DMG Mori Experiences and Impressions

A common refrain I've heard while shopping mid-upper tier Horizontal and 5-Axis machines is that there are a lot of great options... except for DMG Mori. Deservedly or not, DMG Mori seems to have become quite the whipping boy and "common wisdom" would have you believe they are unreliable and offer poor service.

On paper, their machines and control integration seem excellent and well priced, and enough members of this forum have commented that they've had a great experience with DMG Mori that I'm starting to question that common wisdom. It can be hard to shed a poor reputation, especially one that may have been well deserved for a time.

I'd love to hear people's first or second-hand experiences with DMG Mori, especially if you actually own or have worked with a machine. I'd love to collect experiences with these machines in this thread so that I and others can make a more informed judgement about the "State of DMG Mori" in 2020.

What specific model do you own?
What year is the machine?
What has your experience with DMG Mori support and service been like, and when did you need that support and service?
If you have stories that you've heard, what's your assessment on the reliability of the story? Did that support tech actually walk in and shoot Joe in the leg when he tried to have his spindle replaced within the 3 year warranty?

Ill disagree with the common wisdom.

I had DMG mori in another state inspect a machine and they did it fast and provided tons of details. The local tech contacted me with the same info and explained all of the inspection with me via phone and gave the machine a green light to buy. so we did...

used machine is sitting waiting for me to get this shop remodeled and Ill have it rigged over. At the same time I purchased a new NHX4000 and was able to work with them on pricing, options I wanted, etc and it was all very painless same as the NLX we bought last year.

The lathe we have running 24/7 on a mostly milled part (10 live tools and 2 turning tools) that machine with redundant live tools. Works flawless. We have the same part running on mills and operators break expensive drills, leave gage pins in holes, dont change out endmills or inserts fast enough and tooling doesnt last as long.

I havent had any issues at all with the lathe and I dont plan to have issues with the mills either.

I worked in apps briefly for DMG MORI when they went to the direct model. I also own a 2019 DMU50.

I think they have two major issues:

1 - The post Ellison split has been a disaster. In some regions they held on to some good folks in service/apps, and in others it's been a revolving door. Your experience with service is likely to be entirely dependent on region.

2 - They make too many damn machines. For instance, the NLX2500 SY is the best job shop lathe on the market. It is 100% the gold standard that everybody else is aspiring for. The CTX on the other hand (especially the Italian ones) have earned their reputation as problematic machines. You will get a wide variety of experiences based on what hunk of iron (or mineral casting) happens to sit in a particular shop.

Besides the issues though, they do make some seriously good products. Their spindles are amazing, some of the control integration is great. A lot of quality-of-life improvements are apparent in their machine design. Part of what makes them a leader is also a liability though - things change frequently, and rarely have time to mature.

Based on my experiences I would absolutely buy another DMG MORI. But aren't at the top of my list for every application.

In 2018 I talked to their service department about getting info on some undocumented parameters related the the Graphic Operation Panel on my machine. There was a problem with data mis-match between the Mori U/I and the base Mitsu control under the Mori U/I. The first person I talked to acted like he knew where to get the info and said he'd call back. After a week, no response. I called in and found out he no longer worked there. Someone else tried to pick up the ball but apparently dropped it cause I never heard back from him. I called in again and was told the information could not be obtained. My read on this is that I'm too small a fish in a pretty big pond for them to spend time on.

Fair enough, I am a small fish. I finally started experimenting by changing the mystery parameters one bit at a time and cycling the power to see what effect they had on the GOP. I stumbled on to the one that fixed the data mismatch after a couple dozen or so tries.

I'm pretty certain that before they went direct, I would have had a better shot at getting the info I needed via the local Ellison service group.

FWIW, I have a 1986 Mori Seiki SL3-H that I've owned since new. It still holds tenths all day long. I can still get parts and service and support. It's made money from day one. Nothing but routine maintenance save for a board that went south just recently, 30+ years after new.

Thank you all for your thoughts and experiences!

We have 2 late model machines, both build in Pfronten.

