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...Videos...Paras Lathes...
- Thread starter lathefan
- Start date
- Replies 6
- Views 1,682
Joe Michaels
Diamond
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Location
- Shandaken, NY, USA
Lathefan:
I've found youtubes made by Indian machine tool builders similar to the one you posted. In several of the youtubes, planers using the flat-belt drive system were demonstrated. These are apparently in current production in India. A number of small firms in India are manufacturing very basic machine tools. Belt driven lathes such as the ones in this youtube seem to be quite common, along with shapers, planers, and blacksmith's power hammers. The shops which produce these machine tools are sometimes shown in the youtubes, and are often building built of rough brick masonry with sides open to the weather. In other youtubes, the foundries where the parts of the machine tools are cast are shown. Foundry workers are often minimally clothed, barefoot, and safety gear is non existant. Cupola furnaces are used to melt the iron. In one youtube, barefoot women ram the sand molds using the soles of their feet.
I do not think the machine tools of the type shown in this youtube are exported beyond India and surrounding countries. The machine tool designs are simple and basic from what I see in the youtube, and the workmanship is likely crude. India is a country of wide contrasts, as I am sure most people know. Abject poverty and primitive conditions in rural areas, teeming slums in the cities, and then there is high tech manufacturing along with the kind of manufacturing that produced these lathes.
In a country the size of India, the machine tools of the type shown in this youtube are probably somewhere near the bottom of the barrel, and are probably made to sell to small repair shops and rural shops. I've been watching youtubes of Pakistani truck mechanics, and with next to no tools, they do some heavy truck repairs (and patch up trucks that would never be allowed on the roads in the USA). In several of those youtubes, lathes of the type shown in these youtubes are used by the Pakistani truck mechanics to turn flywheels and do driveshaft work. The shops are little more than a hole-in-the-wall, and the mechanics make-do with very little in the way of tools. The lathes see massive amounts of abuse, look to be hard used, but being simply built are being used to get the work out.
By contrast, I've watched youtubes of small Vietnamese mechanic's shops. These mechanics work on smaller diesel engines (Yanmar 1 cylinder engines and probably Chinese clones of them). A few of the Vietnamese mechanics have some lathes of the design/type shown in these youtubes, but most seem to have geared head lathes. Their shops are small holes-in-the-wall, often right on a canal or river. In one of the Vietnamese youtubes, the mechanics proudly show a Storm-Vulcan crankshaft grinder, pointing to the Storm-Vulcan name cast on the bed, and the "Made in USA". The dialog is all Vietnamese, but they seemed to make a point of showing off this older Storm-Vulcan crankshaft grinder. In other youtubes, used machine tool dealers in Vietnam showed their shops and inventory. It reminded me very much of the used machine tool dealers in NYC when I was a kid. The difference was the Vietnamese machine tool dealers had large inventories of manual machine tools made by Japanese builders. Mori-Seiki lathes, Japanese milling machines, and other basic manual machine tools. Whether the Vietnamese used machine tool dealers go to Japan to buy up used machine tools for their inventory, or whether the machine tools came into Vietnam as new is unknown. What is obvious is the Vietnamese seem to favor Japanese machine tools over Chinese or Indian machine tools.
India has some very modern industry, and produces automobiles, trucks, tractors, and does so with state of the art technology. While we could debate the quality of the Royal Enfield motorcycles (made in India), youtubes of the Royal Enfield factory show CNC machining centers, robotics, and all the latest technologies in use. India seems to have a "gradient" as far as the technologies used in their industries and the products produced. Along with these simple lathes, we could also place the "Listeroid" diesel engines- Indian copies of the older Lister diesel engines. I am sure there are rural machine shops in India where lathes like the ones in this youtube are driven by a Listeroid diesel. Both of these represent a technology that a segment of the population can afford to buy, knows how to use, and knows how to maintain and repair.
I've found youtubes made by Indian machine tool builders similar to the one you posted. In several of the youtubes, planers using the flat-belt drive system were demonstrated. These are apparently in current production in India. A number of small firms in India are manufacturing very basic machine tools. Belt driven lathes such as the ones in this youtube seem to be quite common, along with shapers, planers, and blacksmith's power hammers. The shops which produce these machine tools are sometimes shown in the youtubes, and are often building built of rough brick masonry with sides open to the weather. In other youtubes, the foundries where the parts of the machine tools are cast are shown. Foundry workers are often minimally clothed, barefoot, and safety gear is non existant. Cupola furnaces are used to melt the iron. In one youtube, barefoot women ram the sand molds using the soles of their feet.
