Cincinnati Milacron #2 cutter grinder serial number.

I just picked up a Cincinnati cutter grinder and can't figure out
the serial number to determine it's age. The serial number is
1D2T6P-146. It has a tilting head with a Pope spindle that has an
integral motor (no belt drive). The machine does not look like
any of the pictures that I have found on the Web.


Serial number.


Pope spindle.


How old is this machine?

The Cincinnati S/N system has many schemes. Too much to try and regurgitate by typing here.

The "P" before the dash matches the standard numbering scheme, which would indicate 1964.

The machine looks newer possibly? Or just in great shape, or repainted recently. The Cincinnati logo in pic 1 (left, under T-slot table) logo looks about that period, so perhaps 1964 is correct?

5P would in fact be 1964. If in fact it is a 6P, that could possibly be 1984 - but then who knows if they continued that plan or not. As an example, the "P" prior to 1964 was - amazingly - 1944

The thing that makes me think that it is newer is the Pope spindle.
The motor is integral with the spindle shaft. Also, the cranks seem
to be a newer style. It looks like the machine in the machine shown
in the 1971 Service manual and Parts List Catalog that I found on the
web but that machine has a belt drive spindle. The base of the machine
in the catalog looks the same.

The machine base matches the design in the 1969 parts and service manual.

The white Cincinnati #2 in the background is a 1970's machine. Cincinnati installed a emergency off button on the grinding head for this latter design. A few of the mechanical features were changed to make the construction less expensive. The obvious changes are the plastic handles and the degree markings being placed on riveted tags rather than machined into the castings. The base casting was changed to a two piece design and the remaining castings have had some details removed to also keep costs down. The 1970's machine may have been made for Cincinnati.

The green grinding head installation is a custom design. The green paint on the electrical tag is evidence that the modification was done by the last owner and not by Cincinnati.

The disadvantage is that the grinding head no longer has the upper 360 degree swivel in the horizontal plane. No problem. The lower 360 degree swivel is still there. It is also missing the T slot for mounting accessories on the grinding head. The original Cincinnati grinding head is a precision spindle. The Pope spindle would not offer any advantage in accuracy. The green spindle uses a non-standard taper. Ask the auction company where the wheel adapters are. If they were in another auction lot you will need to contact the new owner to retrieve them.
.

Tilt head a later machine .. I think made in Korea. likely late 70s or 80s

but wait that is not the same head as the Korea machine..and 110 volts that is odd?

so I may be wrong .
Table stops are odd also ..so another reason to think it a later machine..

The serial number book has it as a No. 2 PL. cutter and tool grinder mill. Model em, om, ll, do. The 6 is probably a mistake. Like John said, 5P will be 1964. I do remember they turn some of those grinders over to Gleason Co. in N. Y. state later on. I have the correct name somewhere/

I believe that the machine in the back is British made judging from the labels.
I did not check closely enough to be sure. It was a 460 volt machine so was
not of interest to me.

The handles are not plastic. I think that they are stainless.

The head did not look like a custom job. I have a Cincinnati brochure that
shows a fixed head and a tilting head as an option. But it is not the Pope
spindle head.

Your point about the sloppy green paint could indicate a mod.

I don't understand your point about the swivel mount. There is a grab handle
to rotate the head and I assume that there is some clamp that would allow
swiveling. I don't have the machine yet so I cannot check.

There is a T slot across the top of the head. The side of the head is not
painted and milled flat.

I believe that the taper is standard. I got all of the wheels that had arbors
in them. The arbor is the same as for the other grinder in the background.
They are not the same arbors as on my Boyar-Schultz surface grinder.
Some of the spindle adapters are stamped with 67790. One of them is stamped
"Pope". The large diameter of the taper is about .85 inches.

johnoder said:

5P would in fact be 1964. If in fact it is a 6P, that could possibly be 1984 - but then who knows if they continued that plan or not. As an example, the "P" prior to 1964 was - amazingly - 1944

Click to expand...

I was short on time this morning when I wrote post #2. I took the info from a 1974 book. I assumed from the text, the reader of the SN book was to "add" a "5" to the letter digit before the dash and consult the column for year, which I read as 1964 for 5P. And to the OP's SN, the 6 (before the P) was of no consequence. Just the way I took it. No Idea if I was correct or not. Certainly an odd way of denoting yr of make if that is the case.

Now fast forward to this eve, I now have a 1983 SN book in front of me. It states....

"In 1973 the SN system was again changed to the following: The last two digits preceding the dash indicate yr of manufacture and letter code no longer applies. Example: 49U78-000, would indicate 1978 build."

With that info, That is the reason I stated 1964 build date in Post #2. Whether I am right or wrong, I cannot say. But SN on OP's machine does not match this newer SN convention.

Far out. Maybe someone can say why the 6P is there on the serial tag if the system went away with the 5P.

