Thread: New clear Blaser Synergy 735 coolant?

Do yourself a favor and don't bother with Blaser. Get yourself some Castrol Hysol MB50.
I have it in my mill. I put the Blaser Synergy 735 in my new lathe. Thought I would give
it a try in my new lathe since you can see through it. It was a disaster.

Like I said in my earlier post,,,,,I no longer trust Blaser. I had issues with coolant leaving a sticky residue behind It started taking the paint off the cast iron and sticky mess on anything galvanized...It was put in a brand new lathe. Talked with the Blaser rep. They have reformulated the 735 to handle the issue with the coolant. They say the new formula will take care of the problems.
However they continue to sell the current formula of the Synergy 735. To me the fact they continue to sell the current
formula is terrible. They know it's a problem. I question a company that leaves a product on the market knowing
it has issues. I reported my problem to the Blaser rep 5/8/19. Was told I would be getting a pail of the new formula.
I have see nothing and heard nothing to this day. Just another company for me to add to the list of companies not to do business with. I have learned my lesson. If you have a coolant that works don't change. No matter what the promise.

So has anybody got any updates on using 735? It's about time to order more mix and this is tempting to try.

Thanks

I'm just starting with it today. I did an ok cleaning job on Friday then filled up with the 735. It seems pretty clear even with small amount of old still on the walls, etc. I can't say much about it yet. Being clear is definite cool factor and kinda weird. It helps with visibility, although the actual cut is still hard to see considering it's like a water hose blasting it.

What I can say off the bat is the smell is stronger than what I was using before, BC940 also by Swisslube. Not a particularly nice smell.

I imagine I'll need to check concentration more often being no visual indications. Not sure if I'll stick with it. If the smell doesn't taper off I might switch back. I'll post again after some more time with it.

Ive given up on Blaser and their BC940. The picture is a bucket that I filled last Sunday. I sent some test samples to Blaser, the oil on top is BC40/BC940 according to their analysis. They said there are trace amounts of a contaminate that I need to figure out what it is. Absolutely no suggestions, thoughts, or explanations as to why their coolant is doing this.

When I pressed my sales rep for answers/options/anything she asked if I had considered alternative solutions.

I was considering their 735, but I think I’ll try another brand now.

We gave up on the synergy. Never had any bacteria or smell issues, but the residue on parts created some plating issues. We also never got the coolant to tap well at reasonable concentrations.

Originally Posted by Fal Grunt

Ive given up on Blaser and their BC940. The picture is a bucket that I filled last Sunday. I sent some test samples to Blaser, the oil on top is BC40/BC940 according to their analysis. They said there are trace amounts of a contaminate that I need to figure out what it is. Absolutely no suggestions, thoughts, or explanations as to why their coolant is doing this.

I assume it's something in your tap water. Have you tried mixing up with distilled water as a test? I built a contraption to mix with the cheapo RO filter that has super low output. It can be done. The only issue I've had with the BC940 is it will start foaming sometimes, can't figure out why. Most of the time it's fine.

Originally Posted by CosmosK

I assume it's something in your tap water. Have you tried mixing up with distilled water as a test? I built a contraption to mix with the cheapo RO filter that has super low output. It can be done. The only issue I've had with the BC940 is it will start foaming sometimes, can't figure out why. Most of the time it's fine.

"Chloride level is high & was found to be high in the city water (see lab report No. 91045). The pH value is low. All other test results are within limits. Please discuss lab data with your Blaser Area Manager or local Blaser Distributor Sales representative.
FTIR results of brownish oil sample received compare to reference sample of BC940. There is some evidence of an unknown contaminant."

Repeated requests from my sales person for a Blaser representative to contact me and discuss these results have gone unanswered.

Switched from Quilichem to Blaser Vasco6000. No problems at first but turned to shit and regret it. I considered Synergy but they wanted me to install a di system and I wasn't really interested in doing that.

