Looking for my first CNC lathe, probably a Mazak, need advice please!

Hello Everyone!

We are an R&D and small scale production company. We design, produce and consume our own parts. Our "production" quantities are typically between 1 to 20 pieces.

We recently acquired a mid-90's Fadal VMC with Fanuc 88. We have had very much success with it and it has already paid for itself in 1 project. I'm using BobCAD for CAM, and also learning coding at the same time.

I have lots of manual lathe experience but a big fat 0 with CNC lathes. I will need a versatile and accurate machine much like my Monarch 10EE, except as long a travel as possible.

Oh, and budget is always a concern.

I have been seriously looking at some Mazak SQT 250MS with live tooling. Seems they can be had for about $50k budget. I learned from you all that I can't go wrong with a Mazak lathe.

Then I got confused with all the different models QT, QTN, ST, SL, STN.... etc. Then I got even more confused with the controls and which model has what - Maztrol, Nexus.... And then also heard some horror stories with the Nexus machines.

Would someone be kind enough to break all this down and explain it to me? Would like to be able to keep it at $50k or under. I know it's hard with live tooling but not impossible I think.

Oh, one last thing, I know I will be doing a lot of boring, long parts. So the longer the travel the better. And with boring I'm assuming that the travel will need to be at least double of the length of the part since the tool itself needs to be at least that long.


Thank you all so much!!!

Howi

part size?

Hi, ideally, the part would be:

- aluminum
- 3" to 6" in OD
- 3/8" thickness
- 6" to 24" long
- blind/threaded holes at ends (live tooling)

I know that boring a 24" long tube would not be possible with most machines in my budget, especially considering live tooling. However, I can design the part to be modular so the shorter tubes can be stacked together to form a larger tube.

Thank you all,

Howi

From older machines would be SQT 15(2in spindle bore 8 in chuck) SQT 18 (2.5 bore 10 in chuck) a little newer SQT 200 (=15) SQT250 (=18)
Control you can find both with T-Plus ( I wouldn’t go older that that even tho T32 was a good control)
All above have 12 tool turret, live tools you can find them withY axis and a sub spindle max turn length is about 18 in

QT in any number is just a 2axis lathe

QTN is the newer version comes same as SQT but with newer controls 640T ,Matrix

All the ST Slant Turn lathes are BIG.....probably bigger than you need.

Kaszub said:

From older machines would be SQT 15(2in spindle bore 8 in chuck) SQT 18 (2.5 bore 10 in chuck) a little newer SQT 200 (=15) SQT250 (=18)
Control you can find both with T-Plus ( I wouldn’t go older that that even tho T32 was a good control)
All above have 12 tool turret, live tools you can find them withY axis and a sub spindle max turn length is about 18 in

QT in any number is just a 2axis lathe

QTN is the newer version comes same as SQT but with newer controls 640T ,Matrix

All the ST Slant Turn lathes are BIG.....probably bigger than you need.

Click to expand...

Wow, that's very helpful Kaszub, thank you so much!

I have a couple of more questions:

1. Do any of these machines have steady rest? Or are they optional? I would imagine that any machines with live tooling would need a steady rest?

2. Are there any controls (besides anything older than T-plus) that I should avoid? Or are they all good?

Thank you so much again!

Howi

Never seen one with a steady rest, the ones that do have them are optional and on machines with long beds.

I've used the 640MT Pro, Nexus and Nexus-II and SMART Control on my lathes, all have been good to me.

If you have 0 CNC lathe experiance, I can't recommend Mazak enough, I wouldn't be where I am today without the ease of the Mazatrol conversational programming, and from the sounds of your application it will work really well for you too.

Thank you all so much for your kind help.

Turns out that Mazak's are so hot that they are very hard to find. I have my eyes set on a Mori Seiki SL 303A/1500, pretty big, I like it. Gonna go check it out tomorrow morning and will report back. I figure can't go wrong with either Mazak or Mori.

