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Thread: Dense working

  1. #41
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    Schunk Pnumatic or even that lower cost Air Vise (which is a bit sloppy, but 1/3rd the price).

    2 parts per vise, 3 of them in the machine. M codes to clamp/unclamp. Lang/Big Kaiser fan to clear the chips. All the operator has to do is swap out the parts directly, close the door, hit cycle start (this would be an ideal application for an auto-door).

    I suspect (though hard to prove) that pallets would be non-workable. The per-part cycle is going to be so close to the part swap cycle offline that the operator will have trouble keeping up. They could probably do it under ideal conditions, but you'll have a ragged operator.

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  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobw View Post
    I've screwed myself several times also.

    Last summer I had 1400 parts, 3/8 D, about 1.7" long. That I had to do a bit of endwork on.

    9 of them in one vise. The size on the 3/8 was good, so I just plunged a 3/8" endmill into the fixed jaw.

    But But... 9 parts, you can't clamp that in a vise. Yes you can. I clamped a piece of fairly hard rubber to the moving jaw.

    Taking parts out and putting in new in was quick and easy, no screwing around with clamps, no screwing around with screwdrivers, no screwing around with pallets. No $4,000 hydraulic thingy.

    Just flip the vise handle over, and 9 parts come out, flip it back, and 9 parts are clamped.

    Just $10 of aluminum, $3 of rubber and a vise.


    Now thats an idea!! Ill propose this to engineering right away. We cast polyurethane in house and making a moving jaw with a polyurethane strip would be no big deal.

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  5. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by 13engines View Post
    You're worrying about squishing with 3 point contact in vises, what about scratching while moving parts in and out of 5C collets? To be honest, loading collets which can be slightly fussy work compared to say a slightly more accessible "drop in" loading regime, in mass thousands of times sounds horrible.
    Yes, this.

    What if the parts come in .005" over nominal? That can make fitting into collets a giant PITA, especially a collet type that has low range of motion.

    Regards.

    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by Finegrain View Post
    Yes, this.

    What if the parts come in .005" over nominal? That can make fitting into collets a giant PITA, especially a collet type that has low range of motion.

    Regards.

    Mike
    Thankfully the part id grip on has a tolerance of +0/-0.002

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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    Thankfully the part id grip on has a tolerance of +0/-0.002
    Then collets would work perfectly!

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    for a copper part with a loose tolerance you are wasting both the precision and the gripping force of a collet. if you see a high(ish) quantity steel part with tight tolerance in your future, it might be worth the investment, but for this item, it seems like putting out caviar for the ally cat!

    as has been said, the cost of a test with a custom soft jaw in a vise is minimal, so why not start there? (urethane pad on the movable jaw sounds promising).

    what alloy copper is it? have you run some quantity to test? you definitely want to dial in speeds/feeds/tool coating/lube also..

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    CDA 102 copper
    75 Rockwell F
    Free of loose slivers, water spots, oxide film, and any other chemical contamination

  10. #48
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    Sounds like a good application for thread forming

    Tom

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    Quote Originally Posted by TDegenhart View Post
    Sounds like a good application for thread forming

    Tom
    These will be form tapped for sure.

    Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

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    This setup looks like it's designed for your task. Omniturns aren't that expensive, and it will be much faster to put a bunch of blanks in the trough rather than load up and clamp a fixture.

    YouTube

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielG View Post
    This setup looks like it's designed for your task. Omniturns aren't that expensive, and it will be much faster to put a bunch of blanks in the trough rather than load up and clamp a fixture.

    YouTube
    How much is the question.

    Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    How much is the question.
    Only one way to find out

    Omniturns are <$40k I think.

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    Not ISO certified..................so it might not work for you..........................













    ......................................

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    Neat fixture. You should be ISO certified so you can get paid like you should

    This might work just fine if I couldnt find another way using a lathe/omniturn.

    I think I could use your fixture idea on a 4 sided tombstone and be way ahead.

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    If I couldn't run it in complete in a barfed lathe I'd start messing around with a Universal Robots UR3 arm and loading into a lathe. Instead of ending up with a bunch of useless fixtures at the end of the day when the job was done at least I'd have an arm for other jobs.

    Just my 2 cents.

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    My thought is we just purchased a haas ST15 with a parts catcher. Thinking I can use the omniturn type setup for the parts feeder but use a 3 gang tool holder and have the following: part feeder, carbide drill, form tap

    The lathe has an auto door so I could have it programmed to open when the magazine is empty.

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    I do agree with you there with the exception of the robot brand. We use fanucmate here over the Universal robots. I know cobots are all the rage but they are so dang expensive compared to fanucmates and way less capable.

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    It might sound crazy....

    Why couldn't you make a fixture with the max amount of drilled and reamed holes that you can nest for your part size?

    Run a large bolt or stud down the middle of it and use a Enerpac ram to tension the bolt / stud. The ram would stress the block just enough to clamp you parts.

    Assuming you had it designed in such a way to allow the necessary compression.

    All hole centers are known so programming becomes simple.

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  23. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by as9100d View Post
    Thankfully the part id grip on has a tolerance of +0/-0.002

    Oh hell then!
    Find someone with a Wire EDM and either go with Bob's suggestion of wise jaws, or you can design a quick change fixture
    that holds 20 pcs with only 2 bolts.
    Each fixture would hold 2 rows of 10 parts, at 3/8 dia that is under 5" wide.
    One fixture in the machine being mangled, while the other is being unloaded and loaded.
    For what it's worth, 20K/mo drill/tap only ... may not even worth the hassle of 2 fixtures.

    Something like this:


    fixture.jpg

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    1) David N style fixture, 20" long, 2 per side of a tombstone, 4 sides. maybe 640ish or so parts on a tombstone. Only make 1 tombstone and mix it in with other work we are doing. put it in the mori seiki nhx4000

    2) Figure out a way to automate the new lathe and let it rip.

    If I can figure out a way to make the 1st option a little more modular for different size parts, that would be best.


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