Cnc copy machine?

Hey guys, maybe I’m completely out to lunch but I have seen some cnc mills that you can run manually or via cnc as well as a couple home built cnc lathes that have some basic programming for cutting threads, profiles etc. That are selectable from a menu but does anyone offer a system that can record your movements either with feedback from encoders or dro and recreate the tool paths precisely for subsequent parts?

I believe this was done in the 70's. These days why not just program for a standard CNC? It will be faster and better in every respect.

Mach 3 on hobby machines can do that, press the Teach button. I guess there might be a use for that.

I would first have to learn cad / cam. I’m looking for a system that anyone who knows how to machine manually can use instantly to make multiple parts more consistently and quickly assuming measuring time can’t be taken out. We have a cnc mill where I work but we rarely use it because the jobs don’t tend to be large enough to justify writing a program.

Think of it from the perspective of someone that can barely use a smart phone but can make anything with a dial caliper.

Look at Prototrak lathes made by Southwestern Ind. They have their limitations, but they are built from the perspective of a manual machinist learning CNC.

They use a proprietary conversational control that allows you to input individual operations without any knowledge of G-code and no extra CAD/CAM software. The same machines can also be used manually in DRO mode. I think they have a teach function like you describe, but we have never used it on ours. It's so much easier to just tell it where you want it to go. They can be bought with an indexer added on, but come stock with a quick change tool post.

They do have a "Traking" function which is handy. After you write your program you can do your first program by cranking a handle. How fast or slow you go is how fast or slow it goes, forward through the program or in reverse, so if there's an operation you're not sure of or a feature you're afraid will crash, you can sneak up on it, stop, and go back and edit the program. Or you can play with it and see what speeds and feeds work in real time (smoking inserts while your at it).

There have been several machines that have done that. On the mill side, Servo II did it pretty well with a teach program. On the lathe side, Romi had a machine that was branded as a Bridgeport that had a repeatable teach program. Don't beat me up, the last time I saw one used was several decades ago. Programming has come a long way since then.

My Trak DPM bed Mill has that learn or teach mode I have never tried to use it so I am not sure how functional it is. The Trak Bed Mill was made for guys that were manual machinist it works pretty good for some things but it is not a VMC. I have made good parts with mine but it is pretty slow.

Haas does this on the lathe, you can run cycles in interactive mode and record them one after another to create a program. A lot of the simpler lathe programming in our shop is done that way. Yes this was done in the 70's and in fact way before in the late 40's and if you read Noble's Forces of Production you see the debate between off-line programming and teach mode and the resulting impact on what skilled workers were able to do, has been going on since the very dawn of CNC machining with John Parsons vs the arrogant n00bz at MIT and the Air Force. Don't get me started.....

Sounds like you're looking for a "teach" mode. It's also worth looking at machines with conversational capability, which is like "20 questions" machine tool edition.

I suspect you'll find this on toolroom-style CNC mills lathes, like the HAAS TL and TM series, Harrison Alpha lathe, prototraks, etc. I hear Hurco also has pretty good conversational for on-machine programming. Might be worth a look.

CAM really isn't too hard to pick up though, and once you get the hang of it you can build templates and such for common operations to really speed up your workflow.

Thissideup said:

Think of it from the perspective of someone that can barely use a smart phone but can make anything with a dial caliper.

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Well, you said DRO, so I ass_u_me that you can read and work via a DRO?

If so - you can create a basic CNC program by hand by only having a sample program and a G and M code list.
It is NOT rocket science.
You doo NOT need CAM to create anything that you think that you could "teach" it via the handwheels.

I have at least 10 CNC's on the floor and I've never ran CAM in my life.


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Thissideup said:

I would first have to learn cad / cam. I’m looking for a system that anyone who knows how to machine manually can use instantly to make multiple parts more consistently and quickly assuming measuring time can’t be taken out. We have a cnc mill where I work but we rarely use it because the jobs don’t tend to be large enough to justify writing a program.

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Your problem is that nobody is experienced enough to quickly write a program. Are you really a shop full of old dogs that do not want to learn new tricks? Learning CAD has got to be the single most powerful tool I have in my mental toolbox. And if asked I could not write a single line of G code. But I drank the Mazak Cool-ade 20 years ago. I watched how quickly and easily a Mazak tech wrote a lathe program, figured I was at least as smart as he was, and purchased a VMC and a lathe with live tooling and sub spindle.
So when do I decide to make a part on the mill? If it is a piece of steel with a single hole with a +- .05 location I could use a drill press. But if it has just a single tapped hole I just use Mazatrol right on the machine.

Thissideup said:

Think of it from the perspective of someone that can barely use a smart phone but can make anything with a dial caliper.

Click to expand...

Take some time and E-X-P-A-N-D your knowledge base.

Stop being in such a hurry that all you doo is chase your tail.

Let the machine do the work.