<snip>
Good to know about Hypermill/Heidenhain, definitely leaning that way
I'll post some better info when I get some better Grob documentation.
I am not really interested in Mikron due to support. It doesn't feel like they are as committed to the US as DMG or Grob. Hermle USA is close to me.
Yup, for
many years Hypermill and Heidenhain on the Hermle platform have been working together.
@Empwoer had some some issues with Hypermill for roughing and other issues but his outfit more recently purchased a Hermle AND a Mikron at auction - I was trying to give him some hope that Hypermill and Hermle/ Heidenhain dove-tail more seamlessly (sp). (than what he had previously been experiencing.).
I believe there are further enhancements for programming i.e. what tools are in a particular machine are reflected back to the CAD/CAM station.
With Hermle in WI + Heidenhain; normally anyone that properly supports the Heidenhain control can receive proper training / formal training at one of their training centers.
The other advantage is there are fewer dots to connect with Hermle in terms of technical support. If they can't answer it locally immediately it goes to their team in Germany - good phone support + they can offer tooling / cutting advice also for particular applications or projects. Given they only make "One thing" they are well positioned to help solve or advise on specific cutting issues.
The "Peeps" in WI I have found to be extremely knowledgeable and know each model of Hermle inside out - EVERY nut and bolt just about.
There's one guy there "Pascal" (if he's still there) he grew up in Gosheim (Home of Hermle) and went through the whole training program for many years. Very knowledgeable, smart and talented and knows his onions and if there's something deeper or more tricky he can connect the dots to Germany for a "Deeper" bench if need be.
Long term Hermle have parts and support for some machines older than 15 years old.
______________________________________________
Grob vs. Hermle - first 5 axis machine + job shop work ~ Kinda depends what you want to be known for ?
I think
@dstryr has at least 3 Grob machines is using NX and is banging out complex aerospace / DOD type parts (I believe).
Complex high value parts. I'm sure he'll say Grob blows the doors off anything else.
The
Hermle C400 is slower but more "general" / universal and not bad at mold-ish work 3 to 5 axis type of work with nice finishes.
The Problem being that longer cycle times for card carrying
mold-work of the order of 8 to 15 +++ hours cycle time - thermal management is critical vs. shorter cycle time mechanical components.
The Hermle C400 -
ENTRY LEVEL MACHINE :-) has
(digital) thermal compensation at the control with temperature sensors at various points in the machine and spindle but no direct spindle chillers. I.e. no direct way to transfer and dump heat - its just has to roll with whatever thermally is going on. Maybe a bit like Okuma's "Thermo friendly " concept and similar to MAZAK (in some instances). + no scales so wear on the machine will degrade positional accuracy eventually. But other wise very accurate.
Heat build up + the environment of your shop may be an issue for ultra precise 3d contouring.
The non-entry level Hermle(s) "High Production" have all the things a production card carrying 5 axis mold level machine would want.
OTOH the synthetic granite is less reactive to thermal changes as compared to meehanite - gray cast iron , but bear in mind the trunion AND the overhead 1/2 gantry is also made of cast iron but at least the machine is very symmetric and the large diameter worm gear on the A axis can handle a fair amount of counter torque "In-cut".
______________________________________________
DMG Mori DMU 50 3rd gen really IS a substantial improvement over the second gen.
You are not limited by any options per se.
So 60 tools is an option. + scales all axes (linear and rotary) + higher rpm 20K spindle + 3 years spindle warranty (no questions asked)
IS a pretty good all rounder. Decent surface finishes and GOOD thermal management on bearings, and spindle and ball screws.
Heidenhain is or can be an option.
______________________________________________
Grob are based in Ohio, German company on US soil but integrating with Taiwanese iron - nothing wrong with that.
If you were looking to scale quickly and get really into production at scale for super complex high mix low volume (high value parts) Grob seem pretty excellent - probably a bit less hand -holding + steeper learning curve with Grob (maybe).