Help with Tools for Threading, chambering andcrowning

I am a rookie to a Lathe, so please excuse the newbie questions. Recently purchased a 12x37 HF lathe to eventualy thread , chamber and crown some barrels for my Savage Actions. I will be practicing on 1 1/4" ss scrap metal till I learn enough to do a competent job. Can anyone reccomend tools I will need to buy to go along with my new lathe to start practicing threading and turning? Lathe comes with steady rest 3,4 jaw chucks and I ordered a tool holder pack. I have books and videos on the way also, so any help with what to buy to hold reamer and thread bit for Savage would be appreciated.
Thanks for taking time to read,
T.

First off, a grinder if you don't have one! There hundreds of different threading tools, most work. I like HSS, 'cuz I turn slowly and I can sharpen it or shape it as I see fit. If you have trouble grinding a true 60* tool, there are pre-formed HSS bits as well. There are also HSS or carbide inserts available.
For reamers, a tap wrench works but I think the cadillac is the Manson reamer holder. Check out: http://www.mansonreamers.com/New%20Tools.htm
If you didn't already order a copy, John(?) Hinnant has an excellent book on barrelling rifles - check Brownells.com and search for 'Hinnant'.
Have a blast!
GsT

A good indicator, 0-1 mike, and a 60deg center gage.

First I would suggest a mentor, but they can be hard to come by. The grinder is a priority. You can buy pre-ground HSS bits for just about any barrel threading project, but two or three will cost as much as a cheap grinder. You can grind your own for a buck or three.
Better make that a couple of good tenths indicators. It is a good idea to never trust one of anything. If you get a tenths 1" mic, you can make some pretty accurate bore plugs so think about that while looking for a mic. Some shanks will run over 1", so think about adding a 1-2" mic if the price is right. You could get by with a dial caliper, but a half base depth mic would be nice.
Also, if you spot a 55* center gage, you might latch onto it. Never know when an European arm might be found in the shop, and it is frustrating to need some little thing. Of course, you can make one.
Figure out how you are going to chamber, and build what you can, e.g. a spider and indicator holder are easy projects. If you are after accuracy, Dave Kiff is a guy to get to know. He is PTG, and sells a good floating reamer holder for <$100.
A lot of tools will be needed/wanted for future projects, so keep your eyes open and if a good deal comes along, spend what you can. Mike

Thanks everyone for great suggestions, I will start my collection as funds permit. The Lathes are always a nice chunk of change. I do not intend to do this as a trade, just order so many barrels a year thought this might help be money better spent. A machinist friend is going to help set me in the right direction and help me out. What do you reccomend for Crowning? I like 11deg Benchrest crowns, but am open for suggestions. Also, do you buy your reamers or rent them as needed?
Thanks again for the help.
p.s. Lathe is on Backorder.... oh well.

Also--- Can you tell me if this HF Lathe will even do Savage 20tpi barrel threads? It says only 14SAE threads. Please help...
http://www.harborfreight.com/manuals/43000-43999/43681.PDF

[This message has been edited by Todd (edited 01-24-2003).]

I can't imgine that a lathe set up to cut Imperial threads would not cut 20 tpi. Better find out for sure before buying the lathe. You will find the Savage very easy to work with. Run the reamer in until you have proper protrusion of the GO gauge, then install the barrel. No fine adjustment of headspace with the reamer. If you're going to do a number of barrels in one caliber, buy the tooling; for a one-off, I'd rent. People have personal preferences for crowning. I centre the bore, then cut @ 90 degrees using cross feed. The crown is recessed to protect it.

That thread thing mite mean it has a range of 14 SAE, and 10 meteric, or it will cut 14 deferent thread pitches, as Dick says check for sure.

Todd, you can cut just about any crown you like with a standard facing & turning cutter as long as your tool has enough clearance at the tip. Brownells has hand tools that will cut an 11* crown, but they're unnecessary if you have a lathe.

