What's new
What's new

#4 Kearney from Memphis to SE Texas

davohouston

Hot Rolled
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Location
A little north of Houston, TX
Kind of quiet on this forum lately. I had been watching JB Bergmans ad for over 2 months..

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/machinery-sale-wanted/kearney-trecker-4ch-sale-205130/

...and so far nobody has taken the mill so Im going to do what I can to keep it from getting melted down. I have talked to JB and im planning on driving up there aug 19, spending the night and loading it up fri morning aug 20 and driving home. Its about 550 miles one way.

Will be driving my old 1988 C7000 up there to haul the mill home. I hope the mill doesnt weigh much more than the 10,500 listed in the ad. I have weighed my truck and I have 13,000 lb load capacity avail. Truck weighs 11K with a full 60 gal tank, gvw is 24K.

I figured on using 2 chains and binders to the front and 2 more to the rear. I only have one good chain so I have to buy 3 , 3/8 chains and 4 ratchet binders. Dave
 
How much is enough ? ? ?

Dave,

DOT expects any load to be restrained .8g in the forward direction and .5g in all others. If you round the .8g up to 1g, this means the restraint in the forward direction needs to be the weight of the mill = 10,000# (or whatever it really is -- you need to find this out).

A grade 70 (gold) 3/8" chain has a rated working load limit (WLL), so at least two chains would be required in the forward direction. A grade 30 3/8" chain is the lowest rating -- it has only a 2,650# WLL and four chains would be required in the forward direction. If your chain is not gold-color plated or otherwise marked, DOT will assume it is only grade 30. (As discussed below, the number of "chains" above is the number of "falls" -- if a piece of chain is long enough, it can often provide two "falls" by going around and returning to the same or another anchor point.)

DOT regs do not focus on the fact that a load might be top-heavy, but reality and any inspecting officer will expect you to have some common-sense attention paid to restraining the load from tipping over. One common way to approach this is to provide at least the minimum amount of restraint for both the bottom and the top of the load independently. If you provide the full level of restraint for the top and bottom independently, then you will also give yourself a bit of safety margin. (By the way, do not take a chain or strap over the knee or table. The jack screw's bronze nut is not up to taking this kind of load and could fail. One way to overcome this is to put some wooden blocking between the knee and the base, with the knee run down on it to take the load. I would avoid this myself.)

Geometry comes into the picture, causing you to need 1.5 times more restraint if a chain is at a 45-degree angle to the direction being restrained, but if you have chains going to all four corners each pair works together so you pick up a bit of safety margin if you skip the trigonometry and think in terms of the chains being run fore & aft (or side to side) even though they are going to the corners.

Under the base you can put in a rubber pad to help the weight of the machine get a grip on the deck -- DOT allows this, but does not tell anyone how much of the required restraint to be allowed, so I recommend doing it in addition to meeting the minimum restraints. On a wooden deck, you can have a nest of 2x lumber securely lagged to the deck -- I even have lagged the four holes in the machine base, but on a 4CH these will be some rather large lag bolts. If you have a non-wooden deck, you can still provide blocking against a solid bulkhead or side panel, but it will probably be best to use horizontal chains running around the bottom of the column, above the base. I can send you some old fire hose to pad the chain -- just tell me how much you want, I have plenty. (Alternately, check with your local Fire Department -- they throw away old hoses as the reach their age limit.)

Once you have the base restrained, you still have a serious amount of weight up high. Many folks use chains down low where their weight is not a problem to deal with and then straps up high. If you buy straps, make certain that they are marked with their WLL or at least keep the package for reference. The laws (both of men and of physics) want the sum of all the staps to add up to the restraint required. This may mean a number of straps, but if you wrap the strap around and take it back to the same anchor point, it counts as two straps -- each portion (or "fall") will be carrying its own share of the load. In most cases this is probably better than taking the same strap to a different anchor point, although it can be argued either way.

