Advice on Starting CNC Support Business

jlogeajr · Apr 12, 2021

Hello to All,

I am a capital project manager at a larger US manufacturer but have recently branched out into my own business. My only problem is outreach and I figured this was the best place to get advice.
My business, SaveMyMachine LLC, reverse engineers components of obsoleted CNC machines for which the spares market supply has been exhausted.
Rather than being forced to buy an expensive new machine, customers can provide my team drawings, prints, and/or the broken part, and from there we get them back running again.

My thoughts are my customers are likely smaller machine shop owners and maintenance managers from larger companies, but I am stuck on how to get in touch with these demographics.
I built a website SaveMyMachine but am unsure of how to get the word out, so to speak.

Does anyone have any recommendations? This is my first independent business but I feel like I can fill a need and help some people avoid seriously expensive unplanned capital purchases.

Best Regards,
OJ

eaglemike · Apr 12, 2021

My advice would be to develop a solid functional Control upgrade/replacement kit for Haas VMC's built from the 1990's through about 2007. Haas is no longer supporting the main board. Their upgrade path is about $20K, maybe a bit more. I think if you had a plug and play setup, no glitches, easy to tupport, for a fair price, you would have solid business.
There are people out there that have used Centroid controls, and I think perhaps Mach3/4?, but I don't know how solid they are. Perhaps if you used a Fagor, Siemans, and had support for them, that might work.
There's also a LOT of of Bridgeport and YCM machines with Bandit or Anilam controls. Same thing. Price of course would be an issue. I started with an YCM knee mill with Anilam control, and did very well with it, for close to 20 years. Anilam was purchased and support for parts (and to some degree tech) pretty much went away. There's still times I wish I had that one working for some work. The Anilam G control would run pretty much Fanuc code, and had some pretty cool canned cycles (pocketing, spiral, etc) built in.
Older Hardinge lathes supposedly have great iron, but the controls are often dead or lost parameters. Another market.
Even if you are just reliable and service Fanuc, you will get all the work you can handle. Here in SoCal it's hard to find reliable support.
Just one viewpoint.
Good luck!

Bobw · Apr 12, 2021

Oh, and I bought a package of M&Ms at Menards

Haas wouldn't allow that. Before you finished you typing HAAS
on your website you would probably have 10 lawyers
knocking on your backdoor.

Garwood · Apr 12, 2021

Only way I see it working is if you market your services to independent repair techs, not machine shops.

mhajicek · Apr 12, 2021

If a machine shop knows what needs to me made, they can make it. You going to sell ice to Eskimos next?

EmGo · Apr 12, 2021

Bobw said:
Haas wouldn't allow that. Before you finished you typing HAAS
on your website you would probably have 10 lawyers
knocking on your backdoor.

Maybe, but they'd be shooting blanks. As I understand it, Haas is on record as saying they can't get the necessary chips to support the old controls and are therefore not selling parts.

In court, you have to prove damages to get a judgement. After you've said you have no intention of selling something, it's hard to say you were damaged by someone else selling that item.

Of course even winning can be expensive ... fricking court system sucks. But that's another subject. He could just make the product then make sure the company selling the product had no assets. Sue me, baby. See what you get.

drcoelho · Apr 13, 2021

Why not approach Haas directly? If you are willing to re-engineer a solution for older machines at your expense, they might end up being one of your customers.

Bobw · Apr 13, 2021

drcoelho said:
Why not approach Haas directly? If you are willing to re-engineer a solution for older machines at your expense, they might end up being one of your customers.

But that would kill their market for $20k control upgrades.

jlogeajr · Apr 13, 2021

mhajicek said:
If a machine shop knows what needs to me made, they can make it. You going to sell ice to Eskimos next?

That's kind of the basis for the business. The reason manual lathes and mills last so long is you can make a cam or wormgear. Where you run into trouble is when electrical components go out. If you know a machine shop that can make a prox switch or an encoder, let me know, I want to meet them....

gkoenig · Apr 13, 2021

Bobw said:
But that would kill their market for $20k control upgrades.

I think the $20k price tag kills their market for $20k control upgrades.

Honestly, has anyone actually taken them up on that offer for a 2007 vintage machine? There is a sucker born every minute, but I really can't see many people finding the ROI on that prospect very compelling.

ripperj · Apr 13, 2021

mhajicek said:
If a machine shop knows what needs to me made, they can make it. You going to sell ice to Eskimos next?

I know a lot of skilled machinist that couldn’t design and install a whole control retrofit. It’s a totally different skill set

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

jlogeajr · Apr 13, 2021

Thank you for the constructive feedback!

jlogeajr · Apr 13, 2021

What would be the best way, in your opinion, to get in touch with that particular subset of people?

Bobw · Apr 13, 2021

gkoenig said:
I think the $20k price tag kills their market for $20k control upgrades.

Honestly, has anyone actually taken them up on that offer for a 2007 vintage machine? There is a sucker born every minute, but I really can't see many people finding the ROI on that prospect very compelling.

"Gee Mister, that new transmission is going to be awfully expensive, why don't we just
get into a nice new car".

Speedie · Apr 13, 2021

Its an ambitious undertaking. I would think most shops with an old haas that wont spend 20k on a control update really are not that successful and would probably balk at 500.00 for a repaired control. So how much reverse engineering can one do before you have to charge the customer time and materials. I am all for you winning! But reality will set in quick when you have a piece to replace that was never really that good to start with and a customer is hounding you because it broke a 2nd time...all while you went negative on the job

cnctoolcat · Apr 13, 2021

Mechanical parts for older CNC’s are not the problem; it is electrical parts!

Control retrofits are a specialized task that most shops will not undertake.

However, shops of all sizes are constantly having electrical parts rebuilt, repaired, or replaced.

Turn-key spindle and servo drive retrofits for Mazaks would be a huge seller. (Mitsubishi sells upgrade kits, but the prices are astronomical).

Most machine shops have no clue as to how to diagnose and repair the very CNC’s they run to make their living. I’ve always found it astounding how highly-skilled machinists and engineers just turn into blank stares when a machine hiccups.

ToolCat

mhajicek · Apr 13, 2021

ripperj said:
I know a lot of skilled machinist that couldn’t design and install a whole control retrofit. It’s a totally different skill set

OP never mentioned electronics. Sure sounded like he's talking about mechanical components. He mentioned drawings, prints, or broken parts, not schematics or boards.

Stirling · Apr 13, 2021

Choose some machines. Haas, Mazak, the ones with high populations.
Do the reverse engineering upfront. Mechanical or electrical, verify no patent violations.
Pay practical machinist for add space.

I think electrical would sell well.
Haas mechanical parts maybe, but they are not too overpriced from factory. Controls, vfd’s vector drives....
pick something make it and adds on practical machinist is a good start. After paying for add space, troll the forms here and when you can help, point to your professional service.
One thing I’ve noticed here is if you offer services and don’t pay for add space you may get a bad reputation with everyobe

nopoint · Apr 13, 2021

Electrical/controls repair troubleshooting has huge potential. Not making machined parts to fix a machine. Unless you are mass producing a part that solves a common problem. Your website needs to vet your experience and skills. Similar model different industry Americas Energy ServicesOur Team - Americas Energy Services
Your current site really does nothing to sell your experience. You have talent on board you have to sell it!

memoryman · Apr 13, 2021

Send me an email so I can communicate privately: [email protected]
Bill

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