HAAS DM/DT MILLS and Brother Speedio Power Requirements
Close
Login to Your Account
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 44
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    12
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default HAAS DM/DT MILLS and Brother Speedio Power Requirements

    Looking for owners of preferably a Haas DM2 machine.

    Or a Haas DM1 / DT Machine.

    Current issue is there seems to be quite the confusion as to what a Haas DM2 machine requires for power.

    On the Haas website is reads (see attached):

    ELECTRICAL SPECIFICATION S.A.E METRIC
    Spindle Speed 12000 rpm 12000 rpm
    Drive System Inline Direct-Drive Inline Direct-Drive
    Spindle Power 15.0 hp 11.2 kW
    Input AC Voltage (3 Phase) - Low 220 VAC 220 VAC
    Full Load Amps (3 Phase) - Low 25 A 25 A
    Input AC Voltage (3 Phase) - High 440 VAC 440 VAC
    Full Load Amps (3 Phase) - High 13 A 13 A

    This leads me to believe the machine only needs 25 Amps to run.

    Which would make sense because the Brother Speedio S700X1 needs only 30 Amps and both machines have around a 12-15hp spindle.

    So then I go to ask Haas and they come back to me and say that:

    "They are 70 AMPS and my service manager is comfortable running them at 50 AMPS. We have done full speed demos cutting at our office at 50 Amps."

    Then to add to the craziness. I've talked to a DM1 owner (only a smaller table compared to the DM2) and he says he only uses 30 amps if that and not to worry about what Haas says.

    Any Haas owners out there that have these specific machines? If I cant power x2 Haas machines I know I can power x2 Brothers.

    Thanks everyone!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails dm2-online-specs.jpg  

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    12
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    0
    Likes (Received)
    0

    Default

    To add to that.

    I have a 200 amp panel for my house with a dedicated 100 amp breaker that I run my phase converter off of that gives me 64 Amps. I could upgrade and get a large phase converter that would give me 96 amps if needed.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    10,964
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    17898
    Likes (Received)
    5795

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BrickTactical View Post

    Any Haas owners out there that have these specific machines? If I cant power x2 Haas machines I know I can power x2 Brothers.

    Thanks everyone!
    Who really want's your business ?

    Have both salespeople commit in writing yes/no that the machine
    you want, can be run successfully with your stated power supply.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    4,670
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    95
    Likes (Received)
    1184

    Default

    The 16k RPM Speedio is rated for 4.9 kW continuous, 7.4 kW for 10 minutes, so 6.5 HP continuous and 10 HP for 10 min.

    I guess some folks would look at "momentary draw" and make some statements around that (like my 4 HP 110V shopac ). In that case, the 16k RPM Speedio has a 20.5 HP spindle. Woo hoo .

    I can tell you that I have 1000 hours on my S700X1 running off of a 30A breaker, and it has never tripped the breaker.

    Regards.

    Mike

  5. Likes eaglemike liked this post
  6. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Northern Mn
    Posts
    420
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    86
    Likes (Received)
    466

    Default

    I couldn't get Haas or their recommended phase convertor company to commit to being able to run a DM2 or DT2 off of my 100 amp panel in my shop.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    4,670
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    95
    Likes (Received)
    1184

    Default

    27k RPM spindle is 6.3 kW continuous & 8.9 kW for 10 minutes, so 8.4 HP continuous and 12 HP for 10 minutes. Probably would need to look at the curves for this spindle though as you are likely to be running bigger cutters at lower RPM's, where you may not have that much power available.

    Regards.

    Mike

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New Mexico
    Posts
    390
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    86

    Default

    It's funny because exactly one year ago, the power requirements were 195-240V (3-phase) and 80A (full load).

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Near Seattle
    Posts
    4,445
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    2543
    Likes (Received)
    1119

    Default

    Get somebody to find one of the machines, and find the power plate (which I think it legally has to have) which will say something like 60amps at 400v 3 phase. (Say.) Then be warned that that plate is supposed to be machine specific and options may change what it says from one machine to the next.

    People not being willing to assure something will work is more likely "we don't warrant anything, we don't warrant gravity is adequate to hold our device to the floor".

    Now there are some other gotchas - check your local code - one is that the full load is not supposed to be more than 80% of the rated circuit - to allow for glitches, special startup loads, and so forth. The details of this are fuzzy to me, check directly with local experts.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    poulsbo, wa, usa
    Posts
    411
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    24
    Likes (Received)
    171

    Default

    I run a vf4ss every day off a 60 amp breaker feeding a RPC and it works just fine ,,, Haas runs fine on dirty power, its not like fanuc that is picky as hell. I have read some posts about Brothers being picky about there power also.

    FYI Haas VF2 and VF4 only have a 7 1/2 HP spindle motor ,, Haas calls it a 30HP ..

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    4,670
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    95
    Likes (Received)
    1184

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by D.D.Machine View Post
    I have read some posts about Brothers being picky about there power also.
    My Speedio didn't like the 240V 3-phase coming out of my Phase Perfect and I had to buck it down. I think the spec is 200-230V +/-10%. While the +10% would seem to allow 240V, my experience before installing the buck transformer was that when running at 16k RPM, once in awhile the machine would fault with an overvoltage error.