You may see some "real" truckers using only top restraint, but they are counting on all the downward force generating serious friction to restrain the bottom. This works only if the rig is VERY stiff -- your truck bed might be in this category if it is very heavy, but I would still recommend some sort of restraint of the base, at least in the forward direction. Most rigs will flex during a big bump and relieve some of the tension at the worst possible time allowing the load to shift.

The above is only the beginning, but I hope it is a good start. Ask questions and I hope others will also contribute.

Archie

P.S: Your chain binders will also need to be rated. Strangely, the anchor points do not have to be rated, but will still need to pass the common sense test. Describe what you have to work with and I can help you decide how to use them. I also recommend a plan on what you are going to say when they ask to see your log book -- see my blog on "Proving you are not engaging in commerce".
 
Last edited:
Chains?

I figured on using 2 chains and binders to the front and 2 more to the rear. I only have one good chain so I have to buy 3 , 3/8 chains and 4 ratchet binders. Dave

Hi Dave,
If you want I can lend you some chains and 3 load binders. Mine are not gold but they are 3/8" chains. I also have a couple of those Home Depot ratchet straps you can use. Let me know and we can meet up mid way in town. Man that's a pretty good haul. I thought I was a big shot hauling a 4000lb lathe home a couple of months ago. But 10.4 K is a pretty good load. Let me know if I can be of any help.
Les
 
I Forgot

I forgot. I also have several choakers. Both wire and fabric. They are great for wraping around the load and binding to them instead of a chain wraped around the machine.
Les
 
Les: Thanks for the offer, but youre not close enough to swing that way driving to memphis and then Id have to get the stuff back to you. I think I will have enough stuff between me and a friend here.

John: Thanks for the info, and Big thanks for your help on the expenses.


Its funny when I talked to JB I found out he works with an old friend of mine that I used to work with here. JB is out of town and when he gets back hes gonna call me with some info and also double check with a crane service to nail down a price so I can make an appointment.

Before the trip im replacing all the brake flex hoses on the truck, I have new ones that I got from summit racing they are earls -4 AN braided stainless brake hoses. 3000psi working press and 12,000 psi burst rating.

Also will be changing the diff lube and 5 speed lube oil and engine oil.
 
JB called me today and told me he found an equip rental place a block or 2 away that I can rent a forklift from and just drive it over to load the mill for $150.

Also got the measurements I needed the height is only 7 ft 8 in so thats good. Also got the bolt spacing on the base of the mill so I can have a pair of beams setup to bolt it to when we pick it up to set on the truck.

I have a pair of 10 foot long 3x4 rectangular tubing steel to bolt under the mill. I had them for a different project thats on hold so decided to use them for this so I dont have to try and track down oak beams or whatever, and dont want to try and use pine for this as I figured it will just snap if there is any kind of tipping load on it.

Bought three 3/8 chains and BIG ratchet binders off CL. Also borrowed 6 chains and binders from a buddy who just sold his semi. I had one good 3/8 chain and will get a binder for that tomorrow so that will give me 10 chains and binders.

So things are coming together, driving up this thursday and back on friday.
 
God's Speed

Good luck on your road trip. I hope it will be an enjoyable one for you. I always love the trip to pick up an old machine tool. It's also fun to see that one person in a thousand in the next car who recognizes what you're hauling and is gawking with his mouth open and that far away look in his eyes while you head for the sunset... But I digress.
Good luck and God's speed.
Les
 
Now you need about a 12" face mill Dave. With the flywheel up there on top the spindle you can drop it in about 3/8" with 10 IPM in steel and she'll just hum while the blue chips bang around the shop.:)

We used to have a much older vertical in the die shop at P&WA for roughing down blocks. Had a big heavy "shower curtain" to pull around the violence and keep the chips sort of in one place.

John Oder
 
OK guys:

Thanks for the nice words Les, Steve and John. Thanks to John Oder, Greg Menke and Steve Kadisak for helping me out on expenses, it paid for more than half of my gas bill !! And the truck got a lot better milage than I could have hoped for.

I am home, the trip was a success. Me , my old workhorse C7000 and the #4 KT are home in one peice. Pics and story in a minute :)
 
Last edited:
JB Bergman is in the yellow shirt, my old friend Jeff in purple who now lives south of memphis came out to help- I hadnt seen him in a long time.
 

