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Most elegant software???

S

snowshooze

Stainless
Joined
Sep 15, 2010
Location
Anchorage, Alaska, USA
Hi Guys!
Ok, I am running Bobcad V28 with all the trimmings, Mill, Lathe and 4th axis.
I am " New " to this.
Bobcad is the only software I have ever tried.
But, problem is I usually run 4 to 8 offsets per part.
So, I like Bobcad. And I can drive it.
But, for every single stinking fixture, I have to re-select, re-compute, go into my offset, call it.
Go into every feature, call the offset..
I might spend 45 minutes drawing a part, and two hours in edits.
I ain't wild about learning a new software, nor paying a stack of thousands for it.
But, I don't think I can afford to burn up all my time playing tiddly winks.
Thoughts?
Thanks!!!
Mark
 
Hey Mark,

Unfortunately Bobcad is one of the few softwares I haven't used....

That being said, I've used quite a few others... (CATIA V5, NX8, Solidworks, Inventor, Fusion 360, to name a few).

I must admit, features are often hidden in odd ways. Goodness knows it's sometimes been months before I find a better way to do something.

As far as personal experience, I use F360 predominantly for my CAM software. It handles the multiple fixture offsets in the "Setup" window. It gives the user the option to duplicate offsets or select multiple setups as different fixture offsets. Once you get past G59 it takes a little thought to ensure it outputs the G#s correctly for your machine. It also gives you the option to order by operation or by tool. Ultimately multiple offsets are created in a manner of minutes.

I would recommend at least giving it a trial run. Depending on your situation, you should be able to somehow get at bare minimum a 30 day trial. I recognize that it is a little bit of tiddly winks while you learn a little. But it might be a useful tool in your arsenal. My understanding is it is on the lesser of the expensive options.

I look forward to seeing what others have to say.
 
snowshooze said:
...problem is I usually run 4 to 8 offsets per part...I ain't wild about learning a new software, nor paying a stack of thousands for it. But, I don't think I can afford to burn up all my time playing tiddly winks.
Click to expand...

Sounds to me you are on the verge of a software epiphany! You say you are spending too much time doing things but are unwilling to pay for a capable software. If you need the software and stay busy with work (have good cash flow) you will be able to justify more expensive software because you'll save time programming and designing, make better and more reliable programs, have more capability and also have more time to accomplish more work. Currently the company I work for employs less than half the people compared to our peak employment but are outputting a much higher volume of work. The software is better, have good machines and use good tooling. It all pays for itself eventually.

As Henry Ford said, if you need a machine and don't buy you will find that in the end you have paid for it but don't have it. Right now you are doing just that. Small shops and one man shops can absorb that kind of mentality (justifying pseudo payments) but that thinking will put medium and large sized companies out of business.

NX 12.0.1
NX 12.0.2
 
snowshooze said:
Hi Guys!
Ok, I am running Bobcad V28 with all the trimmings, Mill, Lathe and 4th axis.
I am " New " to this.
Bobcad is the only software I have ever tried.
But, problem is I usually run 4 to 8 offsets per part.
So, I like Bobcad. And I can drive it.
But, for every single stinking fixture, I have to re-select, re-compute, go into my offset, call it.
Go into every feature, call the offset..
I might spend 45 minutes drawing a part, and two hours in edits.
I ain't wild about learning a new software, nor paying a stack of thousands for it.
But, I don't think I can afford to burn up all my time playing tiddly winks.
Thoughts?
Thanks!!!
Mark
Click to expand...

Bobcad has been around long enough, surely they can do mass edits at once, no?
If you can't select multiple operations to change an offset, buy another software because those "stacks of thousands" you don't want to pay.... you're paying them right now.
 
Not familiar with Bobcad either, but perhaps there are "Defaults" you can modify to get the code to come out more the way you'd like it. Maybe you could talk to a tech guy at Bobcad, and have them develop something for your specific needs/machine. You aren't the first one to fiddle with post-editing...I still do it.
 
SeymourDumore said:
Mark, that above needs some serious explanation!
4 to 8 offsets per part?
Why?
Why any more than One offset per program/setup ?
Click to expand...

Well, I mean I run usually no less than 4 vises, often 2 parts per vise.
So, the program grabs a tool, runs across all 4 or 8 positions, TC, then does it again..
I probably stated this incorrectly.
Mark
 
thermite said:
*yawn* Cheap enough. Code it yerself in STEP-NC. The standard is published.

Works for Airbus/Univ. Bordeaux, Boeing, Eurostep, KTH Royal Institute of Technology, NIST, Sandvik Coromant, Scania, STEP Tools, and Univ. of Vigo.

Who TF are you?

STEP-NC - Wikipedia
Click to expand...

Thanks for the help!

But seriously... I am here in Alaska, I don't know but a couple guys that are even near my level that I can talk to about shop stuff... ans all you guys here have been such an incredible asset to me.

