A2-6 "Spacer" ???
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  1. #1
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    Default A2-6 "Spacer" ???

    Does anyone know of a "spacer" readily available on the market to extend an A2-6 nose out a few inches?

    Point being to get out past the probe on this machine to put a bigger scroll chuck on.

    (No - it's not mine)






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    Ox

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    Ox,
    Hardinge has a A2-6 to A2-6 spindle nose collet adaption chuck part number 97Z00-00-90-0310M at 8" length and part number 97Z00-00-90-6695K at 8.65" length. I don't handle pricing or delivery but you can most likely find that at ShopHardinge
    These are actually 20C collet adaption chucks that mount on the A2-6" spindle nose and have the 20C collet seat and the A2-6 nose on the business end of it to mount chucks and step chuck closers.

    Tom

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    Would not be hard to just make one, don't think your going to get that off the shelf. Alternatively - especially as it won't be usable any more, why not just take the probe off?

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    Thanks Tom, but I'm pretty sure that will consume too much of the available daylight. You don't have a shorter one like that?
    I have an (Hardinge of course) A2-6 to S-20 closer that is about 3" long, but it doesn't have the secondary mount on it, but then mine's 20 yrs old, maybe the new ones doo have it now?

    That's very interesting tho.

    Actually .. I guess I hafta ask - what was the reason for adding the male end of the mount to the end of the closer?
    Maybe for a dead length cap?

    BTW - I'm not getting those parts #'s to pull up.



    Adam - It's just for one particular job for a cpl days now and aggin.


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    Ox

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    IT was so you could add step chucks and there closers to it while maintaining the 20c capability without removing it from the spindle

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    If thats the case, any chance of using a chuck with a diffrent mount? A simple thick face plate would not be at hard to make if you could have something more like a adjust true style back plate on the front end. Adjust true style back plates are out there for the A2-6 spindle nose, there thicker by a good 1/2" on the register boss height in the 8"+ chuck size, not sure if you could jump up a couple of chuck sizes on the back plate, then machine the thin flange off and re-machine on a std register? Would get you a easy 1" more out, more than thats going to be from scratch, but it might get you the needed inch and could be turned on the machine in question.

    Other far easier option longer term might be to simply make up a back plate for the chuck that bolts to the front of that existing chuck with the jaws off, not sure what mountings you have there but may be simpler? Sure a man of your skills could cludge it up and it would be way faster than messing with all the draw tube and such? Maybe losing too much again though?

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    A bison semi finished 10" backplate in A2-6 is 2" thick? You would have to do some finish machining, but kept shallow on the register it would get you a good 1 3/4"????

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    Not to be a wet blanket but a heavier chuck plus increased overhang would almost surely void the warranty (if it matters). Haas headstocks and spindles are already about one size smaller than they oughta be for a given machine size. And a scroll chuck won't maintain grip pressure at CNC speeds that a hydraulic chuck will.

    That being said, I've certainly modified my share of machines to operate beyond their capacity...but that was before I was responsible for employees' safety. Something to think about, anyway.

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    I've admittedly not read through everything yet, but have to wonder right out of the gate ( having done exactly what you seek ) if you won't be better off just buying extended soft jaws and machining for the job, while leaving them longer. I made a A2-6 spacer for a fixture on the 4th axis once. Don't know that I'd really want that spinning up on a turning center. Especially with a larger chuck. Even with the one I made, turned out that I was better served to buy 3" tall soft jaws and set the part out using those like spacers. Have done the same in the turning center. Just two pfennig of alternative thought. Good luck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahnrad Kopf View Post
    I've admittedly not read through everything yet, but have to wonder right out of the gate ( having done exactly what you seek ) if you won't be better off just buying extended soft jaws and machining for the job, while leaving them longer. I made a A2-6 spacer for a fixture on the 4th axis once. Don't know that I'd really want that spinning up on a turning center. Especially with a larger chuck. Even with the one I made, turned out that I was better served to buy 3" tall soft jaws and set the part out using those like spacers. Have done the same in the turning center. Just two pfennig of alternative thought. Good luck.
    Building on that made me think of what Peter Stanton did on his big integrex to mount a scroll chuck a number of inches away from the big chuck. He machined a swept (inverted) dovetail to mount that quite aways away using softjaws also machined with dovetail in soft jaws. What's weird or counter intuitive to me is what surfaces actually make contact when clamped full pressure. Seems to work*.