I do not think the machine tools of the type shown in this youtube are exported beyond India and surrounding countries. The machine tool designs are simple and basic from what I see in the youtube, and the workmanship is likely crude. India is a country of wide contrasts, as I am sure most people know. Abject poverty and primitive conditions in rural areas, teeming slums in the cities, and then there is high tech manufacturing along with the kind of manufacturing that produced these lathes.
In a country the size of India, the machine tools of the type shown in this youtube are probably somewhere near the bottom of the barrel, and are probably made to sell to small repair shops and rural shops. I've been watching youtubes of Pakistani truck mechanics, and with next to no tools, they do some heavy truck repairs (and patch up trucks that would never be allowed on the roads in the USA). In several of those youtubes, lathes of the type shown in these youtubes are used by the Pakistani truck mechanics to turn flywheels and do driveshaft work. The shops are little more than a hole-in-the-wall, and the mechanics make-do with very little in the way of tools. The lathes see massive amounts of abuse, look to be hard used, but being simply built are being used to get the work out.
By contrast, I've watched youtubes of small Vietnamese mechanic's shops. These mechanics work on smaller diesel engines (Yanmar 1 cylinder engines and probably Chinese clones of them). A few of the Vietnamese mechanics have some lathes of the design/type shown in these youtubes, but most seem to have geared head lathes. Their shops are small holes-in-the-wall, often right on a canal or river. In one of the Vietnamese youtubes, the mechanics proudly show a Storm-Vulcan crankshaft grinder, pointing to the Storm-Vulcan name cast on the bed, and the "Made in USA". The dialog is all Vietnamese, but they seemed to make a point of showing off this older Storm-Vulcan crankshaft grinder. In other youtubes, used machine tool dealers in Vietnam showed their shops and inventory. It reminded me very much of the used machine tool dealers in NYC when I was a kid. The difference was the Vietnamese machine tool dealers had large inventories of manual machine tools made by Japanese builders. Mori-Seiki lathes, Japanese milling machines, and other basic manual machine tools. Whether the Vietnamese used machine tool dealers go to Japan to buy up used machine tools for their inventory, or whether the machine tools came into Vietnam as new is unknown. What is obvious is the Vietnamese seem to favor Japanese machine tools over Chinese or Indian machine tools.
India has some very modern industry, and produces automobiles, trucks, tractors, and does so with state of the art technology. While we could debate the quality of the Royal Enfield motorcycles (made in India), youtubes of the Royal Enfield factory show CNC machining centers, robotics, and all the latest technologies in use. India seems to have a "gradient" as far as the technologies used in their industries and the products produced. Along with these simple lathes, we could also place the "Listeroid" diesel engines- Indian copies of the older Lister diesel engines. I am sure there are rural machine shops in India where lathes like the ones in this youtube are driven by a Listeroid diesel. Both of these represent a technology that a segment of the population can afford to buy, knows how to use, and knows how to maintain and repair.
Joe Michaels
Diamond
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Location
- Shandaken, NY, USA
Lathefan:
Thank you for posting this youtube. I really enjoyed seeing and hearing the Indian machinist demonstrating how to "pick up a thread". As you note, the machine shop in the youtube is like rolling the clock back in the USA a good many years. When we see youtubes of "time capsule"/closed old machine shops in the USA, we often see similar shops, left as they were when work ceased years ago. The climate in India is temperate, if not downright hot, so the shop in this youtube has an open front. I noted the two elephants with upraised/touching trunks cut out of steel plate as a header/ornament on the entry gate to the shop. I believe the elephants in this motif are a good-luck symbol. The Indian machinist is obviously not afraid of taking on all sorts of work, and doing it on a lathe many people in the USA might call unsafe, worn out, too light, and any number of other descriptions.
The shop in this youtube is very much like some of the machine shops I found in South America when I worked there in the late 70's-1981. People who use what they have, make things work, and keep their local industries and businesses rolling along.
