Coolant issues...thinking of aeration

metalmadness · Jan 7, 2019

So the issue my shop is facing is pretty straightforward. We have 2 Hurcos, one VM10Ui 5ax with no chip auger, and one VM10i 3ax with a chip auger. The coolant tanks on both are like 15 or 20 gal units. The 5 axis without the auger is just fine, coolant wise. The 3ax auger is an issue because it holds and additional 15 gallons of coolant in it, as in the auger is always submerged.

Within 5 months of use it smells like "a rotten fart" (not my words, but accurate). Whereas the 5ax machine smells just fine. I wonder if the coolant in the auger is not properly circulating, causing anaerobic growth. Its literally a colony. Luckily i have a pneumatic vortex vacuum pump to clean the sumps...

It is properly balanced for our usage, Blaser Swisslube B-Cool 755. Good stuff.

My conundrum is that this is the second time in a year i have had to de-sludge my sump and clean it completely out, which wastes my time as a manager and is disgusting.

Do you think adding a small tube like a "percolator" style into the auger section would help alleviate this, or should i nix the auger altogether. Its a terrible design flaw TBH. The spillover line into the main tank is waaaaaay too high.

Thanks!

C

gustafson · Jan 7, 2019

fish tank pump works

different coolants, some rot more than others

make sure you run the thing every day

DavidScott · Jan 7, 2019

Fish tank pump and an areator stone, just a line isn't good enough. Probably won't be enough and you will need a biocide as well.

metalmadness · Jan 7, 2019

Thanks, ill look into stones and fish pumps. I have some biocide on hand.

metalmadness · Jan 7, 2019

any suggestions? I dont have a ton of space to work with in the auger.

This style?

https://www.amazon.com/Air-Bubble-Aquarium-Aerator-Hydroponics/dp/B01DMMSMUC

metalmadness · Jan 7, 2019

DavidScott said:
Fish tank pump and an areator stone, just a line isn't good enough. Probably won't be enough and you will need a biocide as well.

also tempted to grab this guy
Zebra XBUB Oxygenator™ Aerators | Coolant Consultants, Inc.

Dan from Oakland · Jan 7, 2019

You might well find an $10 fish tank pump from Petco or Walmart will solve your problem- route the hose away from the auger so it can't grab the tube. I would try this with no biocide as a start. We use them and it solved our issues- don't shut off- let it run 24/7.

Gobo · Jan 7, 2019

Is your material clean when it goes into the machine? It is amazing what those nasty microbes find to be tasty. Are you using the same way oils on your machines? Anything with a hint of sulfur is a smorgasbord for many microbes. Starve the little bastards and your coolant will last longer. Something else, I caught a dumbshit spitting chew into one of our tanks. 10 million microbes with each spit.
Skimming will also help keep the anaerobic bacteria in check. But aeration does nothing to control aerobic microbial growth.

metalmadness · Jan 7, 2019

Gobo said:
Is your material clean when it goes into the machine? It is amazing what those nasty microbes find to be tasty. Are you using the same way oils on your machines? Anything with a hint of sulfur is a smorgasbord for many microbes. Starve the little bastards and your coolant will last longer. Something else, I caught a dumbshit spitting chew into one of our tanks. 10 million microbes with each spit.
Skimming will also help keep the anaerobic bacteria in check. But aeration does nothing to control aerobic microbial growth.

Thanks for the advice...we do mostly aluminum/steel, sometimes plastics. I run the plastics dry and put a screen on the coolant inputs to prevent them from becoming floaters, and vacuum it out. Vactra No.2 ISO VG68 always, everything is pretty consistent overall. Almost all our material is pretty 'clean' from the supplier...6061-T6 extrusion being the most common
EDIT I am the only one who manages this cell in a small shop so I am pretty certain theres no piss or nasty stuff being added

DavidScott · Jan 7, 2019

metalmadness said:
also tempted to grab this guy
Zebra XBUB Oxygenator™ Aerators | Coolant Consultants, Inc.