    A Chuck Adapter for the Mazak - YouTube

    ^^^ Early "Edge precision " video (his video skills much better these days).


    Not sure if he had to do that to clear steady rest mechanics / easier reach for tail stock/ for smaller work pieces ?

    __________________________________________________ _______________________________


    * I have no idea hwat that would do to a HAAS lathe, definitely not "HAAS Tip of the day " lol.

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    I came up with the idea of the adjust true this afternoon too.

    MY chuck is a direct A2-6 mount, but this customer is pulling this in-house and I delivered most all of my tooling to them last night, and I am trying to help get it going as much as I can. But once I remembered that they don't already have a chuck with an A6 mount on it, the adjust-true came right to mind.

    I called Kalamazoo and they just sold their last 12" and would be a while before they had their stock filled again, so then it was on to Buck, and that's the links that I sent this afternoon.

    Yes - Shirley I can build the spacer, but not sure if they can or not? Maybe....

    But as you say, maybe they can git away with just some really tall jaws, but they would need to be about 5" tall as my jaws are 3" as is. The first cpl of inches of the part - there isn't anything to grab on, so .... Besides, I liked the scroll for the feel as if I clamped it down too hard, I would deform it, and then the bore would be out-of-round when unchucked.

    Also - the part is prox 4" D with features beyond that under one jaw, so I don't know if a person can expect to git a serrated jaw to get there (5" out) or not? I don't have much experience with serrated jaws, and so far dis-like them. Also - IDK if a person can find 5" tall soft jaws for an 8" serrated chuck in the first place? And making a few serrated jaws yourself would seem to be as much hassle as making the spacer, so IDK what they will doo.

    I think this is only prox a 600 RPM job.


    Also - they would need roughly 3" of dead air space to git past that probe. An extra .5 or inch aint gunna git there....


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    don't know how much of a pain it would be on Haas, but what about removing the arm? Took mine out last week to send back to Renishaw for repair. 3 bolts and unscrewed the electrical plug. Then jumped 24v into the plc to show arm up and sealed up the opening and
    back in business.

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    I'm sure that the offset will need adjusted when you put it back on tho.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    I'm sure that the offset will need adjusted when you put it back on tho.


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    Oh most definite, Again I don't know the Hass procedure but mine is just a
    calibration tool in the turret, jog it to the probe and run the calibration cycle.

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    Years ago I ran some delicate, low RPM parts by boring out soft jaws on the hydraulic chuck and chucking a smaller scroll chuck from the engine lathe. Too dangerous nowadays?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pcasanova View Post
    don't know how much of a pain it would be on Haas, but what about removing the arm? Took mine out last week to send back to Renishaw for repair. 3 bolts and unscrewed the electrical plug. Then jumped 24v into the plc to show arm up and sealed up the opening and
    back in business.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    I'm sure that the offset will need adjusted when you put it back on tho.
    How about pulling it off altogether and replacing it with a HPRA removable arm?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Booze Daily View Post
    Years ago I ran some delicate, low RPM parts by boring out soft jaws on the hydraulic chuck and chucking a smaller scroll chuck from the engine lathe. Too dangerous nowadays?
    Don't go there, some of us do it, some have killed multiple poor innocent kittens trying! There has been entire threads on a chuck in a chuck in the past.

    Personally i would not rate it any more dangerous than it use to be, just that the average idiot has improved in the last few years and it doubles there chances of stuffing things up and adds loads of new ways too fuck up, especially if your idea of setting up and programming a machine is you calculate cutting speeds purely based on dia and not on how hard you want to chuck the part into the side of your head! But ignore me im just a hack running slower than 900sfm because i don't want to play catch with a oddly shaped block of steel spinning that hard!


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