To fit so much machine in my budget means I will need to sacrifice live tooling. I guess I will have to figure out other ways/operations if I need holes drilled at the ends.

Will update you soon! Thank you so much again!

Howi

Howi,
I presume you will need a long travel length lathe in any case, but if you are planning to bore long pieces a lot, consider trepanning. There is a Youtube user, "userwl2850" who puts up a lot of videos of HUGE holes (both long and large OD) being trepanned in materials most of us would run away from if possible. Here is a video in which he discusses making a trepanning tool. You might still have to bore to size, but if all but a small amount has been removed already, it might make sense. In any case, his videos are pretty jaw dropping.
step by step guide to make a trepanning tool. - YouTube

best wishes!
Michael

ferretlegger said:

Howi,
I presume you will need a long travel length lathe in any case, but if you are planning to bore long pieces a lot, consider trepanning. There is a Youtube user, "userwl2850" who puts up a lot of videos of HUGE holes (both long and large OD) being trepanned in materials most of us would run away from if possible. Here is a video in which he discusses making a trepanning tool. You might still have to bore to size, but if all but a small amount has been removed already, it might make sense. In any case, his videos are pretty jaw dropping.
step by step guide to make a trepanning tool. - YouTube

best wishes!
Michael

Click to expand...

Hi Michael,

Thank you and yes! I will need to bore long pieces, which has been a huge headache for me for weeks! I've been thinking through and through on what the best process and machine is good for this task. I've never heard of trepanning I will look at the videos right away!

Thank you again!

Howi

Howi,
The video I referenced really is a visual tutorial- no words. Check out some of his other videos to see the trepanning tools in action. They appear a bit tedious to make, but if you are going to make some nearly the same bores, the number of tools might be manageable. The tool has within it the core, which for metals like titanium and inconel is a VERY expensive remnant.
If you search on Youtube for trepanning, I think there are other people putting up videos on how to do it.

Another way to get long precision holes is gundrilling. Edge Precision has some great videos about gun drills. Here is a link to one. There are several others on his channel. He is running a Mazak Integrex, and he is a true master of CNC machining.

Gun Drill FX For Titanium Parts - YouTube

Cheers,
Michael

ferretlegger said:

Howi,
The video I referenced really is a visual tutorial- no words. Check out some of his other videos to see the trepanning tools in action. They appear a bit tedious to make, but if you are going to make some nearly the same bores, the number of tools might be manageable. The tool has within it the core, which for metals like titanium and inconel is a VERY expensive remnant.
If you search on Youtube for trepanning, I think there are other people putting up videos on how to do it.

Another way to get long precision holes is gundrilling. Edge Precision has some great videos about gun drills. Here is a link to one. There are several others on his channel. He is running a Mazak Integrex, and he is a true master of CNC machining.

Gun Drill FX For Titanium Parts - YouTube

Cheers,
Michael

Click to expand...

Hello Michael,

Thank you so much again. I really appreciate the pointers. I find the trepanning process enlightening and the results simply mind-blowing. It's like a giant hole saw for metals. I will definitely be making repeated and similar bores with various length so the making of such a tool should be worth while. I'm simply speechless. Thank you so much again.

I'm going to go check out the Mori in about an hour. Very excited. Will report back soon!

Howi

Howi,
although I have never made a trepanning tool nor used one, it APPEARS that one key to using it, or a long boring bar, is to have a support coaxial with the hole being made which supports the tool right at the entry to the hole. It also appears that the trepanning tool is driven by the carriage, not the tailstock. Clearly this is a sophisticated business with nuances. If you end up thinking of going down this path, consider reaching out on this forum to experts who can shorten the learning curve.
Best wishes!
Michael

Thank you everyone for your help and time. Again I greatly appreciate it. After much consideration, I purchased a 2000 Mori yesterday:


Very happy about this purchase!

Thank you all so much again!

Howi