Haas Mini Mill vs Super Mini Mill horse power questions

First question - I am in the process of buying a CNC mill and I believe the Haas mini mill series is where I am landing. The standard mini mill has a 6K RPM 7.5 HP spindle. For $10K extra I can get the Super mini mill that has a 10K RPM 15 HP spindle. However, I can spend an extra $4K on upgrading the standard mini mill's spindle to a 10K RPM spindle. Am I missing something here? Why would someone spend $40K on a Super mini mill when you can spend $30K on a standard mini mill and upgrade the spindle to 10K RPM's for just an extra $4K? It looks like the 2 machines have the same basic specs...10 tool changer, same table size, etc.

Second question - I am not sure I need a 10K RPM 15 HP spindle as currently I am only cutting aluminum. However, I do have plans to machine 4140 steel, stainless steel, and perhaps some titanium. Obviously, the more HP I have the better it is to cut these harder materials, but won't the standard mini mill also cut those materials? In addition, my shop does not have 3 phase power, only single phase, so I would need to fix that and I have no idea if I can or what it would cost to do that? Is a 10K RPM 15 HP spindle really needed to cut these harder materials?

Thanks!

more hp allows to cut faster. the difference looks to be hp and weight. 10k spindle is same motor, different gearing.

If you utilize HSM tool paths you really don't need much HP unless you plan on using larger drills.

Thanks for the information

For aluminum you want all the rpms you can get.

I think the super mini mill has twice the rapid speed if you care about that


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bisctboy said:

Thanks for the information

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Another thing to note is the torque that you would need.
Like for tapping and such.

Don't let the aluminum thing make you think you don't need hp.

While I rarely get to work with aluminum it has been my experience it is far easier to peg a spindle in aluminum than steel due to the fact in aluminum you usually run out of hp before rigidity and or cutter where steel tends to be the opposite.

A 30 hp cut with a 2" facemill in aluminum is childs play, a 30 hp cut in steel is a serious cut. IMO anyway

I'd expect you to run out of rigidity before HP most of the time.

Not to hijack the thread, but I have a question: A Super MiniMill with HSM is $43k, within about $5k of a base model Brother S500. Footprint is similar, both 10k spindles. but the Brother is going to run circles around the Haas in just about all respects (larger travels, faster tool change, 14 vs 10 tools, ect). I understand if you have very basic needs and/or a tight budget where the $30k base Mini could make sense, but why are people buying Supers? Familiarity with the control?

This isn't to bash Haas either, I'm a value buyer like probably most people and just wondering.

LOTT said:

I'd expect you to run out of rigidity before HP most of the time.

Not to hijack the thread, but I have a question: A Super MiniMill with HSM is $43k, within about $5k of a base model Brother S500. Footprint is similar, both 10k spindles. but the Brother is going to run circles around the Haas in just about all respects (larger travels, faster tool change, 14 vs 10 tools, ect). I understand if you have very basic needs and/or a tight budget where the $30k base Mini could make sense, but why are people buying Supers? Familiarity with the control?

This isn't to bash Haas either, I'm a value buyer like probably most people and just wondering.

Click to expand...

40 taper vs 30 taper is a significant difference. I love my S700, but would really like to run a 3/4" endmill sometimes. If >1/2" endmills is expected to be common for your day-to-day work, I would be leery of a 30-taper machine.

Regards.

Mike

We bought one of the first MiniMills when they were introduced at Westec in about 2000... and I’ve had one ever since. They have been fed a steady diet of aluminum, tool steel and titanium. I also have bigger and faster machines.

6000 RPM is plenty for everything except production. Once I need to build more than 5-10 of something I prefer more RPM, faster rapids and faster tool changes.

I had some production aluminum parts a couple years back, and I was going to buy a Super MM. So I programmed them both for a Super and a Standard. Then went down to the community college and pushed their Super as hard as it would go (your tax payer dollars at work). Then I came back and ran them on my Standard MM. I did not see a significant enough advantage to justify the swing in price or the cost of plumbing 3phase to that machine. I ended up running 6 months of production on my 15 year old Mini.

Now my numbers running the same production job on one of my DT machines are significant enough to sway my judgment. The higher acc/dec, tool change and RPM make a huge Delta in cycle time.


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If you get either one, get the high speed machining option. I had a minimill 2 and a super mini. Once I added the high speed machining to the MM2, it was faster running any sort of pocketing or profiling. Tool change and rapids still fast on SMM of course.
I now have a S500 and S700 (and a couple of R450) Brother machines. I've been using chip thinning/high speed machining on everything with more than minimal material removal, using 1/2 and 3/8 tools mostly. I have not missed 40 taper at all. I bought both of the above Haas new, and the Brothers as well. The Brothers have needed zero repair, other than scheduled pm. I had some sort of trouble with the Haas machines under warranty and after as well. I would only buy the Haas at this point if there was no way to buy the Brother. The Haas served me pretty well, but running the Brother stuff has been easier, and the parts are finished faster. Smaller cutters are also cheaper.

If you are going single phase, and budget limited, get the MM, and buy the HSM option.
YMMV, and I wish you luck no matter what you buy.