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Van Norman benchtop miller

"This one just came in and it's a pretty tight little machine"
...After we dunked the whole thing in a barrel of "Ford Blue" which we get cheap
off the back of a truck....:nutter:

Tightened it right up....
 
If it was painted machine gray I don't think it would be getting the criticism. The previous owners did take care to mask off some of the important parts (not all though).
The gearbox is cleverly done.
 
The machine tool in the fleabay ad is obviously a bench mill that was modified for one specific production operation. The word "butchery" comes to mind in describing what the end result is. I am sure that in its present configuration, the mill was used for that one specific production operation, and when the job or run was done with, the mill was bunted off into storage to gather dust. It's the kind of thing that turns up at shop auctions, where odd lots of production tooling are lumped together and go for pocket change. It is also the kind of thing that I used to see sitting in the windows of the old used machine tool dealers along Centre Street in NYC in the 1960's. There was a shelf directly inside the store windows, and instead of "window dressing" in a formal sense, the dealers would often throw whatever odd small production tooling and small specialized machine tools onto that window shelf. There might be a small chucker or small high speed drill press, along with heaps of odd tooling, jigs, fixtures, a half dozen large dial indicators left over from WWII production work... the stuff would gather dust and never seemed to be sold or changed out.

My guess is that little production mill was one of those items which, in an earlier era, would have wound up gathering dust in some used machine tool dealer's store window. With the advent of fleabay and aerosol cans of paint, what would have been an anchor in a very static window display suddenly becomes "rare" and gets a "rebuild" with a coat of garish paint and gets a price tag that is astronomical. The words that come to mind for this fleabay listing are "delusional" and "insane". Clearly, the person(s) who cooked up this listing latched onto the name "van Norman" and perhaps, being machine tool pirates of sorts, figured that van Norman made larger milling machines with universal heads, so this had to be "rare". Any right-thinking person with a smattering of machine shop or machine tool knowledge and a bit of ethics in their makeup would know this particular mill has next to no practical use as a regular machine tool.

"Caveat emptor"- "let the buyer beware" is the real watchword for anyone browsing fleabay and showing any interest in buying stuff off it. A person with next to no machine shop knowledge, starting their home machine shop might see this little abortion and be tempted- supporting P.T. Barnum's adage: "There's a sucker born every minute". With a bright blue paint job, the van Norman name, the small size and the word "rare", the sellers are trolling for a sucker.

In answer to Digger Doug's question about the drawbar: the whole machine is a massive modification of a small bench mill. The arbor needs a drawbar and the normal location and configuration of drawbar are blocked by the shaft coupling for the spindle drive. Possibly, the drawbar issue was addressed by making a shouldered bushing to fit in the end of the spindle. This bushing could have been counterbored for a socket-head screw. The socket head screw would then be coupled to the shortened drawbar with a threaded "************ coupling" or simply welded to a sleeve coupling. The largest diameter of the bushing would be a touch smaller (or the same diameter as) the tail end of the spindle. The shaft coupling for the motor drive could then be slid onto the tail end of the spindle and made up.

Given the whole nature of this machine, I would not be surprised if the arbor was tack-welded into the spindle. With the original drawbar intact and sucking the arbor tight into the spindle, the hackmeisters probably tacked the arbor to the spindle. Once this was done, the drawbar was removed and the coupling for the motor drive made up on the tail end of the spindle.

We have a butchered abortion of a mill made by hackmeisters, now offered for sale on fleabay by schlockmeisters.
 
Just noticed the price; they are delusional.

As for hobby use: forget it.

I agree that it was probably put together for one specific production run. I can imagine the previous owner getting the mill and the gearbox for next to nothing. In my opinion, if he was able to cobble this together and then make money from it, it was a success. Cleverly done.
 
I have an original Van Norman Bench Miller. The one on ebay has been butchered. The draw bar goes in the back off the spindle where the added drive is. mine has a flat belt cone pulley between the spindle bearings. It's table doesn't look original. The handles don't look original. I would stay away from it.
 
The big issue with this mini mill is that the arbor is non standard, so would have to custom build your cutter setups, which would be very time consuming, so the tool is pretty much a curiosity project at best.

Another issue is that it has a very short lever feed. It was obviously designed to cut very short slots or keyways of a few inches at most. Since you will often want to cut longer slots, you would have to also rebuild the table with some kind of motorized drive or replace the table with a linear drive table, which would be another project.

The advantages of the machine are that you get some heavy iron and a potentially nice gear box that would be quite expensive to try to reproduce.
 
The two big S&F cutters seem a bit optimistic.....but I think its a quite well done mod on an old machine that otherwise be scrap...with a small saw or s&f cutter ,for doing small keyways ,or maybe slotting collets,the old thing is useful again.....price of course is 10x too much.....but thats fleabay.
 
I have to totally agree with the ebay seller's description as "rare". It's probably one-of-a-kind, and that's a good thing.

Presumably whatever it was made to do, it does, or used to. But nobody else will ever need that done.

"Schlockmeisters" is pretty good description of the sellers, although "goniffs" would do as well. "Dreck" is a good description of the "machine" considered as a machine.

The best you could hope for is that the added stuff can be removed and "sold separately".

But even then, aside from being old, the mill, even if in factory perfect condition, is not very useful as a mill in these days, it would mostly be "collector bait".
 
It's funny I have the exact same machine at home... only from a different maker and 50 years older, but same style of micro production mill with rack-n-gear lever movement, small travels.... and a missing spindle! I wouldn't be surprised if the shop that threw this together got around the oddball arbor issue by making a whole new spindle with integral arbor (no drawbar to cover up). Hopefully that's not the case and hopefully whoever buys it can negotiate a more honest price and find a pair of cone pulleys to put it back together. I agree that it has limited use in a modern shop, but little horizontals do have a charm to them. Mabey someone will get it as a second op machine for their other VN mill.
 








 
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