Live Tooled Lathes w/Y axis. How many Live Tool Stations Minimum is Best? - Page 3
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregormarwick View Post
    I have both now, having recently installed a dmg mori NTX2500.

    Apart from cost, the only downside to a B axis millturn over a turret lathe is slower tool changes. If the milling is simple, and the quantities are high, then the Y axis lathe will outperform it, in all other cases the B axis machine wins hands down.

    Setup and programming are easier on the B axis machine, simply because there are no tool clearances to worry about and the working envelope is much less obstructed.

    IMHO, if you can swing the cost, a B axis millturn is a much better investment than a Y axis lathe for a job shop. The difference in flexibility is immeasurable. The cost is a big deal though - the repayments on ours is going to be a heavy burden for a few years.
    My caveat would be as long as the machine also has a lower turret for turning the accurate diameters.
    B axis machines can drift with temperature fast...

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by barbter View Post
    My caveat would be as long as the machine also has a lower turret for turning the accurate diameters.
    B axis machines can drift with temperature fast...
    I deliberately spec'd our machine without a lower turret, reasoning as follows:

    Our work is almost exclusively one off to very low quantity complex parts. 9 out of 10 of our jobs, setup time vastly outweighs cutting time, so I was targetting flexibility and minimal setup/changeover over and above everything else.

    Due to the nature of our work, we rarely need to worry about hitting a size more than a couple of times, so using the wear offset to bring it in every time is no big deal and cheap insurance.

    That said, some other compromises* allowed us to spec things like high resolution scales on every axis, and the machine is fully temperature controlled, including coolant lines through the X-Y casting. So far accuracy seems pretty good.

    *I wanted it prepped for a steady, and a large tool magazine, but decided to forego both of those to keep the cost down while still retaining the primary requirements like 5ax simultaneous. Lack of a steady means occasional parts will need second op'd in other machines, and the 38 tool magazine is pretty much ok for our requirements when combined with a large quantity of holders and some external storage. Steady carriage can be field retro'd according to the install tech, so not stuck if we ever really require it.

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  4. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregormarwick View Post
    I deliberately spec'd our machine without a lower turret, reasoning as follows:

    Our work is almost exclusively one off to very low quantity complex parts. 9 out of 10 of our jobs, setup time vastly outweighs cutting time, so I was targetting flexibility and minimal setup/changeover over and above everything else.

    Due to the nature of our work, we rarely need to worry about hitting a size more than a couple of times, so using the wear offset to bring it in every time is no big deal and cheap insurance.

    That said, some other compromises* allowed us to spec things like high resolution scales on every axis, and the machine is fully temperature controlled, including coolant lines through the X-Y casting. So far accuracy seems pretty good.

    *I wanted it prepped for a steady, and a large tool magazine, but decided to forego both of those to keep the cost down while still retaining the primary requirements like 5ax simultaneous. Lack of a steady means occasional parts will need second op'd in other machines, and the 38 tool magazine is pretty much ok for our requirements when combined with a large quantity of holders and some external storage. Steady carriage can be field retro'd according to the install tech, so not stuck if we ever really require it.

    What value is all that temp control on a machine bought for onsey/twosey's?
    How much heat are you puting into the screw/bed on short runs?


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    Think Snow Eh!
    Ox

  5. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ox View Post
    What value is all that temp control on a machine bought for onsey/twosey's?
    How much heat are you puting into the screw/bed on short runs?


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    The active cooling is standard equipment on that machine. Screws, all spindles, B axis torque motor, and the X-Y casting all plumbed into it.

  6. #45
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    I am still trying to figure this out on my machine as well. I have a dual spindle, 12 station turret with live tools (vdi-30 on the radial face), and a Y-axis. Mine came with quite a few tools, live and static, and I am trying to figure out a good mix of tools and style of holders.

    I agree with whoever said that live holders that only face one direction (usually main) are just silly. I have a majority of those and wish every one of them was dual. I also have some boring bar holders that are the same, again wishing every one was dual facing.

    I also have static holders for turning tools that hold 2 tools, one facing main, the other facing sub spindle. I have been making longer parts recently (5-10") and I find these holders get in the way. For example, the main turning tool can only travel about 3-4" (in Z) before the tool that faces the sub will hit the part. Or if I am using a center in the subspindle to hold a long part then the second tool interferes with the subspindle chuck or center. How do people deal with this issue with these holders? I see the benefit of multiple tools in a position but seems like they get in the way very often.

    I have actually replaced several of my dual holders with single holders so I can turn long parts on the main, thread long parts on the main, and part-off between main and sub when the spindles are in close proximity to each other. So that is three positions that have a single, main-facing tool only.

    I guess if you are only making short-ish parts on the main then these multi tool holders are nice, but I am finding them getting in my way...

    -Tom


    single-dir.jpg

    single-part.jpg

    interferes1.jpg

  7. #46
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    You don't run dual turners (dual in Z anyway) if going to the tailstock.
    THAT is how that is done...

    If you have more than one live endwerking holder that you would rather was dbl ended, then - if it was me, and I had some time - I would take it apart and figger out how to finish building it. It may take access to a machine shop to accomplish tho...

    As for your Q about pic3.
    Typically - if you set your second tool deeper into the holder by just a wee bit, it should clear a WMG/CNMG roughing application.
    If you dooing some profiling with a 35* or groover, or whatnot - then you may not git away with that.
    But typically you don't turn far enough on the sub to hit the other tool ... "typically"


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    Think Snow Eh!
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