I have an older Sharp SV-2412 with a Fanuc Oi-Mate MB. Stout little machine. On the pendant/panel/display it is set up for a fourth axis (A axis) but I don't believe it has the boards(s) in the back for this option. How hard would it be to retrofit this machine by finding the proper boards and wiring it up? Or is it really difficult and not worth my time and I'm better off buying a 4th with its own control box. Though I would *much* rather have true 4th axis rather than just a positioner.
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adding a true fourth to a SV-2412
- Thread starter sigmatero
- Start date
- Replies 39
- Views 6,147
Rick Finsta
Stainless
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2017
When I was looking into this, everything I found indicated that the 0i-Mate MB can ONLY index on a 4th axis.
GENERALDISARRAY
Hot Rolled
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2019
do you have the 3axis amp and spindle motor combo? This is from a D connection manual
I'm in the same boat with my SV-2412 with Oi Mate MC control. The extra drive is super easy to find online for about 350-400 bucks used. I think the problem is that it is supposed to connect to the combo drive for power and control, but the Combo PSU/Drive unit (big yellow box in your cabinet) for the Mate control doesn't have the extra fiber optic port to hook it up. See this hardinge video where they install a 4th to a bridgeport VMC. This is for a machine with the non-mate control and was pre-wired for a 4th. Supposedly there's a way to still get a true 4th because I've seen people online talking about their 4th on a Mate control. I reached out to hardinge to pick their brain (and maybe buy a 4th if they can show me the way)
This is what the combo unit looks like:
There needs to be two fiber optic connections on the unit (the lone connection is circled in red in the picture) in order to support an installation like the one in the video. We'll see what they say to get around it (hopefully not a standalone control box)
This is what the combo unit looks like:
There needs to be two fiber optic connections on the unit (the lone connection is circled in red in the picture) in order to support an installation like the one in the video. We'll see what they say to get around it (hopefully not a standalone control box)
Vancbiker
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2014
- Location
- Vancouver, WA. USA
Mate series will only do 3 true axes. A 4th on a mate can only be an indexer.
Here is a text clip from the 0iB connections manual......
B–63833EN/037. SERVO INTERFACE
This chapter describes how to connect the servo units to the Series 0i/0i
Mate. For details of the connection of the Servo amplifier, refer to the
7.1.1
General
each servo amplifier manual.
7.1.2
Interface to the Servo
Control unit
Servo amplifier modules
Optical fiber cable
Series 0iMate–TB: Maximum 2 axes
Series 0iMate–MB: Maximum 3 axes
Series 0i–TB/MB: Maximum 4 axes
Cable Length Restriction
Within 100 m between units
Total length within 500 m
The connection between the CNC control unit and the servo amplifiers
should use only one optical fiber cable, regardless of the number of
controlled axes. See APPENDIX D for details on the optical fiber cable.
In the control unit, the COP10A connector is placed on the servo card
installed on the main board.
Here is a text clip from the 0iB connections manual......
B–63833EN/037. SERVO INTERFACE
This chapter describes how to connect the servo units to the Series 0i/0i
Mate. For details of the connection of the Servo amplifier, refer to the
7.1.1
General
each servo amplifier manual.
7.1.2
Interface to the Servo
Control unit
Servo amplifier modules
Optical fiber cable
Series 0iMate–TB: Maximum 2 axes
Series 0iMate–MB: Maximum 3 axes
Series 0i–TB/MB: Maximum 4 axes
Cable Length Restriction
Within 100 m between units
Total length within 500 m
The connection between the CNC control unit and the servo amplifiers
should use only one optical fiber cable, regardless of the number of
controlled axes. See APPENDIX D for details on the optical fiber cable.
In the control unit, the COP10A connector is placed on the servo card
installed on the main board.
If I were to run a indexer on my Mate control, is that going to be through the serial port with an M code to a standalone indexer with it's own power supply and control box? Is there any way I can run a fanuc drive and hard wire to the control's I/O instead of the serial port?
Vancbiker
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2014
- Location
- Vancouver, WA. USA
For an end user the serial port and M code interface to a stand-alone indexer control is the most feasible solution.
It would be possible to spec a Mate control with a PMC with enough capacity to support the complex ladder logic and instructions required for a PMC axis driven indexer. The logic required is very similar to that written for machines equipped with servo driven tool magazines.
