A hard lesso about gravity, impatient riggers, and unfixed axis's (Dropped machine) - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    Moron rigger aside, part of me does wonder how bad it could be. Side of machine took the impact, looks like it landed in sand. I think I'd have tried to get them to write a check for what I paid for it and set the machine inside the building. It would never be a nice machine again, but a free ugly machine isn't usually that bad (had a few of them).

    Instead of buying a huge forklift I would suggest you invest in some basic rigging tools and hire a tow truck. I have moved several Haas VF machines on rollback trucks. Never actually blocked up any of them and never had anything sketchy happen.

    Forklifts just complicate many rigging jobs. I have moved many 40k lb+ machines without forklifts. Landolls and rollbacks are much simpler most of the time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Garwood View Post
    Forklifts just complicate many rigging jobs. I have moved many 40k lb+ machines without forklifts. Landolls and rollbacks are much simpler most of the time.
    I self-rigged my Monarch 28NN (~32 swing, 180" CC, about 15K lbs) off a Landoll into my shop through a dock door. Fun, and much cheaper than hiring a rigger or rent-a-forklift.

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    I don't have any issue telling them to stop and fix an issue with their technique if I can see its a problem. Also I always make sure to supervise loading and unloading, keeps them honest. They have less of a chance to pull any shady shit if you are there to call them on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Green Machine View Post
    I don't have any issue telling them to stop and fix an issue with their technique if I can see its a problem. Also I always make sure to supervise loading and unloading, keeps them honest. They have less of a chance to pull any shady shit if you are there to call them on it.
    agreed. Being 20+ years younger then these guys has me generally wanting to be respectful and just let them be the professionals they are. I think now that I turned thirty at last (ive been telling people I was thirty for the past 9 years) that I can finally not be the kid with the nice shop.

    I really do think the riggers were just in a hurry because of this being just the machine they were moving out after installing a much larger brand new machine into that place. They just didn't respect me or my machine and it cost them 7500$ but cost me much more. I dont think this is their regular operation. I also don't want to get sued. I blured out the face and logos from the photo.

    I want a giant forklift just because of my ambitions of growth and I want something to grow into. My customer projects have gotten larger and heavier then my bobcat with forks can lift easily.

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thingsthatfly2 View Post
    I really do think the riggers were just in a hurry because of this being just the machine they were moving out after installing a much larger brand new machine into that place. They just didn't respect me or my machine and it cost them 7500$ but cost me much more. I dont think this is their regular operation. I also don't want to get sued. I blured out the face and logos from the photo.
    So you basically just rolled over and let the walk over you? First thing I would have done is put out an APB against them THEN begin the negotiating starting with their left and right nut.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thingsthatfly2 View Post
    agreed. Being 20+ years younger then these guys has me generally wanting to be respectful and just let them be the professionals they are.
    It really isn't because you are younger, it is because the guy is an a hole

    Even when you are older, you tend to defer to people who are supposed to know what they are doing.

    Sure the next time you will tell an idiot rigger that on uneven ground he will do as you say, but they always make better idiots and it is hard to keep up with the next stupid thing they will do.
    Last edited by gustafson; 11-23-2020 at 02:03 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CAMasochism View Post
    So you basically just rolled over and let the walk over you? First thing I would have done is put out an APB against them THEN begin the negotiating starting with their left and right nut.
    I don't understand why people are afraid to get sued for libel and slander, you can only be found guilty of those things if you told a lie to defame someone. It isn't libel or slander if it is the truth.

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    Default A hard lesso about gravity, impatient riggers, and unfixed axis's (Dropped machine)

    What pisses me off is ALL the so-called “professionals” are always wanting to take short cuts!

    Whether it be concrete work, remodeling work, electrical work, rigging, or whatever, all these people seem to want to get the job done in the shortest amount of time possible. Which is obviously a goal, but the real goal (since they are supposed to be experienced and professional after all), is to get the job done RIGHT.

    I would just about rather chew off my own fingers than deal with a bunch of self-appointed “professionals.”

    I don’t claim to be the best CNC machinist, the fastest, or the cheapest, but I do have 35 years of experience in this shit, and when I accept a job from a customer, the parts go out the door of my shop per print, period.

    ToolCat

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    Quote Originally Posted by cnctoolcat View Post
    What pisses me off is ALL the so-called “professionals” are always wanting to take short cuts!

    Whether it be concrete work, remodeling work, electrical work, rigging, or whatever, all these people seem to want to get the job done in the shortest amount of time possible. Which is obviously a goal, but the real goal (since they are supposed to be experienced and professional after all), is to get the job done RIGHT.

    I would just about rather chew off my own fingers than deal with a bunch of self-appointed “professionals.”

