Shaublin 13 on Ebay

Dave A · Mar 30, 2005

Looks to be in good condition.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7503514830&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Milacron · Mar 31, 2005

$2,650 not a bad buy considering the universal table. If the little bugger just had a moving quill and less awkward Y axis* handwheel position, it would be comparable to a Deckel FP1. An FP1 of similar condition with univ. table, similar pix/buyer feedback, etc, would have gone much higher.

*or Z axis to you European guys !

Dave A · Apr 1, 2005

I see you bid on it Don, but someone thought it was worth more.

TNB · Apr 1, 2005

Hi all

Although I'm european, I also consider the "Y" handwheel location to be an oddity on the #13 !

Obviously, we're not alone in this case, and some of us already came up with creative (although not really cute)solutions...

Concerning the lack of moving quill, a #13 will surely be less convenient than an FP1 in the drilling department, but its vertical spindle should also be more rigid and may be even truer (?). The taper roller bearings don't need radial play and will accept some sort of preload, unlike the needle bearings used in the Deckel arrangement. That may even turn into a plus for ultra precise boring operations.

The position of the feed lever seems more of a hassle for me...

Milacron · Apr 1, 2005

Dry, yeah, well I mostly wanted it for the table but couldn't justify more than 2K considering the distance and import hassels. If I was a local I'd have gone beyond 3K on the thing.

T, interesting photo. Besides the creative handwheel, looks like they added some silver paint here and there to create the illusion of a newer model. Or perhaps that was a "transition" model between old design and new ? Speaking of which, do you know if the later 13's with the different shaped vertical head were still no. 30 taper or did they increase taper to no. 40 ?

kvarnis1 · Apr 1, 2005

Don,
As far as I know it is 30 taper on the newer models, look for example at:
http://www.mullermachines.com

/Ola

kvarnis1 · Apr 1, 2005

Don,
Ooops, one of them for sale is 40 taper...
/Ola

TNB · Apr 1, 2005

Don

I've never heard of a Schaublin 13 with #40 spindles.

I wonder if there couldn't be a typo mistake for the one Dry told us about...

I have the real thing in my cave, and it really seems on the small side to me for having #40 spindles.

The question surely calls for further inquiries :cool:

!

Milacron · Apr 1, 2005

T, the newer Deckel FP1's were no. 40 taper, so it certainly could be done...esp with the engineering luxury of no moving quill to consider.

I await the results of your inquires

Stan · Apr 1, 2005

Tien: The Schaublin 13 catalogue shows the option of 40 taper spindles. Not much meat on the spindle with a 40 hole in it. About the one in your pic: it is a combination of older style machine with much newer table. To my knowledge this combination was not sold together (stand to be corrected).

Cheers, Stan.

Milacron · Apr 1, 2005

Tien: The Schaublin 13 catalogue shows the option of 40 taper spindles

But which Schaublin are you actually looking at in your catalog...the original head design (like the one on eBay) or the later head design (see link below) ?

The copy at below link even mentions no. 4MT as spindle, but yet the closeup of the head appears no. 40 to me

:confused:

www.anglo-swiss-tools.co.uk/Schaublin13.html

TNB · Apr 1, 2005

I don't have the catalog you're referring to Stan,but I surely would like to take alook at it.

After examining the pics of Dr Dave Samways's anglo-swis website, I'm still thinking the spindle of the later head design is ISO 30.

I think this becomes obvious if you take a close look at the size of operator's hand and compare it to the protruding part of the toolholder.

Of course, the Schaublin 13 is not so smaller than an FP1, but when you have both, it gives you a feeling of something kind of "tiny" compared to the Deckel. I don't know how to explain it, but that's the way I look at this machine.

In this regard, it seems to me that ISO 40 tooling would be on the bulky side for that small mill.

I wish I would have found a MT4 machine for myself, as it would have been a perfect match with my old FP1...

TNB · Apr 1, 2005

Wait wait wait Don !

This is only a supposition, and I may be wrong.

May be we should send the anglo-swiss pic to one of the Pentagon's photo-analysts. Hum... Let's ask Stan for an evidence of his statement :
It will be easier

!

On a more serious note, the new head design doesn't seem so bigger than the older one to me.
Of course, the lack of moving quill is one thing, but I think that the taper roller bearings arrangement usually found on conventional milling heads (i.e. without quill) takes almost as much space as the quill and needle bearings setup (in fact, I'd say *more* space).

After taking another look at the pic of your link Don, I really don't know...

Milacron · Apr 1, 2005

T, it is funny just how difficult it is to find out Schaublin minutia. I've emailed Schaublin various times about this 'n that and get the impresson there are no "old timers" there that know anything about the pre 1990 machines. And Schaublin is one of the few makes that I have very little original literature on. Dr. Anglo-Swiss seems to know even less than I.

I think I'd feel like I had died and gone to heaven if I could just sit down in some Swiss Cafe' with one of the designers/engineers that was with Schaublin during the 1970's and get the real scoop on things during that era !

Where the heck is Lambert...did a dike break and he was washed out to sea ?? :eek:

BC21OSH · Apr 1, 2005

My possibly 1950's #13 has a #30 taper in the horizontal spindle but the owners manual shows an option of #4 Morse with an adapter to collet type W 20 for both the horizontal and vertical heads.

Bernard

pistonskirt · Apr 2, 2005

Pretty looking thing here.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=64815&item=7505255857&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

Regards

Brian

Stan · Apr 2, 2005

Tien, sorry no "hard evidence" at the moment. I'm in the far north again away from my shop and paper stuff but I do know for a fact that old style circa 1970 and new style 13's were offered with 40 taper as an option for horizontal and vertical spindles. As you might guess this is because I have looked at several machines in the past and have manuals and brochure copies at home (somewhere...). I would have bid (higher than sale price) on the one in Montreal if the sellar had answered two simple questions I emailed him. Oh well, more money to finish fixing up my Deckel LKB

Cheers, Stan.

Milacron · Apr 3, 2005

I just found in my files a brief "full line" brochure, photo and description of the early 1980's Schaublin 13 mill. Standard spindle with the new head was ISO 30. There is mention of optional types available, but no specifics.

Marc · Apr 3, 2005

The pretty little thing is a Schaublin 53, it weighs close to 2000 kg.

I have one complete with manual.

Bought it on Ebay about a year ago and am very happy with it sofar, just a little noisy on high speeds. I would be interested if somebody has run this machine about the normal noise levels that can be expected.

Marc

TNB · Apr 4, 2005

Hi all

One thing that really impressed me when I began the overhaul of my #13 was the care and craftmanship put in each part.

You gotta be pretty dedicated to your work to be willing to make such a cog, just because you think a key isn't the *very best* way to drive a shaft... :eek:

It is probably true, from a purely mechanical point of view, that a key isn't the best system, but it did and does the trick for 99,999% of machine tool builders ! Take a look a that spindle : wow :eek:

!

And as you guessed, the fit is *perfect*. On the other hand, such a work of art also has its downsides : try to go to your local industrial supplies store and ask for such a cog !
"Somthing's strange with the bore... Dunno why, but I can't seem fo find the same diameter twice...

"

For Bernard, here's the boring head I told you about (here shown with a SGIP removable schrank).
The pics don't do justice to that device, wich has more to do with a surgical tool than with a machinist one.

I recognized this boring head on a #13 sale brochure, and it was sold as an accessory by Schaublin. I'll let you do the conversion to imperial but even in metric, 0,005mm is pretty tight a tolerance !

Shaublin 13 on Ebay

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