HAAS VF3 Tool Change Issue

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 5, 2018

• #1

I work on a HAAS VF3 2012 model (40Taper inline spindle) with a vertical 20 pocket tool carousel. The problem is that when changing tools the tool will sometimes be too low and is not correctly held in the carousel fingers. I have checked the carousel plate for being bent and it is flat within about .025". I have checked the Z-Axis tool change height offset and it ranges from about +.050 to -.015. But what I think is the problem is that just before the carousel fully moves into position the tool lowers from the spindle about .100" to .200" I have seen a video of the exact same thing happening on you tube (Haas Tool Change - YouTube) but there were no replies that explained it. Does anyone know if this lowering of the tool is normal or if it is not what causes it?

 

J

JP Machining

Stainless

Joined

Jul 15, 2006

Location

Wisconsin

• Apr 5, 2018

• #2

In that video the drawbar is releasing early almost dropping the tool. I dont know why though. The drawbar should not begin to release until the tool changer is fully grabbing the tool.

 

H

HuFlungDung

Diamond

Joined

Jan 19, 2005

Location

Canada

• Apr 5, 2018

• #3

Do you hear the tool change piston activating too early? It should activate after the carousel has moved forward and paused, not before. Maybe check, clean the limit switch on the forward stroke of the carousel support rail.

 

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 5, 2018

• #4

I do not hear any change in sound when the tool starts to lower. When it is fully seated that's when it sounds like the actual release of the tool. (by ear it seems normal)

 

H

HuFlungDung

Diamond

Joined

Jan 19, 2005

Location

Canada

• Apr 5, 2018

• #5

MKgunsmith said:

I do not hear any change in sound when the tool starts to lower. When it is fully seated that's when it sounds like the actual release of the tool. (by ear it seems normal)

Click to expand...

Perhaps a problem with the Tool Release Piston and associated limit switches. You'd have to study the manual on adjusting that so that there is a proper gap present when the tool change is completed.

 

B

bassbrawls

Aluminum

Joined

Sep 19, 2006

Location

Florence, Oregon

• Apr 5, 2018

• #6

I may be way off base, but IIRC, there is a precharge solenoid which applies low pressure air to the Tool Release Piston (TRP) after the spindle orients to move the drawbar down to contact the pullstud. I believe this was intended to reduce the "bang" when the TRP activated at full pressur to unclamp the tool. I don't remember all of the details, but if the precharge air pressure is set too high, it might cause the symptom you are seeing.

Don't quote me though, it's been a long time.

 

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 5, 2018

• #7

I did the haas TRP push out check and it passed their test. Now I am trying to decipher what limit switch to check. I am wondering about the (pre-charge regulator) but not sure what action it really controls.

 

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 5, 2018

• #8

It does sound like it could be causing it but I need to find out how to really check it (I don't think I have an air gauge around here that I can use). That may take some time.

 

B

bassbrawls

Aluminum

Joined

Sep 19, 2006

Location

Florence, Oregon

• Apr 5, 2018

• #9

Have you seen this document?
VMC - 3/4 - Taper - Inline - TRP 2 Sensor - Adjustment | Customer Resource Center

 

D Dubeau

Hot Rolled

Joined

Jan 29, 2007

Location

Ontario, Canada

• Apr 5, 2018

• #10

bassbrawls said:

I may be way off base, but IIRC, there is a precharge solenoid which applies low pressure air to the Tool Release Piston (TRP) after the spindle orients to move the drawbar down to contact the pullstud. I believe this was intended to reduce the "bang" when the TRP activated at full pressur to unclamp the tool. I don't remember all of the details, but if the precharge air pressure is set too high, it might cause the symptom you are seeing.

Don't quote me though, it's been a long time.

Click to expand...

I'll quote you lol. We just went through this exact thing with our VF3. You are bang on. I don't remember what the pressure was set to, but that's what it was.

 

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 5, 2018

• #11

I recently printed it out. The repair/maintenance group that we usually use around here keep telling us that it is normal for it to do that (lower before entering the pocket) but it never made sense to me.

 

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 5, 2018

• #12

Thanks I will check this out hopefully in the next day or on Monday and let you guys know.

 

M

MKgunsmith

Plastic

Joined

Jan 24, 2016

• Apr 6, 2018

• #13

Thank You, PROBLEM SOLVED



Problem solved, Thank you everyone for your help! We adjusted the regulator which was originally at about 16-18 PSI. First we tried to go up to 30 because of what the HAAS document stated for inline machines (which ours is) but the pressure would only reach about 24Psi and it made it worse. then we went down to 4 PSI and it worked. This was the first time I have posted on this Forum and I am very grate full for all of your input!

 

B

bassbrawls

Aluminum

Joined

Sep 19, 2006

Location

Florence, Oregon

• Apr 6, 2018

• #14

Glad you got it working. Welcome to the Forum.