I only went CNC about 5 years ago, now I have several of the dang things. Most I bought broke-down and dirt cheap. Ok, All were breakdowns aside of the new Mazak.
I sorted though schematics, replaced boards, put in parameters... binary... by hand...
My first CNC was the Bridgeport DX-32, and when I finally resurrected it.. I had no idea what to do with it.
All members here helped bring me through it all.
So, I am sincere when I ask a question... it may sound dumb to you...
But I have to start somewhere.
Thanks,
Mark
 
snowshooze said:
Well, I mean I run usually no less than 4 vises, often 2 parts per vise.
So, the program grabs a tool, runs across all 4 or 8 positions, TC, then does it again..
I probably stated this incorrectly.
Mark
Click to expand...


Mark

I that case you may want to talk with Al as to how Bobcad handles multi fixture setups.

One would think that an OK way to do it would be to create the operation for one part and finalize it.
Then simply copy it as many times as needed and edit the fixture offset# for each copy.

Of course, you'd have to make sure Bobcad can order it properly, and also that proper clearance moves are done before and after each fixture offset.
This might need some hand-coding though after Bob is done with it.

Can't help you with your software, but!!!
Since the thread title is " Most Elegant Software", I can tell you FeatureCAM is as elegant as I can possibly think of!

Step1:
In FC you create the program for one part and one part only. Complete program can now be tested on the machine and modified as/where needed.
When happy with the result...
Step 2:
You create a New document in FeatureCAM, but this time it will not be a "part" file, rather a "multi-fixture" file type.
Here, you tell FC how many fixture offsets you have and their names ( G54, G55 eyc ). You don't even need to tell FC where they're located unless you want to backplot it on screen!
Step 3:
You insert the previously completed part file and tell FC that you want Tool dominant or Part dominant ordering.
Tool dominant will run each tool on each fixture before changing to the next tool. Rinse and repeat.
Part dominant will complete each part fully before moving onto the next part.
Of course: You can always override the automatic ordering and change it as you see fit.

Now, the coolest thing: You are not limited to just one file and just one op-list, rather one can insert ANY file and ANY op-list!!!
Meaning: You can set up PartA-Op1 on G54. PartA-Op2 on G55, PartB-Op1 on G56, PartB-Op2 on G57, PartC-Op4 on G110.
All you need to do is insert the individual part program files into the "multi fixture" document, assign each to it's appropriate fixture offset and watch the magic happen!
You DO NOT PROGRAM anything!!! You DO NOT DRAW anything!!! You DO NOT MOVE anything!!! You DO NOT EDIT anything toolpath related!!!
Just insert and go!
If there is some changes that's needed, you open the original part file and edit it. Once, and ONLY once!
Then in the Multi fixture document you just re-insert the now modified file, post it and go as FC took care of ALL the edits on ALL fixture offsets.

How's That for Elegant?
 
Seymour beat me to it. FeatureCAM has the absolute best multiple fixture function. Period.

I used to hate doing multiple fixture stuff in MasterCAM. And, the very short time I played with Bob, it was very similar.
 
SeymourDumore said:
Mark

I that case you may want to talk with Al as to how Bobcad handles multi fixture setups.

One would think that an OK way to do it would be to create the operation for one part and finalize it.
Then simply copy it as many times as needed and edit the fixture offset# for each copy.

Of course, you'd have to make sure Bobcad can order it properly, and also that proper clearance moves are done before and after each fixture offset.
This might need some hand-coding though after Bob is done with it.

Can't help you with your software, but!!!
Since the thread title is " Most Elegant Software", I can tell you FeatureCAM is as elegant as I can possibly think of!

Step1:
In FC you create the program for one part and one part only. Complete program can now be tested on the machine and modified as/where needed.
When happy with the result...
Step 2:
You create a New document in FeatureCAM, but this time it will not be a "part" file, rather a "multi-fixture" file type.
Here, you tell FC how many fixture offsets you have and their names ( G54, G55 eyc ). You don't even need to tell FC where they're located unless you want to backplot it on screen!
Step 3:
You insert the previously completed part file and tell FC that you want Tool dominant or Part dominant ordering.
Tool dominant will run each tool on each fixture before changing to the next tool. Rinse and repeat.
Part dominant will complete each part fully before moving onto the next part.
Of course: You can always override the automatic ordering and change it as you see fit.

Now, the coolest thing: You are not limited to just one file and just one op-list, rather one can insert ANY file and ANY op-list!!!
Meaning: You can set up PartA-Op1 on G54. PartA-Op2 on G55, PartB-Op1 on G56, PartB-Op2 on G57, PartC-Op4 on G110.
All you need to do is insert the individual part program files into the "multi fixture" document, assign each to it's appropriate fixture offset and watch the magic happen!
You DO NOT PROGRAM anything!!! You DO NOT DRAW anything!!! You DO NOT MOVE anything!!! You DO NOT EDIT anything toolpath related!!!
Just insert and go!
If there is some changes that's needed, you open the original part file and edit it. Once, and ONLY once!
Then in the Multi fixture document you just re-insert the now modified file, post it and go as FC took care of ALL the edits on ALL fixture offsets.