The small Zebra looks like what I have, but I got it from Zoro or Enco for $15. I run mine and the skimmer 15 minutes every 6 hours. Get a couple extra stones when you get them, they don't last forever and don't try to blow them out with compressed air to unclog them. Coolant seems to be hard on stones so not all will last.

cosmos_275 · Jan 7, 2019

My favorite source for light bulbs has air pumps. This one has 4 outputs: 12 Volt - Air Pump with (4) Outlets - Active Aqua AAPA15L

or you could get the two output one and add a couple wyes if you think it puts out too much air.

adama · Jan 8, 2019

Only thing worth adding, try and sit the pump a good foot above tank level, prevents any risk of back siphoning if - when the pump wears out.

metalmadness · Jan 8, 2019

Thanks for all the info.

I just cleaned the sumps yesterday and refilled them so I will be ordering some aeration today.

-C

DavidScott · Jan 8, 2019

adama said:
Only thing worth adding, try and sit the pump a good foot above tank level, prevents any risk of back siphoning if - when the pump wears out.

Will the pump start sucking when it wears out? I don't see a risk of it siphoning, but I haven't had one die yet.

adama · Jan 8, 2019

I don't get it either, but i have a friend that lost a lot of very expensive tropical fish from that exact failure oh yeah and his carpet was kinda soggy too and the flat below was not happy, was a pretty large tank and he and the misses were away for the weekend. Add in the pump full of water tripping the electrics to walk into late on a Sunday night!

I can only assume that how ever the valves in the diaphragm pump bit failed made just enough suction to get things over the edge of the tank or the momentum of the liquid flooding the air line on loss of air is enough to carry it over the top and once started a suction runs till empty.

Sure would not be a great way to start a monday morning and no doubt in cali would instantly make the building into a super fund site?

metalmadness · Jan 9, 2019

adama said:
I don't get it either, but i have a friend that lost a lot of very expensive tropical fish from that exact failure oh yeah and his carpet was kinda soggy too and the flat below was not happy, was a pretty large tank and he and the misses were away for the weekend. Add in the pump full of water tripping the electrics to walk into late on a Sunday night!

I can only assume that how ever the valves in the diaphragm pump bit failed made just enough suction to get things over the edge of the tank or the momentum of the liquid flooding the air line on loss of air is enough to carry it over the top and once started a suction runs till empty.

Sure would not be a great way to start a monday morning and no doubt in cali would instantly make the building into a super fund site?

lol that sounds like fun!

garyhlucas · Jan 9, 2019

I build waste treatment plants. Anaerobic bacteria produce methane and hydrogen sulfide which is the nasty smell. Aerobic bacteria only produce CO2 so there is at worst a slightly yeasty smell. The tough part is that splashes up on to the walls of a tank can provide a place for the anaerobic bacteria to grow. So if you can flush those surfaces with aerated fluid it will help.

metalmadness · Jan 11, 2019

I ended up ordering 2 of the ZEBRA XBUB aerators...ill check back once theyve been working for awhile.

albatroopa · Dec 3, 2019

Hey, any luck with this?? i'm looking to implement the same thing in my shop, but i'm wondering if it worked for you?

repairguy923 · Dec 9, 2019

We used Blaser for awhile and had the same issue. We tried using pumps, skimmers, and even the zebra deodorizing tablets. Finally one of our operators started having some skin irritation from the coolant so we started running trials on new coolant.

We ended up going with Castrol Hysol MB50. It's semi-synthetic and really is a great coolant, and the best part no odor. We also saved alot of money switching to castrol. We've been running it for close to 1.5 years in one of our sumps with out any issue. You just have to stay on top of the tramp oil.

If you can't get rid of the stench I'd shop around for a different coolant. Most coolant companies will provide the first 55 gal drum on the house for trying their product. Some may even drain, clean and recharge the system. We ran our trial for nearly 6 months before switching.

Coolant issues...thinking of aeration

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