I tend to believe there is a bond between people who have a skilled trade such as machinists, and that bond often transcends cultural, political and religious differences. I found that to be true when I worked overseas, and when it was apparent I knew what I was looking at, let alone could handle myself in a machine shop or engine room, I was made welcome and accepted in a way that is hard to describe. I had told my son about this, and he found it out for himself. Our son had spent a semester studying in Amman, Jordan. He is fairly proficient in Arabic, and open minded and accepting of very nearly anyone of any culture. After his semester in Jordan wrapped up, he went into Egypt to tour a bit. As he told me afterwards, he was walking the streets of Cairo way late one night (this was before the upheavals of "the Arab Spring" and similar events). As he walked around Cairo, he came to a street which was dedicated to vehicle repair. As our son told it, any sort of vehicle, from motorcycles to busses and trucks, was being worked on in the street, out under the streetlights. Jacks and jackstands supported the vehicles and mechanics ran in and out of hole-in-the-wall shops with parts and tools. As our son walked along this street, he looked into an open-front shop and saw a machinist running an older geared-head engine lathe. They made eye contact, and exchanged greetings in Arabic. Our son then said simply: "My father is an engineer". With that, the fellow got all the other men in that shop and they ushered our son in, made tea, and gave him quite a welcome. What the machinist was doing was turning new shafts for what looked like GM automotive water pumps. Our son told me that he was quite surprised by the welcome he got, and began to understand what I'd told him about the bond between peoples who have a skilled and similar trade. Watching the youtube, I felt that same sort of thing for the Indian machinist. I liked his style of teaching, and if I met the man, I am sure we'd hit it off well.
Many years ago, the late Mike Korol, an erecting engineer for Skinner Engine, went on a 'last hurrah' type of job/tour. Skinner had sold some mechanical drive turbines to a fertilizer factory somewhere in a remote area of India. Mike was ready to retire for about the third time, and agreed to go to India on the startup of the turbines for Skinner. He told me afterwards about the trip. He landed in one of the major cities, and had a reservation on a train, first class sleeper, to go to the region where the job was located. As Mike told it, the railway officials were pompous and insisted he sign endless forms acknowledging and taking responsibility for the bedding in his sleeping compartment. In those days, the train was still pulled by a steam locomotive, which Mike really enjoyed seeing. The train rolled across a major chunk of India, and eventually, Mike got to the job site. There, he found some local millwrights and machinists who were assigned to work with him. He said these guys were skin-and-bone, minimally clad, and incredible craftsmen able to work with next to nothing. Mike was an oldtime machinist and engine erector, and for him to have high praise for the men at that jobsite was something not lightly given. He wound up giving those men nearly all of his clothing (never mind that they likely had a local tailor make a couple or three sets of clothes from the material, since Mike was a bigger man physically). He also gave them damned near anything he could spare in the way of tools. Mike proceeded on a "grand tour" after that, sleeper train back from that region, then headed to Europe to visit Poland, the land his parents had emigrated from, before coming home. When he got home, he made up a large parcel of more clothes, work boots, shim stock, music wire (for alignment of machinery), and anything else he thought those men on that job site could use. Mike said those men were used to working on stationary steam engines, including some Corliss engines, and he taught them about the mechanical drive steam turbines, the Woodward governors, mechanical shaft seals, and they caught right on quickly. Mike had obviously made friends with the crew on that job in some remote end of India. Mike tended to also find that same common bond I've referred to when he went on steam engine erecting and overhaul jobs.
FWIW: our family doctor was a wonderful physician who ran her practice out of her home. Our physician was a graduate of Harvard med school (phi beta kappa undergrad, residency at some Boston area hospitals), and was incredibly thorough in her examination and treatment of us, and used her hands to do a lot of the examinations. She retired, and we had to find a new doctor. I tried another local doctor, but the degree of care and thoroughness which our previous doctor had put into her work was just not there. One day, the doctor I'd been using was unavailable, and I was assigned to be seen by a new doctor in the practice with the last name of "Goodrich". I was quite surprised when a tall, very good looking woman of obvious Indian extraction walked into the examining room. She took a lot of time to get to know me, and gave me an exam with the same methods and thoroughness our old doctor had used. I was floored, and told Dr. Goodrich that I had not had that kind of examination since our previous doctor retired. Doctor Goodrich put her finger on a few issues that the replacement for our old doctor had either glossed over, or missed. Needless to say, I switched over to Doctor Goodrich. As it turns out, Doctor Goodrich is Punjabi, raised in Canada. Our original doctor is married to a fellow named Nadir, who is also a Punjabi. Our old doctor and Doctor Goodrich are friends, and when I told our old doctor I'd switched over to Dr. Goodrich because she followed the same methods, our old doctor remarked: "We have a REAL doctor in our area again". Dr. Goodrich and the machinist in this thread have much of the same sort of thoroughness but are seemingly laid back and easy to be around, while being able to communicate and do their work quite well. I knew as soon as Dr. Goodrich examined me routinely, that I was in capable and good hands- literally. The machinist in this youtube conveys that same sort of feeling.