Bought two new 30 taper machined and put in "Liquid-Ice" coolant. It's clear. After a month of using it I like it. We're trying to figure out why our tool life went is going to shit on a Vasco6000 machine and switched it over to Liquid Ice. Just got it going today so it will be interesting to see the results.

Anyone else using Liquid Ice? Machine Tool Industrial Lubricants | Coolants | Liquid Ice

Originally Posted by Fal Grunt

Repeated requests from my sales person for a Blaser representative to contact me and discuss these results have gone unanswered.

I misunderstood. I thought they found contaminate in your water.

If you got bad product from them, they should refund or replace. That's BS. If you paid them with cc, tell them you're going to do a chargeback if they don't fix it, that should get their attention and you're well within your rights to do so. Also you can contact the national office if they local guys are blowing you off: Synergy 735 contact at the bottom.

Be cheaper to invest in an actual RO system then buying barrels at 15 bucks a pop.
They are really not that expensive.

Originally Posted by Crowndroyal

Be cheaper to invest in an actual RO system then buying barrels at 15 bucks a pop.
They are really not that expensive.

I was quoted $1500-$1800 for a basic system installed.

I don’t feel like $1500 is “not that expensive” and I don’t feel like I should have to spend that to make their product work. It’s the product they recommended.

Originally Posted by CosmosK

I misunderstood. I thought they found contaminate in your water.

If you got bad product from them, they should refund or replace. That's BS. If you paid them with cc, tell them you're going to do a chargeback if they don't fix it, that should get their attention and you're well within your rights to do so. Also you can contact the national office if they local guys are blowing you off: Synergy 735 contact at the bottom.

I spoke with my sales person again, and am waiting to hear if anything new is going to happen.

Meanwhile I am making calls to a couple other suppliers getting quotes.

Unfortunately I don’t buy direct from Blaser, I don’t know that I even could. So I have very little leverage with a charge back.

Originally Posted by Fal Grunt

Unfortunately I don’t buy direct from Blaser, I don’t know that I even could. So I have very little leverage with a charge back.

If you paid with a credit card and it's within 90 days, call your cc company. They should be able to get your money back. Doesn't matter who the money went to. Just tell them it was defective product. I had to do it recently with a pet cremation service. They lost the poor thing's body and jerked me around on the phone for weeks. It was over 90 days, but my bank was awesome and got my money back. They just gave me the credit and then they dealt with it.

Edit: only do this if you are sure you don't want to buy something from them again. I'd still contact the national office. They should be interested if they sent out a bad batch and would probably want to see the report you got

Originally Posted by Volitan

Im so frustrated with coolant right now I'm with you, F bombs and all.

Hangsterfers S-396 was fine but if left brown crud all over so after many hours of research I went to Qualichem 250C which didnt really have the best tool life for some of the hardened powdered metals we machine. I went to 251C which is fine and the machine stays clean but my operator complained about the smell. I don't blame her. It smells like a urinal cake. She's the best operator I've ever had and she never complains about anything so it's going.

The local people I buy from have Trim 585XT, 690XT, E206 and lots of Blaser stuff. I asked him if he could ask the people that buy the 585 if they notice any odor at all. All he said was "only one guy complained and he wasn't using it right" which doesn't help me, and kind of annoyed me because I've been buying from them for 20+ years now and I'm having an issue and could use some support from them. My operator is apparently sensitive to certain smells. I've used E206 and it's fine but I wanted the bacteria resistance of the semi synthetics. I asked him if I could get a sample of Trim or Blaser, even a small amount so I could make a pail and see what the odor is like. "No, they don't do that" he says. I just scrubbed my tanks out to switch to Qualichem and I'll do it again to make the operator happy but I sure as hell don't want to do it a third time.

Here's what I've learned from this adventure:

1. Online coolant reviews are subjective. You can't go by them.
2. Coolant salesman suck. ALL of them.


There was a third thing but I forgot what it was and don't care anymore after all this typing. Just See #2 for #3.

*edit*

Oh yeah, the #3 thing is all coolant seems to be a compromise of some sort but you have to buy in to find out exactly what it is you're just going to have to deal with. So.... See #2 again.

