New machine day soon, but first we have to pick the VMC - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    40 to 50 inches of 6061 a ss Haas should be your first choice. Easy to own, supported well and not a slouch. Machines that are more expensive than the Haas that you listed are also good but do you want to fumble around with fanuc or get the job done? The more expensive machines are nice and would eat 6061 alive ajd in some cases may be faster and may not be. But you will spend your resources in money, time or both.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedie View Post
    40 to 50 inches of 6061 a ss Haas should be your first choice. Easy to own, supported well and not a slouch. Machines that are more expensive than the Haas that you listed are also good but do you want to fumble around with fanuc or get the job done? The more expensive machines are nice and would eat 6061 alive ajd in some cases may be faster and may not be. But you will spend your resources in money, time or both.
    Yeah, he will surely fail if he goes Fanuc.

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  4. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garwood View Post
    Yeah, he will surely fail if he goes Fanuc.
    Yep, guaranteed fail. And that failure will still be running and supported 20 or 30 years from now.

    I pay little attention to Haas, but isn't there something like no support after their controls are not so old?

  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Generic Default View Post
    Speaking of high RPM,

    40 taper spindles that do over 10k RPM are all ceramic bearings. 10k and below spindles have steel bearings.
    I never heard that Haas uses ceramic bearings. They don't even have dual contact spindles!

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by riabma77 View Post
    I never heard that Haas uses ceramic bearings. They don't even have dual contact spindles!
    That's why I said Haas is the backup plan i.e. last choice if there are no other options.

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    Are you located in California or Fort Collins, CO (as shown in your Kickstarter)? If in Colorado, I did business with Monktons Machine Tool for a brand new Haas VF2YT in 2013 and it went OK. I did spend quite a bit of time looking at the Doosan machines (superior to Haas in every way I could tell except the control) with Rob Martin (awesome dude) from Foothills Machinery. I ended up going with the Haas because that was what I'd decided on a few years prior and the control was something the mothership didn't want to change. I've read that you can order the Doosans with a Heidenhain controller which would be sweet.

    Either way I don't see having much time with a machine you have to order, in Colorado anyway, with the Kickstarter October 2018 delivery dates looming. What machine/controller have you used in the past?

  8. #27
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    The Haas will be the easiest for a newbie to learn. How many old fanuc controls can you get parts for....all of them? Can you still get part and service for say like a 16M?

  9. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedie View Post
    .....How many old fanuc controls can you get parts for....all of them? Can you still get part and service for say like a 16M?
    Oldest I've bought anything for in the past year or so was a power supply module for a mid 80s 11M. On the shelf at TIE. IIRC, ~$1100 exchange. 16M is still a new control in my book.

  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedie View Post
    The Haas will be the easiest for a newbie to learn. How many old fanuc controls can you get parts for....all of them? Can you still get part and service for say like a 16M?
    1978 5T Buddy.

    Fanuc still supports it. Even Mastercam still supports it!

    I replaced it, but it will not give me a reason to unplug it. It just fucking works and works and works.

    Some Fanucs are suck, but most are really good for reliability and ease of use.

    All Haas's are overpriced and lack balls.

  11. #30
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    Actually the Haas machines don't lack balls, they lack rollers. And dual contact spindles. These features, along with the size and spacing of the machine components are a big deal in my opinion. I want a VMC with no overhang on the X rails.


    What do you guys think is reasonable for a good 50 inch VMC in terms of pricing?

  12. #31
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    Have you checked out the Hurco VM30i? Dual contact spindle, easy control to learn with great built in simulation. It should be under $100k with options. 50 inch X travel with a 52" table. If all you are doing is aluminum you can get a 12k spindle as well. There is a VMX that I believe has roller ways but I think you are probably $130-$150k for that machine (don't quote me on that)

  13. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyStark View Post
    Have you checked out the Hurco VM30i? Dual contact spindle, easy control to learn with great built in simulation. It should be under $100k with options. 50 inch X travel with a 52" table. If all you are doing is aluminum you can get a 12k spindle as well. There is a VMX that I believe has roller ways but I think you are probably $130-$150k for that machine (don't quote me on that)
    Haas VF-4 base price - 66k
    Hurco VM30i base price - 78k
    Hurco VMx50i base price - 134k

    Yeah I got quotes on both the 30i and 50i a while ago. Both have the same 50 inch X travel. The 30i base price is 10k more than a Haas VF4, but the 30i weighs 4,000 pounds less. Both the Haas and the Hurco charge extra for things I would consider standard features. Hurco actually charges $1,600 for rigid tapping. By the time you add up the options to make it equivalent to more expensive competitors, the Hurco costs close but weighs 9,000 pounds less. The VmX50i is the heavier built Hurco machine, same size but more rigid. 134k before CTS, probe, options.

    I think the shape of the machine column and the spacing between the ways/rails are important to how well the machine cuts. The 'best value' VMC I've found so far is the Quaser MV204, which looks to be built very heavy with a fast, powerful spindle and all of the productivity features I want. The price is lower than most similar machines but unfortunately the lead time is way too long and I doubt the support would be good, so I have to rule it out for now.

    I think I may know which machine I'm getting within the next day or two.

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  15. #33
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    I hear you on the weight, but part of that ha so to do with hurco being a generally compact machine design. When I was comparing my VM10 to a haas VF2 the VF2 has 4" more in the X travel but it's footprint is almost 2' larger in each direction. There is a lot of extra sheet metal, etc there! The Haas spec shows is the weight of the machine crated, so it's a bit padded.

    Also, for what it's worth, when I searched for VM30 price before you responded this link came up. Seems like the dealer in Cali is fairly aggressive with pricing.

    HURCO VM3i CNC Machining Center Special Offer Deal 218


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