    Regards.

    Mike

  12. Likes riabma77 liked this post
  13. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New Mexico
    Posts
    390
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    86

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Finegrain View Post
    My Speedio didn't like the 240V 3-phase coming out of my Phase Perfect and I had to buck it down. I think the spec is 200-230V +/-10%. While the +10% would seem to allow 240V, my experience before installing the buck transformer was that when running at 16k RPM, once in awhile the machine would fault with an overvoltage error.

    Regards.

    Mike
    Same here. I have 240-245V, and I put a bucking transformer to 225V before the Phase Perfect. So far it's working perfectly.

  14. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New Mexico
    Posts
    390
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    86

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by D.D.Machine View Post
    Haas runs fine on dirty power
    Yeah, in a 2 year period I replaced the spindle amplifier and Y-axis amplifier because dirty power. Or crappy quality electronic components...

  15. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    California
    Posts
    403
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    144
    Likes (Received)
    209

    Default

    The Brother 16k RPM Speedios are rated 9.5 KVA , 200-230V 3 phase. 9.5 KVA at 220V works out to 24.9 Amps. I had an ammeter on one once and it was running about 15 amps average as I recall with coolant pump and lights etc. going.

  16. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New Mexico
    Posts
    390
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    86

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BROTHERFRANK View Post
    The Brother 16k RPM Speedios are rated 9.5 KVA , 200-230V 3 phase. 9.5 KVA at 220V works out to 24.9 Amps. I had an ammeter on one once and it was running about 15 amps average as I recall with coolant pump and lights etc. going.
    The only thing I don't like about my Speedio is the tremendous amount of air used. The machine doesn't use too much electricity, but my compressor cycles way much more. My first electric bill will tell!

  17. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    California
    Posts
    403
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    144
    Likes (Received)
    209

    Default

    Speedio S700 16K rpm is rated 1.6 CFM. Check that you don't have any leaks. The spindle purge runs continuously. You may be able to reduce the flow (regulator on pneumatic panel)some to help. Also I have seen people put a solenoid valve on that line so that it only purges the spindle when running parts, shuts off automatically when the machine is sitting.

  18. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    New Mexico
    Posts
    390
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    64
    Likes (Received)
    86

    Default

    Yeah, maybe I have a leak. For sure it's using much more than 1.6 cfm...

    I have 2 separate lines (one for the machine, and another one for the air gun), with barb fittings and rubber hose.

    Do you think push-to-connect fittings and nylon tubing, will be better for leaks?

  19. #17
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Paradise, Ca
    Posts
    2,180
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    671
    Likes (Received)
    1140

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BROTHERFRANK View Post
    Speedio S700 16K rpm is rated 1.6 CFM. Check that you don't have any leaks. The spindle purge runs continuously. You may be able to reduce the flow (regulator on pneumatic panel)some to help. Also I have seen people put a solenoid valve on that line so that it only purges the spindle when running parts, shuts off automatically when the machine is sitting.
    I'm going to look in to putting a solenoid in that line as well. Can you tell us exactly which line it is on an R650?

    Mine, just sitting there powered off but with air supplied will use 10psi every 12 minutes I believe (haven't actually times it), and we have 280 gallons of air storage plus the lines. No idea how to do that math, but I wonder if it's anywhere close to 1.6 CFM?

  20. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    California
    Posts
    403
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    144
    Likes (Received)
    209

    Default

    R650 is rated 1.8 CFM. probably due to the addition of the pallet clamp system. 4th or 5th rotaries can increase air consumption too because they frequently have air purge systems. Here is a pic of the spindle purge regulator and line:

    20180810_101939.jpg

  21. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    Washington
    Posts
    4,670
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    95
    Likes (Received)
    1184

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BROTHERFRANK View Post
    Speedio S700 16K rpm is rated 1.6 CFM. Check that you don't have any leaks. The spindle purge runs continuously. You may be able to reduce the flow (regulator on pneumatic panel)some to help. Also I have seen people put a solenoid valve on that line so that it only purges the spindle when running parts, shuts off automatically when the machine is sitting.
    Yes, the problem is that the spindle purge is open 24/7 regardless of machine state. Even when depowered the spindle purge is blowing. That seems pretty wasteful to me.

    I would be keen to get details on such a solenoid. If you or any other Speedio owners have that installed, I would very much like to get details.

    Regards.

    Mike

  22. Likes countryboy1966 liked this post
  23. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Country
    UNITED STATES
    State/Province
    California
    Posts
    403
    Post Thanks / Like
    Likes (Given)
    144
    Likes (Received)
    209

    Default

    Something like this:

    McMaster-Carr

    It needs a 24V DC coil. You use one of the Mappable Outputs on the IO board. Map an output to Green (Green Light only comes on when cycle is running). Connect solenoid to the output and put in line of spindle air purge. Voila!
    Last edited by BROTHERFRANK; 08-10-2018 at 08:19 PM.


Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
2