I.E., no date as here

"In 1973 the SN system was again changed to the following: The last two digits preceding the dash indicate yr of manufacture and letter code no longer applies. Example: 49U78-000, would indicate 1978 build."

Click to expand...

morsetaper2 said:

I was short on time this morning when I wrote post #2. I took the info from a 1974 book. I assumed from the text, the reader of the SN book was to "add" a "5" to the letter digit before the dash and consult the column for year, which I read as 1964 for 5P. And to the OP's SN, the 6 (before the P) was of no consequence. Just the way I took it. No Idea if I was correct or not. Certainly an odd way of denoting yr of make if that is the case.

Now fast forward to this eve, I now have a 1983 SN book in front of me. It states....

"In 1973 the SN system was again changed to the following: The last two digits preceding the dash indicate yr of manufacture and letter code no longer applies. Example: 49U78-000, would indicate 1978 build."

With that info, That is the reason I stated 1964 build date in Post #2. Whether I am right or wrong, I cannot say. But SN on OP's machine does not match this newer SN convention.

Click to expand...

Mr_CNC_guy said:

I don't understand your point about the swivel mount. There is a grab handle
to rotate the head and I assume that there is some clamp that would allow
swiveling.

Click to expand...

The Cincinnati #2 has two 360 degree horizontal swivels stacked one atop the other. The lower one sits on top of the column and has one T slot machined in the turn table. Your machine has this swivel. The second horizontal swivel is built into the grinding head base casting. It is installed offset to the column center line. This arrangement provides an extra 3 1/2 inches of working distance to the table depending on how the two swivels are oriented and compensates for the short travel in the table saddle ways. It is useful feature when grinding large shell mills at the zero degree orientation or reamers when the grinding head is turned 90 degrees. This is illustrated on page 9 of the grinder sales brochure.

The grinder table also has a offset pivot point. The table can be spun 180 degrees to bring it 3 1/2 inches closer to the grinding head.

The standard later model #2 with tilt head had cooling louver casted or milled into the side of the tilt style headstock..Think it was late 70s to some time in 80S(?).Something was missing on the later machine, perhaps the long travel quick hand wheel was only on one side...I think I have the operating manual on one of my old computers...The wheel head needs to turn 300* because one need to arc the wheel right and left and to use the right or left rotation head must turn 180. perhaps the screw on the front of the column..it might be stuck because of a close fit and a slug of grease or oil.
Tilt wheel head is handy but with the older machines one would use use arch and setting cutting edge above or below center to make clearance..

The pope tilt wheel head is likely a top quality wheel head but I have never seen one on a #.

Here the louver tilt head #2..you see it still has the better long travel stops. *So I think the ops machine is later than this machine.
1981 cincinnati #2 Tool and cutter grinder grinder - Google Search


Here a view of some #2 models...But not all.
Cincinnati Cutter Grinder Manuals

QT Robert post 11: [The grinder table also has a offset pivot point. The table can be spun 180 degrees to bring it 3 1/2 inches closer to the grinding head.]

Many #2 users don;t know about this feature You have to long travel the table far down one way to miss the column and then swing the table top 180*

The table stops look shop made, not original.

The manual show that the serial number is stamped on the top of the
base at the back. I don't have the machine yet so I cannot check.
That will likely be the definitive serial number. It is possible
that my machine had a major rebuild and a new label applied.
What is the "Cimtrol Division" of Cincinnati? Did they do rebuilds?

Around 1960 Cinci started using that name for valves and circuit boards.

CINCINNATI MILACRON CIMTROL 3 531 2157 CONTROL PC CIRCUIT BOARD USED! (G75 ) | eBay

interesting name plate here..think a 2MT england 1981, good stops, fancy fixture. *Click on name plate.
Cincinnati Milacron 2MT, Tool & Cutter Grinder, 6" X 36" Table, Helical Grinding Accessory, 1981, 15698 Grinders, Tool & Cutter - SurplusRecord.com

Latest cinci#2 around $30K made in Taiwan.( No, I don't like a 1/2 Hp motor on the #1.)
#2 Cutter and Tool Grinders by Cincinnati Machines, Inc

Other Cinci grinders:
Cincinnati Grinders and Grinding Machines

I finally have the machine in hand. I looked at the serial number
stamped in the base. It is on the flat surface on the rear of the machine.
What I read is: 1DAB-5P-70-156. That makes it a 1964 machine.
Is there anything that can be read out of the serial number?

Perhaps it was refurbished by Cincinnati and a new label was applied and
a new serial number assigned? Perhaps it was them that put the Pope
spindle on?

Then here is the manual for free download..nice machine,
Operator's Instruction Book, Cincinnati No. 2 Cutter and Tool Grinder : The Cincinnati Milling Machine Company : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive