I know these are quite different machines. But I am gonna think out loud... help me out here guys, I need to make a decision before the end of the weekend if not by tomorrow.
I design and manufacture 100% my own parts and always will. I don't think I will ever be cutting inconel and I can count on one hand the number of times I've cut stainless. I cut 75% acrylic and 25% 6061 aluminum, most of my parts are the size of pack of cigarettes or smaller. But I never know what I'll be making next... I made a product out of titanium a few years back, and had one 10" diameter x 6" high 7075 aluminum part I designed that wasn't a hit in the marketplace but could have been.
I don't need the speed of the Brother machine.. sometimes my existing VMC sits idle for several days. But sometimes orders come in and I have stacks of parts lined up and I wish it was faster - it has a 6k spindle and I drip feed it. I do a ton of profiling and I can't feed it data fast enough and it can't process fast enough.
I like the Brother because it's fast and would tear through my work. I like that it's so reliable and it's cheap to fix - I have a few employees and a $30k repair bill would be a huge blow. I like the support from Yamazen.
My concerns about the Brother are it's surfacing capabilities... I read a lot of people dicking with the Mode B stuff and can't get it dialed in. On the other hand, it will be LIGHT years ahead of my 1998 Leadwell with a Mitsubishi 50M control. I kinda worry about the power... I have a much more powerful machine now, but I also do work for a shop with tons of Robodrills, so I program "light and fast" cuts all day and know how to roll that way too. I worry about losing the big table I have now where I have a tooling plate with pins to mount vises and fixtures and whatever I want. And I worry about not being able to do 5-axis in the future if I ever get there (but I think if I ever get there I'd buy a dedicated machine).
On the Okuma, it's a beast. I have an Okuma lathe now and I love it. I think the Okuma is more precise than the Brother and everyone I know with one loves it. I think it has better surfacing capability and HiCut is easier to use/tweak than ModeB. I like the tool capacity (I have 20 tools now and I'm using them all, though I rarely have to change tools out but more would be nice). I like the power - it's nice to be able to hog with a 1" rougher if I want to (like on that 10" dia part I did). It's nice to have a catch-all machine that could do anything I ask of it.
But I worry about the quirks of the machine, I've heard chip flow isn't great, it requires expensive grease monthly and the door seals fail. I think it will be less reliable than the Brother. And I know Okuma charges out the ass for parts. The machine is probably a fair bit more than the Speedio up front too. It can do 5-axis, but it's so expensive that I could buy a nice used Brother 5-axis for the upgrade cost on the Okuma, so I doubt I'd ever do 5-axis on it.
I got a quote for the Speedio S1000x1 last year... just got a quote on the S700x1 this week and it's more than the 1000 was last year . The Speedio 700 is over $100k now. They are discounting it, but still - with almost no options, it's over $90k to my floor. The Okuma salesman is coming here in a few minutes to talk turkey, but although I've read numerous stories of people getting an M560-V for $95-99k, they don't seem to want to get close to that - we shall see.
I also found a Speedio S1000x1 an hour away from me with only a few hundred hours on it that's never had coolant in it and the guy wants $85k. Not sure what I could get it for... I was quoted $89k for the same machine last year, so I think his price is high... maybe $75k is more reasonable? I also found a 6-month old M560-V with 130 hours on it but they want $135k... it has a 4th axis, Rengage probe/tool probe and extended Z. Not sure what it can be bought for.
Got approved for financing today... need to make a decision in the next few days.
Like I said, I know the Speedio and M560 are very different machines, and I don't NEED the capabilities of either, and either would do what I need. But... I don't see why I would buy a Haas, Doosan, Robodrill or anything else when these machines are leaders in their classes - my thoughts anyway.
Curious what others would say. Also curious what others think of pricing. Especially curious what anyone can suggest as far as recent prices paid for a Speedio S1000x1, S700x1, Okuma M560-V or Okuma M460-VE. Or does anyone agree with my thoughts above or disagree with my pro's/con's?
I design and manufacture 100% my own parts and always will. I don't think I will ever be cutting inconel and I can count on one hand the number of times I've cut stainless. I cut 75% acrylic and 25% 6061 aluminum, most of my parts are the size of pack of cigarettes or smaller. But I never know what I'll be making next... I made a product out of titanium a few years back, and had one 10" diameter x 6" high 7075 aluminum part I designed that wasn't a hit in the marketplace but could have been.
I don't need the speed of the Brother machine.. sometimes my existing VMC sits idle for several days. But sometimes orders come in and I have stacks of parts lined up and I wish it was faster - it has a 6k spindle and I drip feed it. I do a ton of profiling and I can't feed it data fast enough and it can't process fast enough.
I like the Brother because it's fast and would tear through my work. I like that it's so reliable and it's cheap to fix - I have a few employees and a $30k repair bill would be a huge blow. I like the support from Yamazen.
My concerns about the Brother are it's surfacing capabilities... I read a lot of people dicking with the Mode B stuff and can't get it dialed in. On the other hand, it will be LIGHT years ahead of my 1998 Leadwell with a Mitsubishi 50M control. I kinda worry about the power... I have a much more powerful machine now, but I also do work for a shop with tons of Robodrills, so I program "light and fast" cuts all day and know how to roll that way too. I worry about losing the big table I have now where I have a tooling plate with pins to mount vises and fixtures and whatever I want. And I worry about not being able to do 5-axis in the future if I ever get there (but I think if I ever get there I'd buy a dedicated machine).
On the Okuma, it's a beast. I have an Okuma lathe now and I love it. I think the Okuma is more precise than the Brother and everyone I know with one loves it. I think it has better surfacing capability and HiCut is easier to use/tweak than ModeB. I like the tool capacity (I have 20 tools now and I'm using them all, though I rarely have to change tools out but more would be nice). I like the power - it's nice to be able to hog with a 1" rougher if I want to (like on that 10" dia part I did). It's nice to have a catch-all machine that could do anything I ask of it.
But I worry about the quirks of the machine, I've heard chip flow isn't great, it requires expensive grease monthly and the door seals fail. I think it will be less reliable than the Brother. And I know Okuma charges out the ass for parts. The machine is probably a fair bit more than the Speedio up front too. It can do 5-axis, but it's so expensive that I could buy a nice used Brother 5-axis for the upgrade cost on the Okuma, so I doubt I'd ever do 5-axis on it.
I got a quote for the Speedio S1000x1 last year... just got a quote on the S700x1 this week and it's more than the 1000 was last year . The Speedio 700 is over $100k now. They are discounting it, but still - with almost no options, it's over $90k to my floor. The Okuma salesman is coming here in a few minutes to talk turkey, but although I've read numerous stories of people getting an M560-V for $95-99k, they don't seem to want to get close to that - we shall see.
I also found a Speedio S1000x1 an hour away from me with only a few hundred hours on it that's never had coolant in it and the guy wants $85k. Not sure what I could get it for... I was quoted $89k for the same machine last year, so I think his price is high... maybe $75k is more reasonable? I also found a 6-month old M560-V with 130 hours on it but they want $135k... it has a 4th axis, Rengage probe/tool probe and extended Z. Not sure what it can be bought for.
Got approved for financing today... need to make a decision in the next few days.
Like I said, I know the Speedio and M560 are very different machines, and I don't NEED the capabilities of either, and either would do what I need. But... I don't see why I would buy a Haas, Doosan, Robodrill or anything else when these machines are leaders in their classes - my thoughts anyway.
Curious what others would say. Also curious what others think of pricing. Especially curious what anyone can suggest as far as recent prices paid for a Speedio S1000x1, S700x1, Okuma M560-V or Okuma M460-VE. Or does anyone agree with my thoughts above or disagree with my pro's/con's?