Question on tramming the head of mill to vise

Randalthor · Dec 27, 2018

I've trammed the head, but had a question on which part of the vise to use as a reference.

I've always heard/read to use the flat part of the vise as the reference for tramming. Here's a pic of what I'm referring to (it's the flat part of the vise with the endmill laying on it that I'm talking about).

My question is that I can wiggle that part of the vise with my hands a little bit, so it made me wonder if that is an accurate reference to tram the head. I used that as the reference after I tightened the vise so it wouldn't move. But would it be better to use the ways of the vise to tram?

fry · Dec 27, 2018

Maybe tram to the table?

I mean, your instinct that you shouldn't orient to the moving jaw is correct, but what the head needs to be perpendicular to is the motion of the table. stuff on top of it introduces more opportunity for error.

Mal01 · Dec 27, 2018

I’m with Fry - tram to the table then the spindle axis will be (or should be if the machine is accurate) at right angles to X and Y and parallel to Z. If a vice isn’t parallel or normal to these axes it needs correcting separately.

Mal
AKA The Felsted Skiver

morsetaper2 · Dec 27, 2018

edit: mal01 beat me to the point in his post above.

Wouldn't you tram to the "bed" (or working surface) of the vise, ie the "vise ways", the surface that would support your work-piece. If you wanted the spindle perpendicular to the work-piece in the vise as close as possible?

myself, I just tram the head to the machine table, and then its close enough for the type of work I might do. Even after I then put the vise on the machine table.

michiganbuck · Dec 27, 2018

often the moving jaw of a vise sprigs up a tad when it is made tight to a part.. so tramming to the vise top is not best. If every job is to be done in the vise then tram to a part held there might be OK. Often a part is secured to the table top so to the table top may be the better place to tram.
With the head tram to the table a shim can quickly set under a vise if needed for a part.

Very often the solid vise jaw is square to the table and the head tram is to the table.
A small shim perhaps 1/4" x .020 x vise width will make the part more square to the vise.
A part just set in the jaws may be tilted a tad because of the moving jaw possible tilt.
Not uncommon to set two small shims under a part to see that both are fixed to tell the part is square to the vise floor.

Larry Dickman · Dec 27, 2018

You want your head trammed to the planes of your X and Y axis. So any surface that will read zero when you indicate it left /right/ back/ forth will be suitable. Your vise ways should do it.

Can'tWeld · Dec 27, 2018

Not to sound like a rookie but I am,I have to do the same thing which you mount your dial indicator in a collet in quill then set couple parallels on the table then rotate the indicator which with half rotation maybe puts the parallels about 8" apart checking the reading on top of the parallels.Then the same thing checking the nod.Again I am new so take this with grain salt

michiganbuck · Dec 27, 2018

Can'tWeld said:
Not to sound like a rookie but I am,I have to do the same thing which you mount your dial indicator in a collet in quill then set couple parallels on the table then rotate the indicator which with half rotation maybe puts the parallels about 8" apart checking the reading on top of the parallels.Then the same thing checking the nod.Again I am new so take this with grain salt

That is good along with knowing how good is your table.. often a mill table top is not perfect so getting to the last tenth is/may be over kill.. Able to check a part should be considered if near zero is needed. It is not uncommon to learn to see the tram error in your milled surface finish...what side of your cutter is leaving the final track.

Randalthor · Dec 27, 2018

Thanks for all the answers. I was doing work in the vise, so I trammed there. The table has some bow in it (if I put a 4' level on it it will rock just a little bit from one end to the other) but it sounds like it's best to tram to table, then shim the vise.

Thanks.

CarbideBob · Dec 27, 2018

I cut parts by moving the table on my machines so I always tram to the way movement not the table top or vise.
Ideally the table top would be zero to the way movement but it never is unless brand new or recently cut.
I also align/shim my vise to the way travels.
Bob

Spruewell · Dec 27, 2018

Yep. Always tram the quill square with a clean table. If the top of your table is not parallel to its movement, you have problems. you will need to either correct that or possibly bolt down a piece of material you can deck and tram to. Unless you pay big money for a top quality vise, I would not trust it to be good enough to tram to. And never (no matter how good the vise is) tram to the moving jaw of the vise. It moves

michiganbuck · Dec 28, 2018

It would not be a bad idea to run your parked tram indicator down long travel and then across cross-way in a few places once in a while and map your table and mark with a sharpie. One might even draw a simple map to have near the machine.. Perhaps flat file the top or/and a Norton smooth side oil-honing...This so to remove bugs.
*Note files and hones should near dead flat, so one needs to never use a Harbor frightful file or a knife sharpening stone on a machine table.
*Yes with honing one can look at his/her map and give the high places more swipes.

Still the job is king so good to have an easy mount to slap on an indicator when needing close numbers.

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Question on tramming the head of mill to vise

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fry

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Mal01

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michiganbuck

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Larry Dickman

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Can'tWeld

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CarbideBob

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