Haha, yes I have come to the same conclusion. It's come down to just roll the dice for me as I'm particular about odor. My latest coolant has been Trim 690XT and I prefer it over qualichem so far. The smell compared to qualichem 251c is better to me and not quite as potent. When I first smelled the pure concentrate though I was worried I was stuck again with smelly coolant for another 6 months but, it's okay when mixed. It's only $10 over the 585xt and has more lubricity so why not. You can order a 1 gallon bottle on amazon if you wanted to mix a sample to smell for your machinist. They actually got 5 gallons for about $160 which is the same as the local guys. Performance seems good so far, cheaper, runs clean, less sticky on the hands and is more translucent.

I never bothered with the 735 stuff as I don't want to risk issues with paint and sludge not to mention it costs a whole lot more. I went through the sludge life with qualichem which is the main reason I switched.

The initial smell of the 690XT goes down after a few days of running.
If it hadn't been of my foam issue in the new lathe I'd still be running it but been happy with the Fuchs stuff so far, and even less smell, almost zero.

Originally Posted by Fal Grunt

I was quoted $1500-$1800 for a basic system installed.

I don’t feel like $1500 is “not that expensive” and I don’t feel like I should have to spend that to make their product work. It’s the product they recommended.

$200 on Amazon, 55 gallon drum (let it run overnight, it'll fill a fair amount), transfer with sprayer pump from farm store or similar

It sounds like there is no coolant that is ideal..everybody has something bad to say about every single one.
Liquid tool sounds like it has mostly positive reviews.

Originally Posted by SND

The initial smell of the 690XT goes down after a few days of running.
If it hadn't been of my foam issue in the new lathe I'd still be running it but been happy with the Fuchs stuff so far, and even less smell, almost zero.

Which Fuchs product are you running? If it has even less smell I may have to try it on my next charge. The hunt may never end for me.

Originally Posted by Lazyman

Which Fuchs product are you running? If it has even less smell I may have to try it on my next charge. The hunt may never end for me.

I've been using the 7830C for a bit over a year, mainly in stainless and duplex. It's the best and lowest smell of any coolant I ever tried yet. It sometimes sit for a month in my machines and smell hasn't changed, very mild and pleasant right from the start, not like some of the harsh chemical smells of some coolants.
711C may be even better for stainless and hard stuff(more EP additives), but I haven't tried it yet and I don't know what that one smells like, I may end up trying it next year just to see.
They have good tech support so checking with them and your materials/application is probably a good idea. Someone who runs mainly Aluminium or Cu alloys might need a different type.
I've not power tapped with it, even rich 690xt with its EP stuff was crap at tapping stainless anyhow so I used cutting oil when required.

My initial goal was to keep running 690xt in the mill, I still have a full pail of it, but the batch was getting stinky 2 years in and my part time operator complained, so I flushed it all out and 7830C went in the mill too, same for bandsaw. No cross contamination issues now.

It's annoying how many brands and types of coolants are on the market, seems 5 options should be able to cover everything. The hunt for the next best thing never ends.

Feedback aftermy first few days using it:

The smell went mostly away after a couple days. It is less smelly than BC940. Parts clean up easier and machine is cleaner. Being clear is very nice. I can spot a chip hiding in some a puddle that I'm about to set a part on (soft jaws when I don't blow them out every time) Overall I like it better and might stick with it. For my size operation the added cost is not a big deal. My only gripe and concern is based on this observation: when I loosen the vise (dual station), I move the front and back jaws around a little bit as I'm setting the next parts in. What I'm finding is moving the jaws around is considerably harder. This makes me suspect it does not have the lubricity of the previous stuff. In turn, this makes me worry about tapping and maybe some other possible ways the tool grabbing would be bad. I was not tapping this week, so remains to be seen, but I was not breaking taps before. If I start breaking taps, I'll know why.

Originally Posted by mneuro

We also never got the coolant to tap well at reasonable concentrations.

What size taps and materials were problematic? What concentration?