    ToolCat
    Preach it Brother!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thingsthatfly2 View Post
    agreed. Being 20+ years younger then these guys has me generally wanting to be respectful and just let them be the professionals they are. I think now that I turned thirty at last (ive been telling people I was thirty for the past 9 years) that I can finally not be the kid with the nice shop.
    I feel your pain. I opened shop at 23 and had the same difficulty, with customers, vendors and employees. Took a long time to figure out that the ones who brow beat me into being quiet were the dumb arrogant careless ones.
    It's time to get over that. You are the customer, and the machine owner. Ask for what you want, and insist on getting what you are paying for.

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    Here is the thing. You will never EVER let that happen again. You WILL be at the other shop an hour+ before the riggers get there. You WILL direct and approve every action during the load and unloading. It is YOUR machine, and money paying them. If the Rigger does not allow you to have control, then you send them packing. It may cost you to send them away, but that will be less than this disaster cost you.

    If you start to get the uneasy feeling with what a rigger is doing, you stop them. You have skin in the game. They do not. It always takes longer to do things right. It takes a couple seconds for things to go really wrong.

    We learn the most from failure.

    Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob F. View Post
    Sorry to see a damaged machine
    I would be blaming myself as much as the idiot riggers if it was mine. You know the riggers will be in a hurry and cut corners, so you need to stay ahead of them.
    This means you go to the machine after you bought it and prepare it for shipping. Riggers do not need to be there. Just you and the machine, bolt on the shipping brackets and go home and relax until it shows up. Sorry, it is not the riggers fault you did not have it ready when they showed up. That in NO way excuses them but now you have no machine and work to be done....Bad all the way around.
    Agree to disagree. We moved shops some years back when I was up north. The riggers we used knew EXACTLY how to prep a machine, and if there were questions or concerns all work stopped. They took our horizontal boring mill (4'x8' table) thru 4 overhead doors without as much as a scratch. AND moved our big ass Bliss press out by tipping and shimmying out of a too small door.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1974 View Post
    Agree to disagree. We moved shops some years back when I was up north. The riggers we used knew EXACTLY how to prep a machine, and if there were questions or concerns all work stopped. They took our horizontal boring mill (4'x8' table) thru 4 overhead doors without as much as a scratch. AND moved our big ass Bliss press out by tipping and shimmying out of a too small door.
    True professionals are worth their price.

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  19. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stirling View Post
    2 words


    And my god! Those forks are almost touching. That's asking for it.
    That was my initial observation, those forks, yikes--folks with such a poor physics intuition (or perhaps gambling inclination) shouldn't be in the rigging business to begin with.

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  21. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1974 View Post
    Agree to disagree. We moved shops some years back when I was up north. The riggers we used knew EXACTLY how to prep a machine, and if there were questions or concerns all work stopped. They took our horizontal boring mill (4'x8' table) thru 4 overhead doors without as much as a scratch. AND moved our big ass Bliss press out by tipping and shimmying out of a too small door.
    I beg to differ. You are absolutely correct in that is the way things are supposed to work. The real world though is another story where a fair percentage of the time the "professional" is just a guy who may or may not be proficient at the task at hand. Until that trust has been earned I have a hard time giving it. As many others above have commented, a good rigger does not seem to be the norm. If you find a good one don't loose the contact info. In your case it sounds like you had a good rigger. Had you guys used him before?

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    Quote Originally Posted by claya View Post
    Here is the thing. You will never EVER let that happen again. You WILL be at the other shop an hour+ before the riggers get there. You WILL direct and approve every action during the load and unloading. It is YOUR machine, and money paying them. If the Rigger does not allow you to have control, then you send them packing. It may cost you to send them away, but that will be less than this disaster cost you.
    It is sad that you have to do this but even will the best rigging companies sometimes as a small account you do not get the best crew on what should be a easy move.
    Was watching but went into the office. Came out and they about to pick a cnc surface grinder by under the table.
    This one of the best know and qualified riggers in southeast Michigan with a huge reputation and prices to match.
    Why should I have to watch over the them if I pay $20,000 to move my stuff 30 miles? All of it fit on 3 trucks.
    Bob

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  24. #37
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    Not nearly as bad, but still rather annoying. Lathe was loaded on Conestoga wagon Friday in Illinois. Temperature there was around 40 degrees. Truck arrived here Sunday evening 5-6pm. Temperature was around 75 to 80 degrees. Monday, when driver opened up the covers, all the bare metal was covered in surface rust. I guess the temp difference caused the pitcher of iced tea syndrome. Was not expecting that to happen.

    dscf1024.jpgdscf1027.jpgdscf1026.jpg

    Anyway some Scotchbrite and oil fixed it.

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    I'd run the machine on its back if it wants to be that way.

    Pretty sure Gene Haas designed the chip evacuation for that angle......

  26. #39
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    Every auction I've been to, the rigging and removal were separate from the bid. You had to make your own deal with the rigger. Condition didn't change from the auctioneer since they transferred it to you in place.


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