Lang Technovation 5 axis vise system ... interesting video

Maybe this has been talked about here already ? If not, looks interesting..what say ye ?

YouTube

I use Lang workholding, it works well. I don't have the stamping unit; for steel and Ti I cut dovetails.

What does that fine stamper device cost? (It looks quick, and easy to apply to workpieces in the "normal" size range - but I wonder how hard it is to apply for larger piece that will be held by 2 or more vises?)

I think we paid around $4-5k for the stamper. They sell a baseplate and second unit if you want to stamp across two vises, but Eric (he is the man, BTW) gave us a tip on how to do it easily on one stamper.

Here's a chunk of 4140 held on a single 125mm vise held by 3mm. We put a 2" drill through it! After this first one we got scared (one of the owners was sitting on an upside-down bucket in from of the machine with a beer waiting for the thing to fall out) and put it across two vises.

bryan_machine said:

What does that fine stamper device cost? (It looks quick, and easy to apply to workpieces in the "normal" size range - but I wonder how hard it is to apply for larger piece that will be held by 2 or more vises?)

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IIRC- the hydraulic stamping unit is about $7k. If you want to stamp bigger workpieces, you can flip the work around and stamp the other side (using the stop on the stamping unit to get everything lined up), but Lang also sells a dual stamping unit on a cart for that very purpose.

I have 4 Lang vises and I think they are incredible, but I use them only on aluminum. In softer materials, the stamping unit is not necessary as the jaw serrations will do it for you. Lang doesn't market the heck outta this fact, but you can also mill in some dovetails to get the same effect if you only occasionally need to hold harder materials. You can also dovetail if you need better access around the sides of the part.

In many ways, the Lang is like the best of both a self-centering vise and dovetail vises.

We looked at that system and while it looks like a good idea, the problem is, if you stamp the part crooked, you will hold the part crooked. When working on finish ground mold components, it just won't work out.

5 axis Fidia guy said:

We looked at that system and while it looks like a good idea, the problem is, if you stamp the part crooked, you will hold the part crooked. When working on finish ground mold components, it just won't work out.

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I'm having trouble seeing what the problem is here - yes, if you stamp the part crooked, it will be crooked in the vise. Alternatively, if you use a non-Lang vise and put the workpiece in all cockered up, it will also be screwed.

The difference is that with the Lang, you are doing the critical step offline, at a workbench, with far better ergonomics than leaning in through the door of a CNC mill.

Don't stamp the part crooked.
If you can't load your part in the stamp straight obviously you can't load it into a vise straight either.
This is like "I pucked up the first datum plane or square, what to do now".
Not a fan of the system but if you can not locate the rough or early steps you can not locate.
Bob

CarbideBob said:

Don't stamp the part crooked.
If you can't load your part in the stamp straight obviously you can't load it into a vise straight either.
This is like "I pucked up the first datum plane or square, what to do now".
Not a fan of the system but if you can not locate the rough or early steps you can not locate.
Bob

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Easier said than done, trust me. So how do you you know you just stamped the part .001 off? run an indicator with the part on the stamping unit.? LOL "crooked" to me is quite different from allot of people.

I believe that's an advantage of milling dovetails. It will always suck down to the bottom face.

While I think the Lang stuff is the best on the market for what it does (hold ridiculous parts for heavy machining on only 3mm) it is not a panacea. Another consideration I haven't seen mentioned is that when using extrusion, you run into the same issue you do with Talon grips - the rounded corner of the extrusion may need prep to square it up. Lang does specify that the sides of your stock (that are being imprinted) must be square within a certain tolerance prior to prestamping as well.

We had high-ish volume work that we put through ours and yes, every hundred parts or so you'd get one where the operator messed up and didn't stamp the part against the stop. We never had one stamped crooked, though. Keep in mind that "crooked" is relative because this system is designed to clamp your raw material and then repeat if you remove and replace it. It isn't designed for precision imprinting of a semi-finished part.

That said, we did have one part that we stamped, roughed, and then sent to heat treat, and finish machined from the original stamp marks. Everything was within a thousandth but that might not be close enough for some work. Lang says something like 20 micron return to zero but I don't think that applies after heat treat where the stamping marks may have moved. Not to mention some materials are going to move more than others. Most often we roughed, sent to heat treat, then the part got finish ground, and then we'd hold it in soft jaws or with the flat face side of the Lang jaws to finish machine. Not a ton of use for a return-to-zero stamp when you've got on-machine probing (or when it really counts, dial indicators).

Nice word.... Panacea. Had to look it up and has a useful place in many situations I talk about.

I have my father to thank for my vocabulary. Sometimes there is a word with the precise meaning you mean to convey. To me, it's like when the ten-thousandths line on the micrometer lines up EXACTLY.

Jefe, would you say I have a plethora?

mhajicek said:

Jefe, would you say I have a plethora?

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I wonder how many people actually knew where that came from. Movie was so funny. Stupid, but so funny.

YouTube

5 axis Fidia guy said:

Easier said than done, trust me. So how do you you know you just stamped the part .001 off? run an indicator with the part on the stamping unit.? LOL "crooked" to me is quite different from allot of people.

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Surely that's just not the intended use case?

I demoed this system years ago and it is clearly designed for first ops on raw stock...

Stumbled on a random video where that system was used: YouTube