Thank you for posting this youtube. I really enjoyed seeing and hearing the Indian machinist demonstrating how to "pick up a thread". As you note, the machine shop in the youtube is like rolling the clock back in the USA a good many years. When we see youtubes of "time capsule"/closed old machine shops in the USA, we often see similar shops, left as they were when work ceased years ago. The climate in India is temperate, if not downright hot, so the shop in this youtube has an open front. I noted the two elephants with upraised/touching trunks cut out of steel plate as a header/ornament on the entry gate to the shop. I believe the elephants in this motif are a good-luck symbol. The Indian machinist is obviously not afraid of taking on all sorts of work, and doing it on a lathe many people in the USA might call unsafe, worn out, too light, and any number of other descriptions.
The shop in this youtube is very much like some of the machine shops I found in South America when I worked there in the late 70's-1981. People who use what they have, make things work, and keep their local industries and businesses rolling along.
I tend to believe there is a bond between people who have a skilled trade such as machinists, and that bond often transcends cultural, political and religious differences. I found that to be true when I worked overseas, and when it was apparent I knew what I was looking at, let alone could handle myself in a machine shop or engine room, I was made welcome and accepted in a way that is hard to describe. I had told my son about this, and he found it out for himself. Our son had spent a semester studying in Amman, Jordan. He is fairly proficient in Arabic, and open minded and accepting of very nearly anyone of any culture. After his semester in Jordan wrapped up, he went into Egypt to tour a bit. As he told me afterwards, he was walking the streets of Cairo way late one night (this was before the upheavals of "the Arab Spring" and similar events). As he walked around Cairo, he came to a street which was dedicated to vehicle repair. As our son told it, any sort of vehicle, from motorcycles to busses and trucks, was being worked on in the street, out under the streetlights. Jacks and jackstands supported the vehicles and mechanics ran in and out of hole-in-the-wall shops with parts and tools. As our son walked along this street, he looked into an open-front shop and saw a machinist running an older geared-head engine lathe. They made eye contact, and exchanged greetings in Arabic. Our son then said simply: "My father is an engineer". With that, the fellow got all the other men in that shop and they ushered our son in, made tea, and gave him quite a welcome. What the machinist was doing was turning new shafts for what looked like GM automotive water pumps. Our son told me that he was quite surprised by the welcome he got, and began to understand what I'd told him about the bond between peoples who have a skilled and similar trade. Watching the youtube, I felt that same sort of thing for the Indian machinist. I liked his style of teaching, and if I met the man, I am sure we'd hit it off well.
Many years ago, the late Mike Korol, an erecting engineer for Skinner Engine, went on a 'last hurrah' type of job/tour. Skinner had sold some mechanical drive turbines to a fertilizer factory somewhere in a remote area of India. Mike was ready to retire for about the third time, and agreed to go to India on the startup of the turbines for Skinner. He told me afterwards about the trip. He landed in one of the major cities, and had a reservation on a train, first class sleeper, to go to the region where the job was located. As Mike told it, the railway officials were pompous and insisted he sign endless forms acknowledging and taking responsibility for the bedding in his sleeping compartment. In those days, the train was still pulled by a steam locomotive, which Mike really enjoyed seeing. The train rolled across a major chunk of India, and eventually, Mike got to the job site. There, he found some local millwrights and machinists who were assigned to work with him. He said these guys were skin-and-bone, minimally clad, and incredible craftsmen able to work with next to nothing. Mike was an oldtime machinist and engine erector, and for him to have high praise for the men at that jobsite was something not lightly given. He wound up giving those men nearly all of his clothing (never mind that they likely had a local tailor make a couple or three sets of clothes from the material, since Mike was a bigger man physically). He also gave them damned near anything he could spare in the way of tools. Mike proceeded on a "grand tour" after that, sleeper train back from that region, then headed to Europe to visit Poland, the land his parents had emigrated from, before coming home. When he got home, he made up a large parcel of more clothes, work boots, shim stock, music wire (for alignment of machinery), and anything else he thought those men on that job site could use. Mike said those men were used to working on stationary steam engines, including some Corliss engines, and he taught them about the mechanical drive steam turbines, the Woodward governors, mechanical shaft seals, and they caught right on quickly. Mike had obviously made friends with the crew on that job in some remote end of India. Mike tended to also find that same common bond I've referred to when he went on steam engine erecting and overhaul jobs.