Does anyone know if you can rent reamers with floating pilots and grooved pilot shanks? The ability to fit the reamer to the bore is the primary reason for purchasing. I also lube thru the bore.
Concentricty is more important at the muzzle than the actual degree of crown. You can get good accuracy from several styles as long as the work is concentric. I prefer the 11*, but have put 90* recessed on the guns of those I know are not real kind to their equipment. It seems less susceptible to damage.
I ordered one tool from HF. After 3 months on back order, I told them to keep it. Mike

For threading I use the carbide tipped tool bits offered by J&L industrial (jlindustrial.com) They are preground at 60 degrees and offset to the left so you can get close to the barrel shoulder. They only cost about $5 each. They also have regular turning tools for the same price. No grinding required. They also have carbide boring bars made from solid carbide. I use them everyday. Part number TIA-12206A (3/8" shank) for 60 degree threading tool offset to the left. Other shanks sizes available from 1/4" to 1".

[This message has been edited by AZmachinist (edited 01-26-2003).]

Kennametal Top Notch is the only way to go. Not only can you get 60 degree threading inserts, you can get grooving, acme, buttress,and a host of other insterts all for the same holder. Tool-Flo makes a Top-Notch holder for less than the Kennametal.

Todd; How do you like your HF lathe? I need one to do just about the same thing and have been looking at Grizzly, ENCO and HF lathes. I looked at a 12 x 37 belt driven Grizzly lathe in one shop that looked to have good quality control and the owner, a machinest at a local mill, said the quality and accuracy was as good as the big American and English lathes at his shop. Keep the post coming, I need another newbie's input.

GWP at your service. It can only get better.

I ended up getting the 12x36" Gear Head from the local HF. I'm still learning about the machine, but it turns out some pretty threads. Goodluck w/ the purchase.
T.

Hey GreenWilly,

Check out the Enco 13X40 Model bd110-1353 its on sale for 2495$ i am thinking about geting one for barrel making.

Just my thoughts, but why are you practicing with ss? Most of the stainless steels are more trouble to machine than steel. I would get some leaded steel stock or something easier to thread and machine, so you know when you have the procedure down right. Then go on to the nastier metals. David from Jax

David,

The reason I was using SS was to closely gauge the factors in turning and threading the same material my final project will be made of. I have no problem buying a $30 piece of SS and finding the Lathe RPM that cuts best than working with a softer material then screwing up a $250 416ss Barrel blank. Not sure if this makes any sense , but it seemed like a good idea to me. My barrels are turning out pretty nice now. Finished my 3rd one last weekend. While fire forming 220 russian brass to 22ppc had some nice one holers.

Years ago it dawned on me that if my piloted reamers cut good enough for bullet entry then why not use them for exit. I recess then run reamer in just enough so that thoat is cut. (No pun intended)

Wally

Thanks Wally.I'll have to remember that and try it next time.
Robert.

Todd .. I have a SMithy BZ-239 which by the looks of that manual is a twin of the lathe you bought .. So I have about a years experience on it ..

Things to tell you right off .. IMHO

1. Change the belt .. but a good quality
V-Link belt on it .. Reduced vibration incredibly on mine ..

2. Quick change tool post .. much easier and nicer than the 4 - way ..

3. Skoda Live center .. MT3 in your case I believe ..

4. Way oil .... NOT motor oil on the ways ..

5. Mobil DTE 20 SAE machine oil for the headstock .. NEVER Motor oil .. Most definitely never any oil with detergent ..
( thanks everyone for all that info on oils )

6. There are cap head screws that hold the lead screw and power drive shaft engagement plate on .. ( hard to describe this one ... )
They work themselves loose .. So if you see any extra cpahead screws about and inch and a quarter long .. and don't know where they came from .. give me a buzzz ...

7. When you realign the tailstock if you need to for some reason .. be sure to disengage the tailstock from the ways before trying to adjust it .. Didn't say that in my manual and drove me bonkers ..
It not only locks it down on the ways but also locks the gibs so you can't adjust it..

8. My manual never said there was a drain plug .. but there is on mine behind the motor on the bed side of the gearbox ..
It has an O ring on it ..

9. Be sure to squirt oil into the quick change gear box and the carraige where the "filler" plugs are at least every couple times of use .. more is better than less often .. just more messy LOL

10. A trick I learned on one of the other posts when using the steady rest .. take a shop roll of say 240 grit emery clothe sandpaper .. and rip off a piece and put it
grit side up against the posts and have the clothe side down on the barrel and blast it with lots of oil .. It works so well .. and not even CLOSE to as much galling ... or scratching ..

11. Floating reamer holder ..
Make it or buy it .. I have photos if you want to make one ..

Thats all I can think of for now ..
Feel free to email me ...

Post your photos, love to see them...

Ken