How's That for Elegant?
Click to expand...
I understand ever word you speak.
That is mind-blowing.
I have to go take a look.
I have always tried to figure out too, how I can do 8 parts in 4 vises, and then, do 3 or 4 more of part " B " in the edges of the table...
My many thanks!!!
Mark
 
BobCad comes Preditor Editor for the g-code
use the search function to find and replace the offset numbers you want
take a couple minutes
 
SeymourDumore said:
Ya' think ADSK will ever spend the time and energy to port FC-s Multi-fixture into Fusion?
Let alone take the effort to code it from scratch?
Click to expand...

I think they will develop a solution at some point. Just not any time soon. They already pulled a group from I think powerful to help straighten out the turning side. They say they are going to share knowledge across products. Only time will tell.
 
snowshooze said:
Hi Guys!
Ok, I am running Bobcad V28 with all the trimmings, Mill, Lathe and 4th axis.
I am " New " to this.
Bobcad is the only software I have ever tried.
But, problem is I usually run 4 to 8 offsets per part.
So, I like Bobcad. And I can drive it.
But, for every single stinking fixture, I have to re-select, re-compute, go into my offset, call it.
Go into every feature, call the offset..
I might spend 45 minutes drawing a part, and two hours in edits.
I ain't wild about learning a new software, nor paying a stack of thousands for it.
But, I don't think I can afford to burn up all my time playing tiddly winks.
Thoughts?
Thanks!!!
Mark
Click to expand...

Mark why don't you contact Al and ask him for a few pointers on making your edits go faster. Who knows he might even make you a video showing how to optimize the tings you want to do. They make all kinds of help videos and your task is not uncommon.

I have also found that there are many very good Bobcad drivers on this forum and maybe they can show you easier ways of accomplishing your work.
 
SeymourDumore said:
Mark

I that case you may want to talk with Al as to how Bobcad handles multi fixture setups.

One would think that an OK way to do it would be to create the operation for one part and finalize it.
Then simply copy it as many times as needed and edit the fixture offset# for each copy.

Of course, you'd have to make sure Bobcad can order it properly, and also that proper clearance moves are done before and after each fixture offset.
This might need some hand-coding though after Bob is done with it.

Can't help you with your software, but!!!
Since the thread title is " Most Elegant Software", I can tell you FeatureCAM is as elegant as I can possibly think of!

Step1:
In FC you create the program for one part and one part only. Complete program can now be tested on the machine and modified as/where needed.
When happy with the result...
Step 2:
You create a New document in FeatureCAM, but this time it will not be a "part" file, rather a "multi-fixture" file type.
Here, you tell FC how many fixture offsets you have and their names ( G54, G55 eyc ). You don't even need to tell FC where they're located unless you want to backplot it on screen!
Step 3:
You insert the previously completed part file and tell FC that you want Tool dominant or Part dominant ordering.
Tool dominant will run each tool on each fixture before changing to the next tool. Rinse and repeat.
Part dominant will complete each part fully before moving onto the next part.
Of course: You can always override the automatic ordering and change it as you see fit.

Now, the coolest thing: You are not limited to just one file and just one op-list, rather one can insert ANY file and ANY op-list!!!
Meaning: You can set up PartA-Op1 on G54. PartA-Op2 on G55, PartB-Op1 on G56, PartB-Op2 on G57, PartC-Op4 on G110.
All you need to do is insert the individual part program files into the "multi fixture" document, assign each to it's appropriate fixture offset and watch the magic happen!
You DO NOT PROGRAM anything!!! You DO NOT DRAW anything!!! You DO NOT MOVE anything!!! You DO NOT EDIT anything toolpath related!!!
Just insert and go!
If there is some changes that's needed, you open the original part file and edit it. Once, and ONLY once!
Then in the Multi fixture document you just re-insert the now modified file, post it and go as FC took care of ALL the edits on ALL fixture offsets.

How's That for Elegant?
Click to expand...

You mean on a setup like this in NX? ;)


NX 12.0.2
 

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Do not forget to check out Solicam2018, love it. I use Fusion 360 too but thats just a sandbox for now.
 
I use Inventor HSM. I only use G54. If I need to make 4 parts, I create a pattern. It can be prioritized by tool or operation (all of part1 then part2..). If they aren't in exact locations, I manually duplicate the parts/toolpaths and put them where the parts have indicated in.

I used to think of all the cool things I could do with the multiple coordinate systems G54, G55... but it's another thing to mess up, so I just use one and it never changes.

You can get on subscription with some programs so not dropping thousands up front. I'd think F360 is the bargain option currently although it comes with downsides, cloud based.
 
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