FWIW: our family doctor was a wonderful physician who ran her practice out of her home. Our physician was a graduate of Harvard med school (phi beta kappa undergrad, residency at some Boston area hospitals), and was incredibly thorough in her examination and treatment of us, and used her hands to do a lot of the examinations. She retired, and we had to find a new doctor. I tried another local doctor, but the degree of care and thoroughness which our previous doctor had put into her work was just not there. One day, the doctor I'd been using was unavailable, and I was assigned to be seen by a new doctor in the practice with the last name of "Goodrich". I was quite surprised when a tall, very good looking woman of obvious Indian extraction walked into the examining room. She took a lot of time to get to know me, and gave me an exam with the same methods and thoroughness our old doctor had used. I was floored, and told Dr. Goodrich that I had not had that kind of examination since our previous doctor retired. Doctor Goodrich put her finger on a few issues that the replacement for our old doctor had either glossed over, or missed. Needless to say, I switched over to Doctor Goodrich. As it turns out, Doctor Goodrich is Punjabi, raised in Canada. Our original doctor is married to a fellow named Nadir, who is also a Punjabi. Our old doctor and Doctor Goodrich are friends, and when I told our old doctor I'd switched over to Dr. Goodrich because she followed the same methods, our old doctor remarked: "We have a REAL doctor in our area again". Dr. Goodrich and the machinist in this thread have much of the same sort of thoroughness but are seemingly laid back and easy to be around, while being able to communicate and do their work quite well. I knew as soon as Dr. Goodrich examined me routinely, that I was in capable and good hands- literally. The machinist in this youtube conveys that same sort of feeling.
...thanks again for the commentary Joe...very interesting...
...one more Indian video linked below...
...young man welds up a damaged shaft starting at 2:05 of the video...then turns it in a lathe...
...lathe work starts at 7:45...lathe is equipped with a FOUR JAW universal scroll chuck...
...chuck end of the work runs true...but the center hole in the other end is no longer true...his method of dealing with the problem at 9:13 of the video using a common hardware nut is fascinating...also no indicators used...strictly eyeball truing...
YouTube
...one more Indian video linked below...
...young man welds up a damaged shaft starting at 2:05 of the video...then turns it in a lathe...
...lathe work starts at 7:45...lathe is equipped with a FOUR JAW universal scroll chuck...
...chuck end of the work runs true...but the center hole in the other end is no longer true...his method of dealing with the problem at 9:13 of the video using a common hardware nut is fascinating...also no indicators used...strictly eyeball truing...
YouTube
magneticanomaly
Titanium
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2007
- Location
- On Elk Mountain, West Virginia, USA
Ha! Looks like my shop!
The trick used in the first video of setting compound parallel to ways to allow "phasing" the tool works, but the way I do it is to set compound to a degree off thread flank angle, then I can "phase" with the cross-slide. Then you have to run the tool all the way into the existing thread to be sure it is exacty right. Press-fit spigot and socket followed by shallow weld may be okay for a lightly loaded shaft, and certainly lets you get the extension truer so you have less turning ot do, but I prefer to bevel to a point an weld solid.
I am not at all sure why the fellow enlarging the motor shaft did not just make a bushing, nor why he left the brearing on to cook while welding, nor why he did not run the bearing (or bearing seat) in a steadyrest to get the enlarged shaft true. The nut trick looks good, but you would have to take very light cuts lest it shift.
Still it is fun to see skilled people making things work with limited resources.
The trick used in the first video of setting compound parallel to ways to allow "phasing" the tool works, but the way I do it is to set compound to a degree off thread flank angle, then I can "phase" with the cross-slide. Then you have to run the tool all the way into the existing thread to be sure it is exacty right. Press-fit spigot and socket followed by shallow weld may be okay for a lightly loaded shaft, and certainly lets you get the extension truer so you have less turning ot do, but I prefer to bevel to a point an weld solid.
I am not at all sure why the fellow enlarging the motor shaft did not just make a bushing, nor why he left the brearing on to cook while welding, nor why he did not run the bearing (or bearing seat) in a steadyrest to get the enlarged shaft true. The nut trick looks good, but you would have to take very light cuts lest it shift.
Still it is fun to see skilled people making things work with limited resources.
Rob F.
Diamond
- Joined
- Aug 5, 2012
- Location
- California, Central Coast
I just saw this nice looking 4 jaw scroll chuck on ebay, reminded me of this thread:
Rohm 4-Jaw Lathe Chuck 6 1/4" | eBay
