Lodge & Shipley Lube question

Christopher* · Sep 15, 2009

Hello all
I am new here, I have been lurking on this forum for awhile and finally registered.

From info found exclusively on this forum I've learned I have a 1937-38 Lodge & Shipley model A "production" lathe 12x54...That needs allot of care.
I will post more about the Machine later as I need more info for Repairs/maintenance.

My question...
I am not sure its name, but the box between the v belt pulley and the headstock, where the clutch lever is at, there is no oil in the sight glass.
What oil goes in there? The machine is under power again and I want to get something in it.

Soon I will need info on the other lubes but this one is most urgent.
Thanks for any help you can give
Chris

johnoder · Sep 15, 2009

Welcome Chris:

Private Message me with your email address and I will send scans of the two page Oiling Diagram for the Model A.

You can do that by clicking on my user name johnoder

L&S says use 20 wt. good mineral oil. This is NOT auto engine oil. In modern terms this means an ISO 46 lube oil such as Exxon Mobil DTE Medium.

Personally, I use DTE Heavy Medium.

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 15, 2009

Will do John.
Your posts have been very helpful. It helped me identify the machine.

Mike C. · Sep 16, 2009

Might also check the local Tractor Supply Co., they have 20wt straight mineral oil in 2 gallon jugs.

Christopher* · Sep 16, 2009

While on the oil subject. I pulled the cover for the quick change drive gears.
there was an oil tube with a pinched end sort of aimed at nothing.
It was near and above an open tube that looks like it goes to a gear. I aimed the drips for the tube. I think it is right I will attached a pic showing where I positioned the tube

What oils the outer most gears?

Mike C. said:
Might also check the local Tractor Supply Co., they have 20wt straight mineral oil in 2 gallon jugs.

I thought they might... However I live next to a lube distributor And picked up some ISO 68 grade hydraulic fluid. ISO 68 was recommended by johnoder.

It is nowhere near as amber as what came out of the friction pulley but who knows what was in there or how old.

I plan to change out the headstock oil. It is very dark through the sight glass.
I want to pick up a manual though in case their are any screen/ filters that may need cleaned.

I'll be posting for other repairs soon. It's well used.

johnoder · Sep 17, 2009

What oils the outer most gears?

The operator

I use way oil on mine.

Oldies will have plain bearings and oil holes.

Those on my Sept 1946 CW16 monarch are on ball bearings and have no oil holes, so I just dribble some lube on the teeth when they are turning.

Chris was sent your Model A lube scans Mike C. - thank you for making them available.

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 17, 2009

I thought there would be oil holes in the cover if that were so
I put 80w90 gearlube on the outers. It was the clingy-est stuff I had at the the moment.
Thanks for everyone's help

Mike C. · Sep 17, 2009

68 is fine, too. Keep in mind the oil specs, back when, were not near what they are now. I was concerned to locate the exact spec lube for the 1943 Pacemaker at work. For my 1918 L&S, I used the TSC mineral oil. It's probably far and above what it came form the factory with, lol.

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

Question about oil pump detector window on backside of headstock cover.
What should I see? I see a tube with a small hole in it and spinning gears.
Should there be oil coming out the small hole in the tube?
I ran it at 298 rpm while watching.
I can see oil splashing and the headstock oil is just a little low in the sight glass.
thanks

johnoder · Sep 18, 2009

oil pump detector

Have yet to find anything on what you are supposed to see in either my old Model A manual or the later one Mike C. scanned.

However, as on my CW16 Monarch it is common for machines with oil pumps to have some means of determining if the oil pump is actually doing something.

On my 36" Ohio shaper and my 2CH K&T mill this is a steady stream in a window.

On my Monarch, it is a steady drip.

No drip can mean pump is doing nothing or simply that something is clogged up.

These machines OFTEN have Bijur metering plugs in the oil system to control HOW MUCH oil is sent to a certain spot. Bijur metering plugs in old machines are very often plugged up.

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

I'm guessing a stream in the window is what I am supposed to see.

I may have to pop the top. I hope the pump is supplementary

My Boye & Emmes with drip oilers is looking so much nicer now. :codger:

dang 1930's high tech

johnoder · Sep 18, 2009

The oil pump is for important things like spindle bearings. Somewhat haphazard splash is for gearing, splined shafting, etc. Older all splash headstocks (I have two) are carefully designed to make sure the splash gets to important parts like spindle bearings. You can see the groove around the perimeter here of this teens design L&S that makes sure this happens.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v337/johnoder/24 X 168 LS/Headstock/DCP_0988sm.jpg

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

I was afraid of that
I hope I can pop the top and see the pump pickup.
All I want to do is run it and not make it worse

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

The spindle bearing caps have a short piece of tube out the top with a felt wick/(filter?) sticking out.
In the top cover, I can feel a recess for oil to pool and there is a hole drilled in the bottom.
It also has a well in the bearing cap like the one in your picture

I lifted it one inch but I am going to need help getting it off. SO I wonder what the pump is for? Input shaft bearings maybe/ where power comes in (using transmission terminology)

johnoder · Sep 18, 2009

There were definitely plain spindle bearing (not having Timken roller bearings) Model As in the time period you mention in your topic starting post. Maybe you have one. It will be interesting to see what the oil pump does.

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

#30827 with flashlight verification oil is pumped into trough in h/s cover

johnoder · Sep 18, 2009

30827 was early 1938 per this list:

http://www.machinetoolclearinghouse.com/lodgelat.htm

Neat things happened the year before. The Double Nose spindle nose was phased out late '36 and by January 1937 the L1 had replaced it.

Easy to tell if you have one or the other. A Double Nose will have a smooth 6 3/4" OD spindle flange behind the chuck. An L1 will have a notched 7 1/2" OD draw back nut behind the chuck.

You may even have the early draw back nut with closed oval ended notches. All later standardized draw back nuts had open ended notches.

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

You know your stuff
I guess I'll be careful reversing the motor... used a 2x4 clamped in chuck and momentum for a spanner

johnoder · Sep 18, 2009

They were proud of them - in production from early mid teens to clearly some part of '37 since your early 1938 machine thought it was just fine to have one.

Here is a scan from mid twenties.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v337/johnoder/24 X 168 LS/Spindle/LS05.jpg

John Oder

Christopher* · Sep 18, 2009

It is easy to take on and off.
As far as accurate centering of the chuck... the cushman 3 jaw has .025 clearance on the nose.
the 4 jaw has .007 wish it were the othe way around
I do not have a faceplate.
Chris

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