The price tag for these 2 machines at the time of purchase why just shy of 2 Million USD.

We negotiated a price that was probably not usually going to be entertained, but we were interested in additional equipment as well, and the door for future sales was being left open.

Made the deal, took delivery 2 years ago.

Service 6/10.

Machine up time 6/10.

Part quality 9/10.

If we relied on this equipment for our lively hood it would have been devastating. Fortunately they were purchased to add capability---not because we needed it, because we wanted it.

Everyone we worked with was polite and forthcoming. Their shortcomings absolutely stem from their change in distribution model, lack of WELL educated service people, which also is systemic of their absurdly large range of machines.

Every issue is usually hours on the computer, calls to Germany that take 12 hours to respond etc.

Its also frustrating on the applications side to have 2 machines built a few miles apart BOTH with seimens controls that have nuances between them. The apps guys expect one thing to work, and it woks on one machine but not the other, etc.

Would never, ever, ever purchase another one if i had the choice. They make fantastic parts when they're on a good day. But who spends hundred of thousands to have a machine that has good days and bad days?

So what's an example of an issue? I can give tons of examples with the Haas machines I have but none with the dmg Mori




Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

as9100d said:

So what's an example of an issue? I can give tons of examples with the Haas machines I have but none with the dmg Mori

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

You have an NLX, right? Any of the legacy MORI products are very solid, but the NLX might be the most bullet-proof product in the whole lineup.

It goes back to having so many products. The Japanese built NLX is appreciably different than an NHX built in Davis, CA, and both of those are really different than the DMG products coming out of Pfronten or Seebach (or any of the more obscure European factories).

I like the AG (german) DMG MORI products a lot. I daresay I like them more than the CO (japanese) products, despite being inferior in many ways. I like how the Germans are pushing constant improvement, and often building machines on the leading edge of technology and performance. There are some costs to the constant changes though.

We run the snot out of our DMU50, and it hasn't needed any actual service in the two years we've had it. But, it has weird alarms all the time. Filter pressure issues, air pressure issues, randomly deciding it doesn't have enough Z travel to execute a program it's ran a hundred times, and other crazy crap that I've learned to consider normal for European machines (after over a decade of dealing with them). Most everything is an easy fix (for me at least), but if it was hooked up to a pallet pool it would probably be down one night a week for some BS issue.

Other issues with the German machine include brittle plastic breaking everywhere (mind you, none of it is structural). A couple panels that are literally held on with velcro. Sheet metal that rattles around and bangs into itself during roughing cuts. Chip flushing coolant inlets that clog literally less than 24 hours after pulling the sump. A $10,000 mist collector that can't keep up when hogging. The list goes on...

But, the thing was amazingly well priced for what it is. The spindle has enough power to tear the whole damn machine apart. It is extremely fast for it's class, and way more accurate than it has any business being. The bones underneath the cheap exterior are quite solid.

To expand a little on my earlier conclusion - I wouldn't hesitate to buy any of the premium Japanese products from DMG MORI. I also wouldn't hesitate to buy one of the high performance / low cost machines like the DMU50, DMU75, NHX4000, NHX5000, as long as you are aware it might come with DMG MORI issues. Where people seem to get burned is when they expect any of those machines to behave like a premium Japanese machine. And as for the legitimately premium machines from the German side of the relationship, like the duoblocks or linear machines... Well, I really like them personally, but you aren't likely to hear a positive review from anyone who has bought one in the last decade.

I'm really hoping that won't be the case with the nhx I just bought. I need to be able to run lights out with 2 horizontals.



Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

I like the NHX a lot. Is it 3rd gen or 2nd gen?

The fact that 3rd gen went to a Fanuc controller scares the crap out of me, but from what I have seen DMG MORI has been doing a great job of making things better with each iteration. NLX, NVX, NHX, even the DMU's. All the popular products have been getting a lot better with each generation.

We have been looking at getting a horizontal as well, and the NHX 4000 is at the top of my short list. I have a ton of seat time on them, and with the exception of the rotary pallet pool, it's all positive. I've heard some horror stories about lemon machines, but from what I've actually seen in person, the only people who dislike them are expecting a to get a Makino A51 for a lot less money.