Attachments

  • kt1.jpg
    kt1.jpg
    90.7 KB · Views: 359
  • kt2.jpg
    kt2.jpg
    66.9 KB · Views: 357
  • kt3.jpg
    kt3.jpg
    81.8 KB · Views: 334
  • kt4.jpg
    kt4.jpg
    78.4 KB · Views: 347
  • kt5.jpg
    kt5.jpg
    83.2 KB · Views: 367
I left to head to memphis thursday night at 11pm, got to the place the mill was stored at 11am friday. JB and Jeff were there waiting.

The c7000 got 9-9.3 mpg on the trip north. I guess that fresh tune-up worked because that was a couple mpg better than I thought it would get at about 12,000 pounds for the truck, me and gear , chains and binders.

The air conditioner is not working which is why I did most of the driving at night but I guess the last few hours of the drive I got behind on gatorade and fluids and I was dead tired so by the time we got the forklift and bolted the steel to the bottom of the mill and got it loaded I was wiped out and probably close to heat exhaustion.

JB did a great job loading the KT, we had a minor problem for a minute when one of the steel beams got caught by the front tire of the forklift and then when the mill was first set on the back of the truck it was off to the left and the rear of the bed was tilted some and I was worried that it was going to slide right off the side. JB got it centered though and I had him push the mill forward until I got about 1 1/4 inches of drop in the front ride height of the truck, Im guestimating that gave me about 1000 or 1500 lb transfer to the front axle and the remainder of the 10,500 lb mill on the rear axle. The overload springs on the rear didnt even touch the stops :)

JB and Jeff chained the mill down while I sat in JBs truck with the air blowing on me and got cooled down.

Was about 2pm and I followed Jeff 20 minutes to his place took a shower and slept for 6 hours.
 

Attachments

  • kt6.jpg
    kt6.jpg
    64 KB · Views: 238
  • kt7.jpg
    kt7.jpg
    79.8 KB · Views: 281
When I got up friday night after the nap I left Jeffs at 10pm and headed towards houston. The truck got 7 mpg loaded, 22,500lb total. Was definitely slower going, the truck handled great with no swaying or anything just slower getting up the hills.

I think the vacuum secondaries on the 600 holley carb are either not opening at all or not much. I have an edelbrock afb carb that im going to rebuild and try but didnt have time to do it before this trip.

I drove from 10pm til 8am and at Marshall Texas I gave up and got a motel. Slept from 8am-4pm or so then drove the rest of the way home 4-9pm without stopping for gas or anything. So you see that it was 15 hours for the return trip and 12 for the unloaded trip. 1180 miles total. About 147 gal of gas = $370.00 Forklift rental $163. The motel hosed me for $85 but I was too tired to get back in the truck and go comparison shopping.
 
Hey John,

JB gave me a milk crate full of #50 taper tool holders for the 4CH. I havent done an inventory yet to see whats there.

Do you have any pics or links that show any of these big mills during manufacturing at K & T ? It would be amazing to see them setting up and machining the huge base castings.




Now you need about a 12" face mill Dave. With the flywheel up there on top the spindle you can drop it in about 3/8" with 10 IPM in steel and she'll just hum while the blue chips bang around the shop.:)

We used to have a much older vertical in the die shop at P&WA for roughing down blocks. Had a big heavy "shower curtain" to pull around the violence and keep the chips sort of in one place.

John Oder
 
I think the vacuum secondaries on the 600 holley carb are either not opening at all or not much. I have an edelbrock afb carb that im going to rebuild and try but didnt have time to do it before this trip.

Given the mileage and the 4V carb, I'm guessing you have the 366. I wouldn't suggest swapping carbs. The Holley has the built in governor, and it needs it. There are times when driving medium/large trucks you just mash the throttle and depend on the governor doing its job.

Congrats on the mill and the trip. Would you consider doing it again now you know what is involved?
 








 
Back
Top