It's a pretty huge job though. I've never seen an end user do it. Despite having some knowledge of Fanuc ladder programming as well as ladder programming for Yasnac, Mitsubishi, and AB controls, I'd be a bit overwhelmed if faced with the task.
It would be possible to spec a Mate control with a PMC with enough capacity to support the complex ladder logic and instructions required for a PMC axis driven indexer. The logic required is very similar to that written for machines equipped with servo driven tool magazines.
It's a pretty huge job though. I've never seen an end user do it. Despite having some knowledge of Fanuc ladder programming as well as ladder programming for Yasnac, Mitsubishi, and AB controls, I'd be a bit overwhelmed if faced with the task.
Nice, I would send an email to Hardinge and ask them if they could run their rotary off a Mate control. Sharp might have spec'ed the 3220 to be true 4th capable (Sharp would be the other people you need to ask about it). Please update us if they give you any info specific to the Mate control.
Thanks for the insight on this. I'm definitely interested in either building or buying an indexer that can take the spare M code from the serial port.
Maybe one of these used rotaries on ebay USED NIKKEN ROTARY TABLE 320 DC w/ NIKKEN 8000DC CONTROLLER | eBay
Any suggestions in that regard?
Vancbiker
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2014
- Location
- Vancouver, WA. USA
Nikken make a good product IME. A quick google shows Nikken stopped supporting that controller about 15 years ago. That probably means the units are 25 years old or more. Did not see anything saying that control could accept RS-232 commands.
angelw
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2010
- Location
- Victoria Australia
Hello Max,
The following picture is of a part machined on a client's Mori with Yasnac MX3, three axes machining centre that I set up with a Forth Axis controlled by a Galil Servo Controller. It was far from a true 4th axis, but it could do simple tasks such as the Helical Cam shown the pictured part and of course, indexing. The system achieved being able to what seemed to be true interpolation between the X and A axis via a feature of the Servo Card called Electronic Gearing. This works by having a Master and Slave encoder; the Slave keeping pace via the Gear Ratio specified.
In the case of this application, the X Axis of the Machine was the Master and the A Axis the Slave. The Encoder Count of the True X axis encoder of the machine could have been captured, but we opted to install a Stand Alone encoder at the opposite end of the X Axis Lead Screw as the Master. The MX3 didn't have User Macro, which could have been used to control Indexing and other features of the 4th Axis via DPRNT, so a unique X axis coordinate was used to signal certain tasks to be carried out by the 4th Axis.
Regards,
Bill
Vancbiker
Diamond
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2014
- Location
- Vancouver, WA. USA
Hey Bill, That's a pretty slick integration! Did you program the Galil with WSDK to set the Master positions for Slave operation start/stop or make/use some other program?
The Galil stuff has some pretty interesting abilities, but it was not very robust IME. I got a little "gun-shy" of using it after a Galil controlled laser welder stitched a line of burns across my thumb while doing some service on it.
The Galil stuff has some pretty interesting abilities, but it was not very robust IME. I got a little "gun-shy" of using it after a Galil controlled laser welder stitched a line of burns across my thumb while doing some service on it.
Wow that's awesome! Almost like a horizontal "rigid tapping" cycle between X and A axis!
I also saw an index designs rotary with control box for about 10k on eBay too (floor model sold by manufacturer directly)
I know I should be prepared to spend that much on a proper rotary, but I'm inclined to think if I'm patient I can find a good deal on something.
If I opted to build my own, is there a standalone controller that I should try to stick with or is pretty much anything that interfaces with rs232 going to work?
Thinking I could use a Galil single axis control box with a stepper motor and build a custom rotary:
DMC-3x01x | Galil
Drawing inspiration from RCaffin on "see n see zone" forums
DMC-3x01x | Galil
Drawing inspiration from RCaffin on "see n see zone" forums
angelw
Diamond
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2010
- Location
- Victoria Australia
Hello Kevin,
It comes with its own programming language, which is pseudo BASIC. It can also be programed using VB if you want to have a Visual Interface for programming purposes.
This installation was some years ago and has proved to be reliable. However, I do agree with your comment regarding the general robustness, but it seems that aspect has been improved over time.
Regards,
Bill
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