I've got a new 3rd gen coming and an older non dmg "Mori" waiting for the new dmg to arrive.



Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

I’ve had a 2000 vintage DMU 50 V Millplus since 2015 and a 2000 DMC103V 840d since last year. I’ve only owned 7 other CNC machines since I started using CNC in 1999 but I have to say for me the DMG stuff been very reliable and easy to maintain so far. I’ve gotten great phone service from DMG on the DMU 50 at times from some of the old techs and never really had the need to ask anything about the DMC 103 V that I couldnt figure out (without the help of a few people on this forum). I’ve also had a 1985 Deckel FP 42nc since 2013 thats been dead reliable once I sorted it out for a few weeks.

That said I don’t know if I would buy a newer DMG machine if I could afford it. For some reason they remind me of the newer BMW motorcycles. They just look like they were designed by someone who was thinking too hard.

markp said:

They just look like they were designed by someone who was thinking too hard.

Click to expand...

My joke is always that the Japanese build the best product they can, and stop when they get to the point of diminishing returns. But the Germans start each project with a price point in mind.

"Sure, it's a great machine, but how can we make it cost 1,000,000 Euros?"

List of machines we've bought:

1. 2012 NHX4000 1st gen
2. 2014 NLX2500SY 1st gen
3. 2015 NHX6300 2nd gen
4. 2016 NHX4000-5RPP 2nd gen
5. 2019 NHX4000-21RPS 3rd gen

We traded in #1 for credit towards #4, but in hindsight should've kept it. Oh well.

We're out of space and ready to expand. Currently sitting tight to see how the real estate situation plays out over the next 6-9 months. With more space, we'll be getting another NLX2500SY right away, and another NHX4000 soon after.

Total downtime (requiring service) across all five machines over 8 years has been less than 30 days. Service lead time has ranged from same day to 2 days. Never had a major mechanical or electrical failure (knock on wood). Usually something stupid like a coolant float switch going bad or a microswitch needing adjustment.

Client here in Perris, Ca looking to sell this 2017 Japan built NHX5000 with 24 station LPP.







180 Tool ATC, 15k rpm, full 4th, 14 pallets and $40k in tool holders included, 1000 psi cts, lpp has expansion slot to add 2nd NHX5000
Looking for $600k or best offer...

BROTHERFRANK said:

Client here in Perris, Ca looking to sell this 2017 Japan built NHX5000 with 24 station LPP.

View attachment 298694

View attachment 298695

View attachment 298696

180 Tool ATC, 15k rpm, 14 pallets and $40k in tool holders included, 1000 psi cts, lpp has expansion slot to add 2nd NHX5000
Looking for $600k or best offer...

Click to expand...

That's a hell of a deal. I'll talk to my VP on Tuesday. I'm interested...

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

as9100d said:

I'm really hoping that won't be the case with the nhx I just bought. I need to be able to run lights out with 2 horizontals.



Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

A word of warning.

A few weeks/months of consistent, high output production will raise your expectations to where one interrupted night cycle can cause a lot of frustration. Shit does happen. For example, a limit switch can go out of whack, or a drum filter can tear. You'll lose some time, but you'll make it all back sooner than later.

Orange Vise said:

A word of warning.

A few weeks/months of consistent, high output production will raise your expectations to where one interrupted night cycle can cause a lot of frustration. Shit does happen. For example, a limit switch can go out of whack, or a drum filter can tear. You'll lose some time, but you'll make it all back sooner than later.

Click to expand...

Thankfully shits already happening without them so a ittle shit with them running won't be an issue.

Keeping parts running for a 2nd and 3rd shift even at a slower pace is my main goal.

I've got 7000 parts per month to do.



Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

as9100d said:

That's a hell of a deal. I'll talk to my VP on Tuesday. I'm interested...

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

Sounds good. They purchased the cell new and ran a particular job on it until recently. You can PM me after Tuesday and I can get you in touch with the owners. Thank you. Enjoy the holiday.