Originally Posted by svs View Post
    Congratulations-that is a nice size for an all around lathe. My Sidney is 30” centers and it’s occasionally limiting.

    Good luck as you dig in to it.

    Scott
    Luck is what we needed indeed. Didn't get quite enough though.

    Does anyone know what kind of how the front spindle seal works? The manual doesn't show any seal at all really.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ClappedOutBport View Post
    Luck is what we needed indeed. Didn't get quite enough though.

    Does anyone know what kind of how the front spindle seal works? The manual doesn't show any seal at all really.

    There is no rubbing seal in many machine tools. Labyrinth was the preferred design - tends to redirect oil back into head stock via a drain. All it takes to make it not work is stopped up drain

    Its normal for such "seals" to readily loose oil if you tilt the machine in the process of moving - ON EDIT - Or if you simply overfill!
    Last edited by johnoder; 01-14-2020 at 12:56 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnoder View Post
    There is no rubbing seal in many machine tools. Labyrinth was the preferred design - tends to redirect oil back into head stock via a drain. All it takes to make it not work is stopped up drain

    Its normal for such "seals" to readily loose oil if you tilt the machine in the process of moving
    Ok. I was thinking as such. We have some diesel in there for flushing and it was coming out, I reckon due to the viscosity. Thanks John.

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    Does anyone have the manual for the 16" Herringbone version? Or have experience with tearing the headstock down? We found a bearing with over 1/16" of slop on the first intermediate shaft and have decided that we must investigate them all and fix the other issues while we are in there.

    The herringbone uses tapered rollers as opposed to the dual-row angular contact of the spur model, so if we had the manual or a picture of the headstock diagram we could order bearings ahead of time.

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    I have a 16” herringbone manual. It is on my to do list to scan and upload but I haven’t carved out the time yet. Send me a pm with your mobile and I will text you a few photos of the diagrams.

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